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Thread: A Robin movie

  1. #1
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Default A Robin movie

    If we could ever get a robin movie going,which robins would you want? Okay we all know Dick would be first but how would the movie start?

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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    If we could ever get a robin movie going,which robins would you want? Okay we all know Dick would be first but how would the movie start?
    Here’s some proposals:

    Straight adaptations -

    Robin Year One by Scott Beatty and Chuck Dixon - Dick Grayson focused, using the elder Shrike as an evil counterpart to Batman for Dick, and using Boone as Dick’s same sage rival. Maybe you repackage the story a bit in the line of Karate Kid/Cobra Kai in terms of dynamics.

    Robin Vol. One By Chuck Dixon - The first ever Robin miniseries honestly has a pretty brisk and well developed cinematic plot. Just update King Snake to be driven from Hong Kong by legal issues instead of by the turn over of the island. I’d also maybe have Dick join Tim, and establish a multiple Robin dynamic.

    Twists on familiar ideas -

    Robins - Tim Drake is still a young but experienced Robin, with a partnership with the first Robin as Nightwing. But when Batman seems to die, their mourning is interrupted by the arrival of Red Hood and Damian under the command of Talia, as Tim the detective must uncover just how real their stories are, while Dick takes up the mantle he never thought he’d have. Jason would be an antagonist for most of the film, and serve as the primary foil to Dick as an older Robin, while Tim and Damian’s conflict filled relationship would grow to grudging understanding of each other, before eventually turning on Talia as the real villain. Throw in Stephanie as Tim’s girlfriend who winds howled bonding with Damian as the understanding but badass babysitter he needs.
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    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Personally I don't see a Robin movie working, I mean short of a complete auteured film where it's more about the creative vision of a talented filmmaker making the film work more than the property itself. It seems, from my perspective, most people see Robin as the most definitive second banana of second bananas in the pop culture lexicon. I could see a Teen Titans movie working as a stealth Robin movie. I'm just talking live action tho. Animated I can see a direct to video or straight to streaming animated Robin film working, maybe even a smaller theatrical run.
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    Extraordinary Member dietrich's Avatar
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    We Are Robin with Duke and the kids has the most potential.
    I would leave out all the replacement Robins and just have Dick the original guest keeping the focus on Duke and the WAR kids

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    I think there's a few ways you could spin it, honestly.

    You could do Dick Grayson: Year One and introduce the first Robin. You've got some great stuff to work with; a circus setting (or something similar, depending on the year the story is set), mobsters, a little "police procedural" in the mix, a young man haunted by the loss of his loved ones who rises up greater than ever, and of course a balling (if basic) rags to riches tale. Dick's origin is a classic.....but we've seen a lot of variations on this kind of narrative before. Dick could totally carry his own film franchise, but as Nightwing moreso than Robin, so I'd rather see a Batman movie that introduces Dick, instead of a Robin movie featuring Batman. Use a Batman film to bring in Dick, then spin him into his own films as Nightwing.

    Damian: Year One. I honestly think this has a little more cinematic potential than Dick's origin story. You've got some really interesting topics here; a direct commentary on child soldiers, the blurred line between hero and villain, and Damian is a much more morally ambiguous character than Dick (or even Jason) so you've got plenty of chances here to catch the audience off guard and surprise them....and maybe even make them think a little bit.

    We Are Robin. A bunch of kids getting together under a single banner and fighting for the change they want to see in the world? In 2020? It's basically "superhero meets protester." There's risk to that; you'd get a lot of negative press right out of the gate. In this, WAR isn't too dissimilar from the Joker movie, and with a good marketing team the negative press could be used to generate even more hype. The movie itself would have to be quality and able to withstand the criticism, but handled with a little care and you'd have a winner on your hands. As an added bonus, WAR stands on its own; you don't need so much as a cameo from Batman, you just have to establish that "Batman and Robin" are known heroes in Gotham. Oh, and the main protagonist is black, which again, could work very nicely with current events despite carrying some risk. With the right people behind it, We Are Robin could be a massive hit, far bigger than either Dick or Damian.....but if WB screwed it up, it'd be a spectacular failure.

