When Did The Golden Age End And The Silver Begin?

[DrNewGod]

Denny O'Neil's passing really got me thinking. It's at least arguable that his arrival at DC was one of the signs of/influences on the passage of The Silver Age into The Bronze. That was when Green Arrow turned from a Batman-Knockoff-ala-Robin Hood I to something distinctive. That was when Green Arrow/Lantern became Hard Travelling Heroes. That was when New Look Batman gave up his Adam West influences, embraced his roots, and started his climb from the brink of cancellation to his throne at the top of DC's ranks.

We could argue a couple of other dates as the SA/BA boundary, but the changes at DC in 1968 are serviceable sign post. You'd probably be hard pressed to argue a date more than 2 years earlier or 2 years later. Thing is, we can see the change from one to the other pretty clearly.

That change from Gold to Silver is a bit messier. Many would say the SA's signpost was Barry Allen's debut. Whether we accept that or not, when The Golden Age ended is even messier. Was it the change of All-Star Comics from superheroes to westerns? If so, what came in-between?

[Electricmastro]

I suppose many say either 1949, 1954, 1956, or 1961, but I personally use 1956 as a shorthand, even though none of this is objective of course, and treat those saying “Atomic Age” as “The Golden Age: Part Two.” Perhaps it’s made more complex by not only how superheroes like Plastic Man and Phantom Lady were being published in 1954, but how genres like funny animals, romance and westerns were very much flourishing even then. Even the less gory horror/mystery/suspense titles like House of Mystery and Strange Tales were being published in the late 50s.

[Iron Maiden]

I suppose many say either 1949, 1954, 1956, or 1961, but I personally use 1956 as a shorthand, even though none of this is objective of course, and treat those saying “Atomic Age” as “The Golden Age: Part Two.” Perhaps it’s made more complex by not only superheroes like Plastic Man and Phantom Lady were being published in 1954, but how genres like funny animals, romance and westerns were very much flourishing even then. Even the less gory horror/mystery/suspense titles like House of Mystery and Strange Tales were being published in the late 50s.

You would have to push it up to 1961 as I recall from some of my readings on the era. The industry was slow coming back from the effects of Dr. Wertham's Seduction of the Innocent.

[Electricmastro]

You would have to push it up to 1961 as I recall from some of my readings on the era. The industry was slow coming back from the effects of Dr. Wertham's Seduction of the Innocent.

From what I understood, people like Wertham were attempting to prevent things like comics containing racist caricatures, female oversexualization, perversion, and bloody gore from getting into the hands of kids. Apparently, he didn’t even champion the Comics Code and censorship, but simply wanted publishers to hold themselves more responsible.

[Kuro no Shinigami]

Golden Age ended when Fawcett, Lev Gleason, Quality and EC Comics stopped publishing comic books including horror and crime comics. Or when the Comics Code Authority was formed to censor comic books.

[Electricmastro]

Golden Age ended when Fawcett, Lev Gleason, Quality and EC Comics stopped publishing comic books including horror and crime comics. Or when the Comics Code Authority was formed to censor comic books.

Lev Gleason and Quality went defunct in 1956 and EC pretty much stopped their comic books in 1955 when MAD become more magazine oriented. Fawcett is probably a little more tricky since their were apparently publishing Charlie Brown comics in the 70s.

And of course, publishers like Archie, Harvey, Dell, and Charlton were publishing comic books into the 70s as well.

[Kirby101]

The Silver Age is usually considered to start with Showcase #4, the Barry Allen Flash and the first Silver Age super hero. The FF was a response to DC's new heroes and not the start of the Silver Age.

[Electricmastro]

The Silver Age is usually considered to start with Showcase #4, the Barry Allen Flash and the first Silver Age super hero. The FF was a response to DC's new heroes and not the start of the Silver Age.

Either him or Martian Manhunter in 1955. There were quite a number of superhero launches going on in the mid 50s actually. Aside from DC, the most successful actually might have been Charlton’s Atomic Mouse, starting in 1953 and lasting 52 issues into 1963.

[Kirby101]

Though MM predates Flash, he is kind of like Hank Pym appearing before the FF.
I have always seen Showcase 4 pretty much universally accepted at the start of the SA. The Bronze Age start has always been an open question.

[Iron Maiden]

The Silver Age is usually considered to start with Showcase #4, the Barry Allen Flash and the first Silver Age super hero. The FF was a response to DC's new heroes and not the start of the Silver Age.

But those were mainly a revival or updating of characters Golden Age superheroes titles that were cancelled. The Fantastic Four were new characters for a new age in comics. You could argue that the FF was Jack bringing along some of his ideas from Challengers of the Unknown to Marvel. It was a concept that Jack Kirby did contribute to the Showcase series. But there are some significant differences also, noted below. Kirby had became persona non grata at DC for pursuing a lawsuit against them over the percentages demanded by DC editor Jack Schiff for the Sky Masters newspaper strip. So Kirby either left DC or was blacklisted, whatever you want to call it to go over to Atlas comics with Stan Lee.

Marvel was mostly a new pantheon of heroes but they did bring along golden age Sub-Mariner early on and Captain America shortly after. Spider-Man quickly followed the debut of the Fantastic Four and soon became Marvel's top seller. It was like the kid that would have been a sidekick to the adult hero was the main hero. The Fantastic Four never dealt with the secret identities and were publicly known. They to deal falling in and out of the public's favor along with super-villains. They had financial problems early on and went bankrupt. Peter Parker had to deal with the typical teen problems of the times getting his homework done, deal with the school bully Flash Thompson and so forth. They dealt with problems everyday people would have to deal with and not live in a Fortress of Solitude.

