DC Cuts Ties with Diamond

[botolo]

Alot of comic stores are stuck in the 80%, and doing this because taking a extre few minutes to fill out DC seperat form is work. And that's it their going to match Dimonds pricing and discounts but get them their books faster. Their lazy. They dont want to any work on their end to help make sales so their throwing temper tantrum. Honestly if half of them go out of business that's fine by me

I don't think this is fair to comic book stores and highly undermines the amount of work needed to manage orders. My LCS, for example, just recently shifted to the pull-box system provided by Diamond Comics. Now every customer can add titles to their pull-list, monitor current shipping, etc. and the store gets all this info from Diamond. Now I guess they will have to go back to have a different system, with orders coming from the Diamond pull-box system, and orders from DC coming from somewhere else. But if they are storing new orders on the Diamond system, how will they store DC orders for their clients? They will need to create a new system, and this will cost them money.

[Ascended]

When you look at the bookstore market and how manga still sells massive there, it stands to reason that note effort needs to be made to cater other markets outside the DM. DC is clearly not abandoning the DM but they’ve recognized the weakness in it and needed to do something. Whether this is the right move only time will tell.

It'll be interesting to see play out.

The problems with the direct market have been well known for a long time. I wouldn't be surprised if the people who oversaw the shift to hobby shops knew from the start that this wasn't a model that could be sustained indefinitely and was tied to the pre-established consumer base. The problem has always been what to do about it and how to move back into growth markets (or make the direct market a growing one), and we've seen a lot of different attempts to solve the set of problems the direct market causes.

Assuming DC is shifting away from the direct market, and assuming they actually stick the landing and start generating viable revenue through new systems....we're going to see a very interesting wave of fan wars crop up from it. We're going to be looking at a new approach to continuity and the shared universe, different takes on characters aimed at a much, much more varied demographic, and books finding audiences that would never survive the current market. We're going to have a lot of books aimed at younger readers with different viewpoints and demands crashing up against the sensibilities of us established, older readers.....it's going to be interesting.

I am not sure about this. Their main source of income are back-issues. I visited their majestic store a few months ago, and the area for new issues was fairly small and most of the titles were sold oit. In fact, what Chuck says is that stores need to shift their business model and become less dependent from the monthly comics because stuff like this can happen, or publishers might shift to digital more and more.

I think retailers would probably be wise to branch out regardless of what happens with comics. Coins, collectibles, merch, toys, whatever. As much as I'm hoping the direct market stops being the main/only place to get comics I don't want to see shops shut down, and adapting isn't impossible. I mean, look at Netflix. DC pulling out of Diamond is a blow to retailers, and the whole house of cards might be coming down (time will tell) but this can be an opportunity for shops too, if they're smart and know their demographics and play their cards right.

[Kevin Street]

I don't think this is fair to comic book stores and highly undermines the amount of work needed to manage orders. My LCS, for example, just recently shifted to the pull-box system provided by Diamond Comics. Now every customer can add titles to their pull-list, monitor current shipping, etc. and the store gets all this info from Diamond. Now I guess they will have to go back to have a different system, with orders coming from the Diamond pull-box system, and orders from DC coming from somewhere else. But if they are storing new orders on the Diamond system, how will they store DC orders for their clients? They will need to create a new system, and this will cost them money.

The owner of the store I go (who told me about DC's new demands on Saturday) has been using a database he made himself with Microsoft Access for the past twenty years. He's had to upgrade it a number of times, but apparently it's worked well for him. Now, who knows how things are supposed to work with two (or for OGNs and collections three) distributors.

[kingaliencracker]

Wow, I go out of town for 3 days and all heck breaks loose!

A few reactionary thoughts...

- I have said for a few years now that the time for comics going all-digital was approaching.

- I have also said that monthly periodicals would eventually go away.

- It will be VERY interesting to see how this affects Marvel. I know the general feeling is that Marvel is the company that drives the industry but this is definitely a game changer. No way does Diamond survive with a loss of 30% of its business in the middle of a pandemic.

- It's interesting to note that one of the items that came out of Didio's firing was his loyalty to retailers and the direct market. It sure didn't take long for that to go out the window once he was gone.

- This has been the inevitable outcome since the late 90's when Marvel failed in their own distribution and everyone went to Diamond.

I have a few more thoughts, but I'll post them a bit later.

[Gotham citizen]

Maybe I'm left behind with the news, but it seems to me that no one really know how this new DC's distribution system actually will work and if the DC will actually drop the monthly comic books or the direct market (I don't think so), or am'I wrong?

[kjn]

Maybe I'm left behind with the news, but it seems to me that no one really know how this new DC's distribution system actually will work and if the DC will actually drop the monthly comic books or the direct market (I don't think so), or am'I wrong?

Correct that things are being set up on relatively short notice here. Expect snags on the way (like the distribution to the UK/EU and Canada).