    Obviously I disagree with lemonpeace on this one (sorry man). In a world where Ant-Man, the Guardians of the Galaxy, and friggin *Aquaman* are successful big hits, a Robin film is more than fair game. If we can have gods damn tv shows about the gods damn butler and the cop, we can have a movie about Robin.
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    I would love a Tim movie where Batman is already established Dick is now Nightwing, Jason has passed, and now Tim needs to step up.

    We can have cameos from Batman, Nightwing, flashbacks with Jason, Oracle, and Step (who can be introduced as Tim's classmate or girlfriend).

    It can really build out the BatFam in one go - if done correctly

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    The thing is Robin is problematic. There's a reason lots of creatives [Burton.Miller,Moore,Synder and many others ] have a problem with Robin.

    Batman endangering a kid in his care is wrong
    Batman endangering another person's kid without their knowledge is doubly wrong
    Batman needing some kid to keep him from crossing the line undermines the character and is too much to put on a kid/teen.

    The whole concept raises too many questions. In the 40's it might have been okay. Today it's not something a hero or any well meaning sane adult would do.

    The Batman from All Star Batman and Robin he might do that but he was super crazy.

    kids like Cass -pretty much a meta and Damian - already a solider take away a little from the ethical questions but that's still child endangerment.

    WAR stands on it's own another reason why I find it more workable
    Last edited by dietrich; 06-19-2020 at 07:12 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    The thing is Robin is problematic. There's a reason lots of creatives [Burton.Miller,Moore,Synder and many others ] have a problem with Robin.

    Batman endangering a kid in his care is wrong
    Batman endangering another person's kid without their knowledge is doubly wrong
    Batman needing some kid to keep him from crossing the line undermines the character and is too much to put on a kid/teen.

    The whole concept raises too many questions. In the 40's it might have been okay. Today it's not something a hero or any well meaning sane adult would do.

    The Batman from All Star Batman and Robin he might do that but he was super crazy
    The modern day concept of Robin is dead
    Batman doesn't need a child to hold his hand or insanely craft his sanity onto

    All that exists is the nice partner archetype "Batman and Robin"
    Unless they age up Robin a la the Schumaker movies or like in the arkham games the concept will just not work

    And since the majority of fans absolutely hate the idea of an "older" Robin who is more of an actual partner to Bruce and not just a child second banana its likely never going to happen

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    Audiences all over the world were willing to roll with Tony Stark drafting a 15 year-old Spider-Man into the Avengers and leaving an army of drones in his 16-year old hands.

    I think a mid-teens Robin, who gets trainings scenes when he’s still just 13 or 14 before he takes the field at 15 is easily feasible even without the near-meta skills of Cass or Damian being raised as an assassin.

    The trick? Tell the story from Robin’s perspective, and use some of the later writing ideas where *he* chooses to take to the field *against* Batman’s initial objections.

    Sidekicks are inherently as much of an escapist concept as a walking tree that know 4 words, a trash talking raccoon, and Kansas farmboys who can fly at Mach 5 and tank a nuclear blast. The rub, as with those examples, is you have to have a smart approach to it that makes the right emotional arguments to get the concept past the audience’s “smell test.”

    Have Dick Grayson be a kid at 12 who’s clearly already starting down a very Bruce-Wayne-to-Batman path, and is running away from his foster care and guardianship each night trying to seek out Zucco and others. Have Bruce/Batman take notice, and start out trying to keep him away from everything, and when even he can’t quite succeed, training him to defend himself and educating him on how stupid his headstrong tactics are, all trying to get him to see reason and avoid getting himself killed. Have Dick take the education, but notice that Batman takes unnecessary hits and risks because he’s a loner.

