Well, this is disappointing...

[iron chimp]

Precisely.....Unless some surprising information comes out, there are no victims in this scenario. The hyperbole is mindblowing.

And has taken the focus away from cameron stewart...

[Hol]

You mean he didn't walk around saying "I wrote Trees, on your knees" and they were helpless before his power?

Infantilizing women does them no service.

Conflating I dated adults that were younger than me with grooming underage girls is a pretty terrible thing to do and says a lot about the people doing it.

Very good point.

I think it's funny that in the articles I read they kept bringing up the age difference. Like an older man dating a younger woman is a bad thing. They are both consenting adults.

[phantom1592]

So...advocating for the Devil here...

Did Ellis and Stewart lie about their age to the women they dated?
From what I gathered they willingly and knowingly went on a date(s) with a much older guy...Are the (poor) personal choices/decisions (ultimately unfortunate) by these women...women/adults...not to be taken into consideration, in these circumstances?

Where is personal accountability for your own actions and decisions?

As for Mr. Stewart...

Stewart's interactions with a 16 yr old is nasty and inexcusable...no ifs, ands, or but about that...and he should have known better.
But...
Where are the parents of the 16 yr old, Ms. Mai? And why did they allow her to go on dates with a 32 year-old man?
Did she not tell anyone that she was having suggestive email conversations with a 32 year old? If not...why keep it a secret? Didn't she herself know that what they were doing was socially unacceptable? And if she knew that, why go on multiple dates?

A 19 yr old is considered an adult...able to make his/her own choices freely. Unless the report left it out, I don't think any of them were forced into going on the dates with these men.
Barring any accounts and/or evidence of criminal conduct (drugs, rape, porn, coercion) which none of these articles have mentioned or alluded to...and without hearing the Men's side of the story, then the only "crime" here is consenting adults making very poor choices and decisions.

From the reports I've heard.... apparently 16 is considered a legal consenting adult too in Canada where it happened. I think a lot of things can be said about cultures that think 16 is an adult... but Canada is Canada. At what point does 'respecting other countries cultures' become a thing?

Until I hear more that goes beyond 'culturally creepy in the United States', and actually becomes something 'criminal or illegal' this whole thing feels like a non-story to me.

From what I've heard so far... Nothing was illegal. Nobody was 'underage'. Sounds like 'flirting' and a single date... And even if heaven forbid it was somewhere that 16 is underage... nothing even physical or sexual reported. Hanging out with a someone and having dinner or a going to a movie may seem like a 'date' to one party and not the other... but it wouldn't be 'illegal' in any case. I really need some actual DETAILS before i'm willing to crucify these people.

I have no idea what these 'grooming' accusations are even talking about. This sounds like nothing. Age differences are weirdly accepted most of the time... and with these girls "Your old enough to be her father" and "She's half your age" aren't even true. 12-13 year gaps don't feel like much when you see 45 year olds dating 30 year olds... or 60's dating 45's....

[iron chimp]

I think the test for cameron stewart is, no matter what the law says, would you let yr 14 or 15 year old daughter text him or chat with him online. My answer is absolutely not from what i know.

[lalalei2001]

"In a notice to retailers shared on social media by retailer Ryan Higgins, DC announced that the Ellis-written story in the Death Metal tie-in will be replaced by another story written by former Batwoman writer Marguerite Bennett and illustrated by The Wrong Earth artist Jamal Igle."

https://www.comicsbeat.com/warren-el...story-removed/

https://twitter.com/RyanHigginsRyan/...25604967690241

[AJpyro]

Was the person Ellis was dating a mentor/mentee thing? And was she above 21 when they dated? If so, I'm really not sure what else to go on?

[Nite-Wing]

Ellis' behavior is still pretty messed up but not cancelled level unless more comes out.
I mean seems like he has a fetish for young goth girls and I suppose according to their different accounts he was manipulating them or misrepresenting what he wanted from them to get sex

Stewart is a straight up case of grooming which is creepy no need to be texting underage fans no matter how much they may like your work.