But if DC was about to leave the periodicals market, they wouldn't go to the trouble of helping a new distributor get up and started. They would just leave Diamond and the direct market.

In fact, long-term I think this might be the shot in the arm the direct market needs. If an LCS has Diamond as their sole distributor, it's not really a store, more of a franchise shop without any of the marketing benefits of a franchise.

[Cyberstrike]

Correct that things are being set up on relatively short notice here. Expect snags on the way (like the distribution to the UK/EU and Canada).

But if DC was about to leave the periodicals market, they wouldn't go to the trouble of helping a new distributor get up and started. They would just leave Diamond and the direct market.

In fact, long-term I think this might be the shot in the arm the direct market needs. If an LCS has Diamond as their sole distributor, it's not really a store, more of a franchise shop without any of the marketing benefits of a franchise.

Plus Diamond is absolutely horrible with dealing other media ordering mass market toys like new Transformers has always been hit-and-miss with the toys arriving 4-8 months late, if they arrive at all, which makes ordering them a huge pain in the ass and the fact that the LCS that I go to has to sell at the full price MRSP when you can go to stores like Wal-Mart and Target or Amazon, or online toy stores and get them at lower prices, plus the fact that Hasbro releases the same figures in multiple waves with new figures makes the store order say 12 toys in case (or box) with different numbers of each figure and if you just want say 3 figures out of case of 12 what is the store going to do with the other 9 figures especially if they're common in other major retailers that take up retail space.

[superduperman]

DC has come in second place to Marvel for 50 years. It would not surprise me if they just don't care anymore. Especially if they've now got AT&T breathing down their necks on sales.

[Ascended]

Maybe I'm left behind with the news, but it seems to me that no one really know how this new DC's distribution system actually will work and if the DC will actually drop the monthly comic books or the direct market (I don't think so), or am'I wrong?

You're right that we don't know exactly how the new distribution will work. Looks like they've hit a few speed bumps already but odds are once things get up and running it'll function basically like it does now, at least on our consumer end. Retailers will have to fill out an extra form, release dates might be different (I think Tuesdays?), but overall I don't think the average customer will really notice any change. Distribution outside the US is up in the air and things aren't looking good, but I expect DC and the new distributors to fix that before too long; I can't imagine how they managed to ignore overseas distribution concerns but I doubt they want to lose that revenue so they'll work it out.

As for DC leaving the direct market, that's just rumor and speculation. And I don't think anyone thinks DC is *leaving* the direct market, more like just getting out from under Diamond so they can focus and expand into other markets more easily, without the crap Diamond has given them in the past for trying similar measures.

If you're worried about DC comics disappearing from your LCS, you can probably relax. That's damn unlikely to happen. Even the stores claiming they'll boycott DC are probably just pissing into the wind; a LCS without DC on the shelf isn't likely to stay open for long.

[iron chimp]

DC has come in second place to Marvel for 50 years. It would not surprise me if they just don't care anymore. Especially if they've now got AT&T breathing down their necks on sales.

Its entirely their own fault tho

They were number one in trades - dc logo on a trade was a sign of quality - blew that. That logo was turned into shovelware for any old generic nothing arc.

They were number one in cinema - blew that.

If they are talking about digital - its a global media conglomerate and telecoms company without a streaming app for 6.5 billion people - that takes some doing. Marvel have had one for 10 (?) Years.

Marvel turned comic book events into billion dollar films. DC saying... but we arent making much on comics....

Its like a record company releasing 7"s and saying boo hoo our turnover is low. Yeah no shit... you test the 7"s out on the hardcore then whatever hits there you get that artist into the studio for an album and a tour. Its basic stuff which they cant get right.

[Gotham citizen]

[…]
Distribution outside the US is up in the air and things aren't looking good, but I expect DC and the new distributors to fix that before too long; I can't imagine how they managed to ignore overseas distribution concerns but I doubt they want to lose that revenue so they'll work it out.
[…]

Well, if I'm not wrong the overseas sales of the U.S. comics have often "homeopathic percentages", but it isn't a distribution issue, it is a format and writing issue: too expensive books with too few pages (the Italians comic books have 100 pages and they cost 4.4 dollars circa, but they are in black and white), too many crossover, too many events, too many low placed stories, too many changes in the status quo of the titles, too many retcons… So to improve their overseas sales, they should change their way to write the stories and find a way to make them less expensive.

[iron chimp]

You're right that we don't know exactly how the new distribution will work. Looks like they've hit a few speed bumps already but odds are once things get up and running it'll function basically like it does now, at least on our consumer end. Retailers will have to fill out an extra form, release dates might be different (I think Tuesdays?), but overall I don't think the average customer will really notice any change. Distribution outside the US is up in the air and things aren't looking good, but I expect DC and the new distributors to fix that before too long; I can't imagine how they managed to ignore overseas distribution concerns but I doubt they want to lose that revenue so they'll work it out.