    Make the film’s emotional throughline be that Bruce can’t stop Dick from risking his life and going out there, then justify Batman benefitting from back-up; I’d even go so far as to make it so that Batman intentionally tries to limit Dick to just being a “spotter” who hangs back and provides him intel, and the have an inevitably beleaguered Batman get saved by smart, sneaky attacks by a 15 year old Robin.

    And before anyone tries to offer up any complaints about Batman needing backup, that’s easily resolved by increasing the odds.

    The trick is not to make him 100% feasible. The trick is to make him feasible enough.
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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    I would love a Tim movie where Batman is already established Dick is now Nightwing, Jason has passed, and now Tim needs to step up.

    We can have cameos from Batman, Nightwing, flashbacks with Jason, Oracle, and Step (who can be introduced as Tim's classmate or girlfriend).

    It can really build out the BatFam in one go - if done correctly
    I was thinking this exact idea. Tim is the Robin I would do a solo movie for.

    If I wanted to do a Dick movie ... ok it would be Robin, but for comic fans, it would be a Nightwing movie. It would be the story of Robin when he decides to leave Batman's side and go out on his own.
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    Quote Originally Posted by godisawesome View Post
    Audiences all over the world were willing to roll with Tony Stark drafting a 15 year-old Spider-Man into the Avengers and leaving an army of drones in his 16-year old hands.
    Good point; it's all in execution.

    It would not work in a Snyderverse movie, but a MCU hyper-stylized version hell yes it would.

    What kid doesn't want to become a hero?

    *Also Spider-Verse, Miles is literally a child and fought mobsters that killed Peter in cold blood*

    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    I was thinking this exact idea. Tim is the Robin I would do a solo movie for.

    If I wanted to do a Dick movie ... ok it would be Robin, but for comic fans, it would be a Nightwing movie. It would be the story of Robin when he decides to leave Batman's side and go out on his own.
    Exactly, it's kinda crazy how easily a Robin movie can be a jumping off point for the Batfam

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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    Good point; it's all in execution.

    It would not work in a Snyderverse movie, but a MCU hyper-stylized version hell yes it would.

    What kid doesn't want to become a hero?

    *Also Spider-Verse, Miles is literally a child and fought mobsters that killed Peter in cold blood*



    Exactly, it's kinda crazy how easily a Robin movie can be a jumping off point for the Batfam
    Actually, I’d argue that the only thing that would keep Robin from the “Snyderverse” would be whether or not Snyder wanted to. His Batman throws grown men like rag dolls from the Arkham games, drives a suped-up Hotwheel of a Batmobile that tears through anything it wants, wears an Iron Man suit with glowing eyes to fight Superman, and dodges attacks from Doomsday While in his regular outfit... all while existing in a world where his backstory already involved a Robin. And that world also includes the full Justice League.

    Snyder’s Batman is already hyper-stylized, fantastic, and in an MCU-type of world - it’s just a morose version of it with more dry one-liners than flat out quips. I think his and Ayer’s declaration that the dead Robin is Dick Grayson and their apathy toward having established and used that for anything in their two movies more just means they didn’t want to use a Robin themselves, even though they’re both capable of doing it.

    The fact that Snyder seemed to reject any future Robin-based stories is probably more related to him being a DKR fan than anything else; Carrie Kelly is more of a contrasting foil than a real reconstruction of the Robin idea, and Snyder probably regards the sidekick/partner idea as hokey... even while he has Lex Luthor bouncing off the walls trying to out-ham Hackman.
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    If not Dick Grayson, I'll echo the sentiments of a Tim Drake Robin movie. And like has already been mentioned, IM recruited a 15-year-old to fight in a battle against a a super solider, a super-powered assassin, a SHIELD agent IM had previously described as a 'master assassin,' a woman the UN held responsible for the accidental death of dozens of people, and other super powered beings. A 15-17-year-old wouldn't be so problematic when you keep these things in mind.

