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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member mathew101281's Avatar
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    Default Being pushed doesn't make a character popular.

    I hear a lot of people complaining about how Harley Quinn is being pushed over other characters. I even hear people saying she's only this popular because DC is pushing her at the expense of other characters. But isn't it the other way around? Doesn't a character get popular first then the marketing department (seeing that they have a hit on their hands) gets involved. I've seen way to many attempts to "push," a character go down in smoke to believe a character can be made popular just by pushing them.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    I don't particularly care if harley is pushed or what not. The character deserves the chance as any. But, the problem comes with portrayals like injustice where she was an accomplice to nuking a city. Yet, she is made into a hero. She is later pushed as feminist icon. Yeah! That's where i draw the line. She is a psychotic mass murderer. If she is portrayed to redeem herself. Great. All the power to the people striving to be better. But, don't shove harley is hero nonsense, down everyone's throat. How she is pushed is what i despise. Also, wally should have decked her before her landing the knee. It might have been actually funny.

  3. #3
    Extraordinary Member Holt's Avatar
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    Harley Quinn has been pushed for sure, but she was also already a popular character even before the New 52.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Riv86672's Avatar
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    Are we talking about characters in general, or Harley Quinn in particular?

    Because like mathew101281, I’ve seen lots of characters get pushed, only to go down.
    It is what it is, though.
    Comics are no different from any other industry.
    TV, movies, music, books, games, toys etc. any time something gains traction, there are meeting rooms full of business ppl mandating that the ‘something’ be pushed and milked for every cent they can get out of it.
    It’ll either work and make tons of cash or ppl won’t go for it and it won’t.
    In between it succeeding or failing though, it’s going to be everywhere.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by mathew101281 View Post
    I hear a lot of people complaining about how Harley Quinn is being pushed over other characters. I even hear people saying she's only this popular because DC is pushing her at the expense of other characters. But isn't it the other way around? Doesn't a character get popular first then the marketing department (seeing that they have a hit on their hands) gets involved. I've seen way to many attempts to "push," a character go down in smoke to believe a character can be made popular just by pushing them.
    Actually BOTH!! is TRUE!!!

    BUT!! I think most of the time its:

    FIRST PUSH and THEN BECOME POPULAR!!!
    Its logical!!
    A character needs to be present, have good feats, need good storylines etc. so he can become popular and then he gets even more pushed.

  6. #6
    Astonishing Member Nite-Wing's Avatar
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    Using wrestling terms for comics is dumb
    Wrestling is a carny good ole boy network that makes business decisions based what a crazy ceo or creative director wants. They don't make sound business decisions in wrestling based on what makes them the most money

    Most of you are prisoners of the moment and don't even remember anything before 2011
    Hell Harley Quinn went through the same redeption arc post crisis but I guess since she was in comic book limbo most of the time back then all of you could ignore it. Now that's she's everywhere alot of you have problems with the "redemtion arc" all of sudden.

    DC only became high on Harley Quinn after the arkham games came out and they began to see an uptick in her merchandise numbers as well variants featuring Harley selling more than others that didn't feature her.
    That's how DC the business works they only use a character when they see a demand
    If there's a lot of demand then there's more content of said character. If you don't like it you can ignore it

    Quote Originally Posted by Masterff View Post
    FIRST PUSH and THEN BECOME POPULAR!!!
    Its logical!!
    A character needs to be present, have good feats, need good storylines etc. so he can become popular and then he gets even more pushed.
    DC has never done this
    Marvel will do this no doubt but DC does not force an unpopular character down people's throats ad naseum
    Last edited by Nite-Wing; 06-04-2020 at 03:57 AM.

  7. #7
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    I think I've seen it done both ways...but done badly.

    I've seen DC try to push characters into popularity...and these characters went nowhere.

    I've seen characters that caught a lot of interest from the outset...and DC did nothing with them.

  8. #8
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    Harley like Deadpool was included in stuff for a period of time.

    Then both were given minis, team up books and limited merchandise.

    They were always around in SOMETHING-event, solo, mini, team books and so on.

    They were included in books that were popular and they did more than be BACKGROUND FODDER or a TOKEN.

    They were used in books and did not have a constant reinventing the wheel-where he or she is different in every book (see Duke Thomas)

    They also benefit from having costumes that are cosplay and marketable. Marketable as in like the Dallas Cowboys, Charlotte Hornets & Oakland raiders. Folks did not care for the teams but care for the color schemes-a simple advertising trick.


    Then you look at say John Stewart, Jaime Reyes, Vixen, Cassandra Cain, Aqualad, Jason Rusch, Young Justice kids, Cyborg, Black Lightning and Wally West himself to name a few.

    Have won fans over. Yet every excuse has been used to bury or not capitalize on that interest or some pitiful effort.

    And these are the same fans who have to sit and see others get pushes or shots that their favorite could not. Others is not limited to DC.

    That is how you get fan resentment and fans walking away.