Funny and sad how so much of this was accepted and went on for so long

[married guy]

"In a notice to retailers shared on social media by retailer Ryan Higgins, DC announced that the Ellis-written story in the Death Metal tie-in will be replaced by another story written by former Batwoman writer Marguerite Bennett and illustrated by The Wrong Earth artist Jamal Igle."

https://www.comicsbeat.com/warren-el...story-removed/

https://twitter.com/RyanHigginsRyan/...25604967690241

I do love Jamal Ingle's work....

[Bored at 3:00AM]

The fact that Ellis's behavior isn't illegal does not mean he wasn't a colossal douchebag to all these young women. If Ellis loses out on future employment opportunities as a result of his own shabby behavior, I can't say I'm going to feel too bad about that. No one has the right to a job in the art or entertainment business. Thousands of talented writers and artists no longer get gigs because they're outrageous pricks, just ask John Byrne or Ethan Van Scriver.

Is that fair? No, but life has never been, nor will it ever be, fair. I'm sure plenty of stories written by Ellis have pointed that out.

[Restingvoice]

I think the test for cameron stewart is, no matter what the law says, would you let yr 14 or 15 year old daughter text him or chat with him online. My answer is absolutely not from what i know.

Same. This isn't about legality, but whether it's appropriate or not. It's clearly not.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Guys, I understand your desire not to jump the gun and trying to give Ellis the benefit of the doubt here, but there are now dozens of young women all saying the same thing about what he was doing. Again, nothing illegal, but it was certainly not admirable behavior. The sheer volume of the women involved also belies Ellis's claims that he simply didn't understand that these girls were interested in talking with him because he was a prominent comics creator, as does the fact that many of them claim that he was the one instigating the sexual overtures, not the other way around.

There's really no getting around Ellis being a prick here. Look, I've been a teacher for almost 20 years now. I've taught girls from the ages of 6 to 25 and I can state unequivocally that any adult male with a shred of conscience knows that girls in the teens and early 20s are too easily manipulated by charismatic older men and only a scumbag would do so.

Ellis will get no sympathy from me.

[iron chimp]

Guys, I understand your desire not to jump the gun and trying to give Ellis the benefit of the doubt here, but there are now dozens of young women all saying the same thing about what he was doing. Again, nothing illegal, but it was certainly not admirable behavior. The sheer volume of the women involved also belies Ellis's claims that he simply didn't understand that these girls were interested in talking with him because he was a prominent comics creator, as does the fact that many of them claim that he was the one instigating the sexual overtures, not the other way around.

There's really no getting around Ellis being a prick here. Look, I've been a teacher for almost 20 years now. I've taught girls from the ages of 6 to 25 and I can state unequivocally that any adult male with a shred of conscience knows that girls in the teens and early 20s are too easily manipulated by charismatic older men and only a scumbag would do so.

Ellis will get no sympathy from me.

Im sorry but thats a gross mistatement to say girls in the teens and mid 20s are easily manipulated.

Ive lived with 18 year old girls as a student who'd go out to nightclubs to pick up middle aged bankers, empty their wallets for gifts and jewellery and move on to next one.

Ive worked with a girl who played middle aged millionaires off each other until she got what she wanted (plastic surgery, marriage, a child, and a divorce was her achieved goal)

I have female friends who married people 20 years older and are happily married.

Ive seen middle aged men hit on girls in bars and get laughed in their face.

I used to know a girl whose mum went to uk as an 18 year old to hang around cambridge university to see who she could snag as a husband to give her lifestyle she wanted.

I used to know a female professor of childrens studies who.left her disabled child to live with teenage male gimps.

I
So your statement is not an unequivocal statement at all. As a teacher for sure one needs unequivocal beliefs on the matter because society has agreed its a crime to have affairs with students in many places. But there isnt a universal moral judgement one can place on human sexuality because its wildly contradictory and what is right for one person is entirely wrong for another.