    Plus, Arrow already kind of did this when Roy became Arsenal and Thea became Speedy. They were both, what 17-18 when they first donned their costumes? And no one really raised an eyebrow when that happened. Viewers really seemed to embrace the idea.
    His current approval rating is 34%, meaning 34% of Americans are still morons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dietrich View Post
    The thing is Robin is problematic. There's a reason lots of creatives [Burton.Miller,Moore,Synder and many others ] have a problem with Robin.

    Batman endangering a kid in his care is wrong
    Batman endangering another person's kid without their knowledge is doubly wrong
    Batman needing some kid to keep him from crossing the line undermines the character and is too much to put on a kid/teen.
    As others have pointed out; audiences have already shown they are more than willing to roll with teen sidekicks and heroes.

    I agree that this was a concern at one point. Back when the superhero movie was far more limited as a genre, a teen Robin would've been problematic. But that was then; today people would be fine with it, assuming the film was done even halfass decently.

    You're right that Bruce endangering children is wrong. But that's not a barrier, it's a topic to explore and an opportunity to take advantage of.
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    Quote Originally Posted by godisawesome View Post
    Audiences all over the world were willing to roll with Tony Stark drafting a 15 year-old Spider-Man into the Avengers and leaving an army of drones in his 16-year old hands.

    I think a mid-teens Robin, who gets trainings scenes when he’s still just 13 or 14 before he takes the field at 15 is easily feasible even without the near-meta skills of Cass or Damian being raised as an assassin.

    The trick? Tell the story from Robin’s perspective, and use some of the later writing ideas where *he* chooses to take to the field *against* Batman’s initial objections.

    Sidekicks are inherently as much of an escapist concept as a walking tree that know 4 words, a trash talking raccoon, and Kansas farmboys who can fly at Mach 5 and tank a nuclear blast. The rub, as with those examples, is you have to have a smart approach to it that makes the right emotional arguments to get the concept past the audience’s “smell test.”

    Have Dick Grayson be a kid at 12 who’s clearly already starting down a very Bruce-Wayne-to-Batman path, and is running away from his foster care and guardianship each night trying to seek out Zucco and others. Have Bruce/Batman take notice, and start out trying to keep him away from everything, and when even he can’t quite succeed, training him to defend himself and educating him on how stupid his headstrong tactics are, all trying to get him to see reason and avoid getting himself killed. Have Dick take the education, but notice that Batman takes unnecessary hits and risks because he’s a loner.

    Make the film’s emotional throughline be that Bruce can’t stop Dick from risking his life and going out there, then justify Batman benefitting from back-up; I’d even go so far as to make it so that Batman intentionally tries to limit Dick to just being a “spotter” who hangs back and provides him intel, and the have an inevitably beleaguered Batman get saved by smart, sneaky attacks by a 15 year old Robin.

    And before anyone tries to offer up any complaints about Batman needing backup, that’s easily resolved by increasing the odds.

    The trick is not to make him 100% feasible. The trick is to make him feasible enough.
    There's a world of difference between Spider-man at 15 being a fantastical super powered character who is like 20 times stronger than regular humans with precognition and web shooters vs Robin a 13-15 year old boy/girl who essentially got taught to fight and wears a bright costume. Nothing is going to make that concept jive
    The child concept of Batman and Robin is inherently stupid. Bruce is a grown man he does not need a child/teen to back him up because ultimately he is always regarded as a liability and another thing for Bruce to worry about consider instead of just focusing on his own life. If he does why is he even Batman? He does need an adult partner though
    Which is why aging Robin up and removing the unpleasant power dynamics and making them true partners would always be an inherently better story.

    Further to the point Batman is not in the MCU and even in that universe they showed their hand for stuff like that
    Even with the MCU they aged Bucky up and gave him powers because surprise making him a child soldier who fought in WW2 with cap was highly unrealistic

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