As for DC leaving the direct market, that's just rumor and speculation. And I don't think anyone thinks DC is *leaving* the direct market, more like just getting out from under Diamond so they can focus and expand into other markets more easily, without the crap Diamond has given them in the past for trying similar measures.

If you're worried about DC comics disappearing from your LCS, you can probably relax. That's damn unlikely to happen. Even the stores claiming they'll boycott DC are probably just pissing into the wind; a LCS without DC on the shelf isn't likely to stay open for long.

Personally i think it will go the other way.

If retail sells 30 million dc comics a year and lets say distro per copy is 50c. After 1 year the retail sector has given a discount shop $15m. Meanwhile that discounted shop isnt paying 50c distro fees because its now the distro from the same warehouse. All they are doing is opening a box and selling straight out of it. They can undercut the shops even further than they do now.

So after one year youve got a pile of cash, increased your own profits through lower costs of being the distro, and picked up even more pull lists from the shops with your even more discounted books.

Thats unsustainable for shops and as the distro/retailer you will be putting them out of business to replace them with your own megastore retail chain with all the cash theyve given you.

As a shop every DC book you sell is money you are giving to your direct rival.

I cannot see it playing out any other way unless retailers pushes DC/Midtown/Dcbs off the shelves or cripple their distro and limp along 30% down hoping that all the other publishers fill the gap on their shelves.

Im no braniac but i just cannot see how any vertical integration is good for anyone.

[Holt]

EDITED 10char

[Ascended]

Personally i think it will go the other way.

Could be. I don't work in print, so I'm just trying to apply the business I know to the industry and it's not always a clean fit. Plus, you can never discount DC's ability to do the exact wrong thing.

But the idea of opening up a megastore retail chain.....I dunno. Now, far be it for me to assume DC will learn from their past mistakes but if that happens, it basically puts them in the same situation they're currently in; limited availability via specialized stores with limited reach. Now, maybe this giant metastore retail chain will put the effort into advertising that the typical LCS can't afford. But that doesn't solve the other problems with the model; unless you're trying to be as bloated as Wal-Mart you're not gonna have a shop in every town, retail overhead will take a substantial cut from your revenue, etc.

And this runs counter to DC's efforts to expand beyond the LCS. I don't think they've put the effort into those bookstore OGN's, seen the money they can make from that, and decided "Screw it, we're just gonna let these new guys set up their own little direct market that'll have most of the same problems we're trying to escape."

And that's not even counting the basic viability of such a store. If it were Marvel, benefiting from the hype of the MCU, then maybe I could see it. But does DC have the public profile right now to make a DC-centric retail chain profitable?

[iron chimp]

Could be. I don't work in print, so I'm just trying to apply the business I know to the industry and it's not always a clean fit. Plus, you can never discount DC's ability to do the exact wrong thing.

But the idea of opening up a megastore retail chain.....I dunno. Now, far be it for me to assume DC will learn from their past mistakes but if that happens, it basically puts them in the same situation they're currently in; limited availability via specialized stores with limited reach. Now, maybe this giant metastore retail chain will put the effort into advertising that the typical LCS can't afford. But that doesn't solve the other problems with the model; unless you're trying to be as bloated as Wal-Mart you're not gonna have a shop in every town, retail overhead will take a substantial cut from your revenue, etc.

And this runs counter to DC's efforts to expand beyond the LCS. I don't think they've put the effort into those bookstore OGN's, seen the money they can make from that, and decided "Screw it, we're just gonna let these new guys set up their own little direct market that'll have most of the same problems we're trying to escape."

And that's not even counting the basic viability of such a store. If it were Marvel, benefiting from the hype of the MCU, then maybe I could see it. But does DC have the public profile right now to make a DC-centric retail chain profitable?

I mean dcbs or midtown breaking the shops, and opening the chains and stocking DC + Diamond + whoever else. Not DC. DC is just a small part of dcbs and midtowns business.

I cant see whats stopping dcbs and midtown fighting each other either. They dont have geographical territories- if yr on the east coast you can order from west coast distro and vice versa. The only thing stopping shops doing that at the minute is the delays in shipping ordering across country.

If your some prince of darkness, get a warehouse in middle of country and pressurise yr competitor. Get shops in their territory and shrink their market until you break them.

There just seems so many opportunities to fight where there wasnt before:
midtown vs dcbs
Midtown & dcbs vs diamond
Marvel vs DC
Shops vs midtown & dcbs

And for what? Some extra chump change in the grand scheme.

Everyones done so well to stabilise after the cataclysmic crash, the rise of digital, the rise of piracy, the collapse of the newsstand - they kept it all together by stopping the fighting. And then to start corporate power games now at the very worst time... so disappointing to see.

Personally i hope im wrong and everyone can laugh at me as some hysterical buffoon.