You need to get to know your students better. When i was a student (and this was very expensive institution) my fellow students were Ecstacy dealers, escorts, strippers, rent boys, married to a man 15 years older, heroin users. How you think all your students get the money to pay to show up for school?

[Ra-El]

Ellis behaviour sucks, but for what I understand he didn't forced, or assaulted anyone and everyone involved was an adult, so... Not my business, not DC business and unless something really criminal comes up I will continue enjoying his work.

[skyvolt2000]

There's really no getting around Ellis being a prick here. Look, I've been a teacher for almost 20 years now. I've taught girls from the ages of 6 to 25 and I can state unequivocally that any adult male with a shred of conscience knows that girls in the teens and early 20s are too easily manipulated by charismatic older men and only a scumbag would do so.

Ellis will get no sympathy from me.

Like Iron Chimp said you might need to observe your kids a bit more.

Over 25 year old woman in a relationship with UNDER 18 boy and they have a kid.
Under 18 year old bragging about sleeping with women old enough to be his granny.
Under 17 year old male doing ADULT ENTERTAINMENT stuff. Yet still attended High School EVERYDAY.
Girls working in Adult Entertainment clubs and knowing MALE stuff by name because guess who goes sees them.

Guess who does NOT have an issue with it. ALL those kids PARENTS.

There is a reason there is an industry built around this.

There is a reason some thing there should be no issue because this mess was NORMAL. Because they found folks who has no issues with it for so long. Same with the Blue Shield that some cops hide behind.

Now because in ALL reality this behavior can cost a company MONEY-everyone wants to act like they have morals now.

I am going to ask this question-does no find it FUNNY so many companies are tossing guys out in less than 24-48 hours of all these accusations?

That tells me some of these companies are just waiting to let guys go.

[Bored at 3:00AM]

Im sorry but thats a gross mistatement to say girls in the teens and mid 20s are easily manipulated.

Ive lived with 18 year old girls as a student who'd go out to nightclubs to pick up middle aged bankers, empty their wallets for gifts and jewellery and move on to next one.

Ive worked with a girl who played middle aged millionaires off each other until she got what she wanted (plastic surgery, marriage, a child, and a divorce was her achieved goal)

I have female friends who married people 20 years older and are happily married.

Ive seen middle aged men hit on girls in bars and get laughed in their face.

I used to know a girl whose mum went to uk as an 18 year old to hang around cambridge university to see who she could snag as a husband to give her lifestyle she wanted.

I used to know a female professor of childrens studies who.left her disabled child to live with teenage male gimps.

I
So your statement is not an unequivocal statement at all. As a teacher for sure one needs unequivocal beliefs on the matter because society has agreed its a crime to have affairs with students in many places. But there isnt a universal moral judgement one can place on human sexuality because its wildly contradictory and what is right for one person is entirely wrong for another.

You need to get to know your students better. When i was a student (and this was very expensive institution) my fellow students were Ecstacy dealers, escorts, strippers, rent boys, married to a man 15 years older, heroin users. How you think all your students get the money to pay to show up for school?

I think you have completely missed the point of what I was saying and are making a lot of assumptions about my students and myself that are pretty strange, but let's just stick to the main point here. No one is saying young girls are innocent little angels that don't make terrible life choices. No one is saying a younger woman and an older man can't have a real romantic connection, either. However, that isn't what Ellis has been accused of here.

This is not just a handful of cases of jilted lovers and ex-girlfriends upset that Ellis unceremoniously dumped them. This is an older man using his position of power within the industry to get laid with dozens of young women who thought he was honestly interested in helping them.

Again, this certainly does not rise to the level of scumbaggery that Cameron Stewart has been accused of, but it doesn't make Ellis any less of a douchebag for engaging in this kind of behavior, which even Ellis has acknowledged.