  9. #9
    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mathew101281 View Post
    I hear a lot of people complaining about how Harley Quinn is being pushed over other characters. I even hear people saying she's only this popular because DC is pushing her at the expense of other characters. But isn't it the other way around? Doesn't a character get popular first then the marketing department (seeing that they have a hit on their hands) gets involved. I've seen way to many attempts to "push," a character go down in smoke to believe a character can be made popular just by pushing them.
    DC is a business. They like money and will get behind whatever makes then the most money.
    Characters don't get popular because they are pushed They are pushed or used a lot because there is a demand.

    Demand and Supply. That's the way business works.
    When a character that isn't in demand is shoved out there then the result is the market isn't increased popularity.
    The Result is resentment. Even fans who used to be indirect grow to resent the over exposed character.

    Too often I that nonsense claim. Not just re Harley but Batman, Damian Wayne etc. It's just mean spirited and it's usually envy behind it.

    Over exposure doesn't create popularity or make fans like something they dislike.
    Harley Quinn isn't pushed she is in demand.

  10. #10
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    Marvel will do this no doubt but DC does not force an unpopular character down people's throats ad naseum
    Hahahahaha!

  11. #11
    Astonishing Member Adekis's Avatar
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    I agree that Harley's pushed because she's popular, and not popular because she was pushed.

    I do think certain general creative movements with Harley have happened as a way to capitalize on her popularity, but frankly, they're generally good moves.
    WHEN YOU DON'T VOTE, IT ISN'T REBELLION, IT'S SURRENDER!

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adekis View Post
    I agree that Harley's pushed because she's popular, and not popular because she was pushed.

    I do think certain general creative movements with Harley have happened as a way to capitalize on her popularity, but frankly, they're generally good moves.
    Harley may have a certain popularity, but I don't think it's anywhere near where DC and WB seem to think it is. Frankly, "Harley Quinn and Some Characters Who Are Their Comic Book Characters In Name Only" didn't exactly light the place on fire, and there was no real evidence that Harley was even the "breakout character" this site and others trumpeted in Suicide Squad, which after all had a bigger draw in the person of Will Smith, plus cameos. Perhaps its time in Harley's case to maybe dial down the push a bit.

    DC doesn't seem to really know when to end their pushes. They either go on far too long, or get cut short. Primarily, IMO it seems to have to do with which characters have patrons at DC especially, which then informs WB. And of course they don't always push characters because they're popular, but because DC has various agendas to realize through those characters.
    Last edited by achilles; 06-04-2020 at 02:18 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nite-Wing View Post
    Using wrestling terms for comics is dumb
    Wrestling is a carny good ole boy network that makes business decisions based what a crazy ceo or creative director wants. They don't make sound business decisions in wrestling based on what makes them the most money

    Most of you are prisoners of the moment and don't even remember anything before 2011
    Hell Harley Quinn went through the same redeption arc post crisis but I guess since she was in comic book limbo most of the time back then all of you could ignore it. Now that's she's everywhere alot of you have problems with the "redemtion arc" all of sudden.

    DC only became high on Harley Quinn after the arkham games came out and they began to see an uptick in her merchandise numbers as well variants featuring Harley selling more than others that didn't feature her.
    That's how DC the business works they only use a character when they see a demand
    If there's a lot of demand then there's more content of said character. If you don't like it you can ignore it



    DC has never done this
    Marvel will do this no doubt but DC does not force an unpopular character down people's throats ad naseum
    Marvel has never pushed a character that wasn't popular in one way or another.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by achilles View Post
    Harley may have a certain popularity, but I don't think it's anywhere near where DC and WB seem to think it is. Frankly, "Harley Quinn and Some Characters Who Are Their Comic Book Characters In Name Only" didn't exactly light the place on fire, and there was no real evidence that Harley was even the "breakout character" this site and others trumpeted in Suicide Squad, which after all had a bigger draw in the person of Will Smith, plus cameos. Perhaps its time in Harley's case to maybe dial down the push a bit.

    DC doesn't seem to really know when to end their pushes. They either go on far too long, or get cut short. Primarily, IMO it seems to have to do with which characters have patrons at DC especially, which then informs WB. And of course they don't always push characters because they're popular, but because DC has various agendas to realize through those characters.
    There was huge surge in purchases of Harley Quinn merchandise after Suicide Squad and a lot of reviews, even ones that didn't like the movie, praised the character.

  15. #15
    Astonishing Member Adekis's Avatar
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    I think Birds of Prey was really excellent, but it's true that it didn't get the sales they were hoping for. Couldn't tell you why for sure, but I suspect it was undermarketed, and that coming out at roughly the same time as Sonic was not that ideal of a situation. But then, how was WB to know that Sonic was gonna be huge?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Marvel has never pushed a character that wasn't popular in one way or another.
    Remember when Iron Man was a d-lister? 'Cause, uh, most of the world doesn't, really, and I'm convinced that he never would have become an a-lister like he is now, if they'd never greenlit that first RDJ movie.

    I think that qualifies as a push.

    Also, I don't think "pushing" a character is remotely a bad thing.
    WHEN YOU DON'T VOTE, IT ISN'T REBELLION, IT'S SURRENDER!

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