[Kirby101]

The Silver Age is no doubt defined by the Marvel heroes. Especially the FF and Spider-man. But when we talk about when it started, I have never seen an article, book or panel discussion where Showcase #4 was not considered the start.
This would be like moving away from Action #1 as the Start of the Golden Age. Were there other comics before, yes, but it really isn't debated.

[Mister Mets]

But those were mainly a revival or updating of characters Golden Age superheroes titles that were cancelled. The Fantastic Four were new characters for a new age in comics. You could argue that the FF was Jack bringing along some of his ideas from Challengers of the Unknown to Marvel. It was a concept that Jack Kirby did contribute to the Showcase series. But there are some significant differences also, noted below. Kirby had became persona non grata at DC for pursuing a lawsuit against them over the percentages demanded by DC editor Jack Schiff for the Sky Masters newspaper strip. So Kirby either left DC or was blacklisted, whatever you want to call it to go over to Atlas comics with Stan Lee.

Marvel was mostly a new pantheon of heroes but they did bring along golden age Sub-Mariner early on and Captain America shortly after. Spider-Man quickly followed the debut of the Fantastic Four and soon became Marvel's top seller. It was like the kid that would have been a sidekick to the adult hero was the main hero. The Fantastic Four never dealt with the secret identities and were publicly known. They to deal falling in and out of the public's favor along with super-villains. They had financial problems early on and went bankrupt. Peter Parker had to deal with the typical teen problems of the times getting his homework done, deal with the school bully Flash Thompson and so forth. They dealt with problems everyday people would have to deal with and not live in a Fortress of Solitude.

But one of the elements of the silver age was the new versions of golden age DC heroes. That's why Showcase #4 mattered. It created a new DC continuity. It also coincided with new directions for Superman, as Mort Weisinger took over as editor of the line. It led to the formation of the Justice League of America, a title whose success led Lee & Kirby to come up with the Fantastic Four.

One problem with viewing the debut of the Fantastic Four as the beginning of the silver age is that it turns DC's role in the silver age primarily one of trying to copy Marvel.

As a side note, this thread got me to the rabbit hole of looking up discussions about when the silver age Batman debuted.

https://therealbatmanchronologyproje.../thesilverage/

[Iron Maiden]

Most authorities, for lack of a better term, consider the publication of the Fantastic Four #1 ground zero for the Silver Age. The title really hits its stride around issue #40 or so, particularly with the cosmic saga that introduces Galactus and the Silver Surfer. There was this explosion of creativity spurred on by Jack Kirby's co-plotting and creating new characters like the Inhumans, Black Panther, The Watcher, The Kree (Ronan the Accuser debuts in FF #65). It's my recollection that Marvel really was first in having multi-issue arcs at a time when most plotted as "done in one".

[DrNewGod]

Most authorities, for lack of a better term, consider the publication of the Fantastic Four #1 ground zero for the Silver Age. The title really hits its stride around issue #40 or so, particularly with the cosmic saga that introduces Galactus and the Silver Surfer. There was this explosion of creativity spurred on by Jack Kirby's co-plotting and creating new characters like the Inhumans, Black Panther, The Watcher, The Kree (Ronan the Accuser debuts in FF #65). It's my recollection that Marvel really was first in having multi-issue arcs at a time when most plotted as "done in one".

A lot of the FF's story-telling innovations were copied from Kirby's 1950s DC work on Challengers Of The Unknown. Further, both Flash and Green Lantern were doing a simpler form of the soap operetic story telling that would become Marvel's trademark before there was ever a Justice League, let alone an FF. What Lee and Kirby unquestionably innovated at Marvel was the interpersonal conflict among superheroes, and (as you point out) the extended, multi-issue arc.

So I'd suggest the beginning of the Silver Age is still a bit fuzzy, as is the end of the Golden.

[Iron Maiden]

A lot of the FF's story-telling innovations were copied from Kirby's 1950s DC work on Challengers Of The Unknown. Further, both Flash and Green Lantern were doing a simpler form of the soap operetic story telling that would become Marvel's trademark before there was ever a Justice League, let alone an FF. What Lee and Kirby unquestionably innovated at Marvel was the interpersonal conflict among superheroes, and (as you point out) the extended, multi-issue arc.

So I'd suggest the beginning of the Silver Age is still a bit fuzzy, as is the end of the Golden.

Yes, you can see some advocate for the much later date since DC really didn't innovate all that much. My memory of DC comics of the 1960s are some pretty silly comics, particularly with Super-Man and Lois Lane with a proliferation of "Imaginary Tales" Batman hadn't become their top title that he is now for DC. Some years later I had come across some DC comics that my cousin had and found them childish even for someone as young as I was. I think when Neal Adams came along things really started to roll with Batman. But as I said, the more important innovations came along with Marvel. DC had to adjust to them when Marvel started gaining on them in sales (and would eventually overtake them) Again, I have to bring up things like the intro of the Black Panther in the Fantastic Four, or Sue and Reed getting married, followed by the birth of Franklin. You had real life type of events that stuck...not Lois Lane imagining she was married to Superman