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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lang View Post
    Also, in all the cop shows I'm most familiar with, there tends to be only one black regular character in the police force, and for some reason there's this rule -- possibly an unwritten rule -- that there can't be another until the first one leaves. Specific examples, from the shows I've seen:

    In Law and Order: Special Victims Unit, Ice T's Fin Tutuola only became a regular after Monique Jeffries left the show. In CSI, Langston didn't join until after Warrick Brown was no longer part of the show (Warrick Brown was killed off, by the way). Rizzoli and Isles only gained Nina Holiday a season or so after Barry Frost left the show (when both the character and the actor who played him died). Chicago PD has had only one regular black member of the unit since the show began, Kevin Atwater.

    It's kind of a disturbing bit of tokenism you don't see in other types of proceedurals. Elsewhere in the Chicagoverse, we've got three black regular characters on Chicago Med (Sharon Goodwin, Maggie, April). In Chicago Fire, the unit is led by Chief Boden, and one of its newer recruits is Ritter, making two black regular cast members.
    CSI Miami was also guilty of this. In the first six seasons, the show's only black cast member was the coroner Alexx Woods. She was replaced by Tara Price who was written out after one season. The show later added a black detective named Walter Simmons who remained with the show for the remainder of its run.

    Can anyone name a cop show that's had more than one black regular at the same time?
    The original Law and Order t.v show had two black cast members on at the same time with Jesse L. Martin (seasons 5 to 9) and S. Epatha Merkerson (seasons 4 to 20 the final season). Anthony Anderson joined the cast in the show's final two seasons.

  2. #32
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    ...

    The original Law and Order t.v show had two black cast members on at the same time with Jesse L. Martin (seasons 5 to 9) and S. Epatha Merkerson (seasons 4 to 20 the final season). Anthony Anderson joined the cast in the show's final two seasons.
    Come to think of it, Lethal Weapon(Roger Murtaugh/Sonya Bailey).

    It's just easy to lose track of it being the case because it gets overshadowed by the way the show unraveled.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    Come to think of it, Lethal Weapon(Roger Murtaugh/Sonya Bailey).

    It's just easy to lose track of it being the case because it gets overshadowed by the way the show unraveled.
    While it focused on prosecutors as opposed to cops, Shark had Henry Simmons and Sophina Brown. In fact, that's where they met before they got married.

  4. #34
    Extraordinary Member Güicho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lang View Post
    Can anyone name a cop show that's had more than one black regular at the same time?
    Brooklyn 99 Also has two Latinas on the same show (shockingly in a show that isn't about Latinos) ... Unprecedented!
    Hill Street Blues
    The Rookie
    SWAT
    Hommiside: Baltimore
    The Wire
    Last edited by Güicho; 06-28-2020 at 05:25 AM.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Lang View Post
    Well, TV police proceedurals do have a problem, some more than others. Some have an imbalance between how many crimes are committed by white people and how many are committed by persons of color. I've noticed that disturbing trend in Chicago P.D., with a lot of black and Latino criminals several episodes in a row.

    Also, in all the cop shows I'm most familiar with, there tends to be only one black regular character in the police force, and for some reason there's this rule -- possibly an unwritten rule -- that there can't be another until the first one leaves. Specific examples, from the shows I've seen:

    In Law and Order: Special Victims Unit, Ice T's Fin Tutuola only became a regular after Monique Jeffries left the show. In CSI, Langston didn't join until after Warrick Brown was no longer part of the show (Warrick Brown was killed off, by the way). Rizzoli and Isles only gained Nina Holiday a season or so after Barry Frost left the show (when both the character and the actor who played him died). Chicago PD has had only one regular black member of the unit since the show began, Kevin Atwater.

    It's kind of a disturbing bit of tokenism you don't see in other types of proceedurals. Elsewhere in the Chicagoverse, we've got three black regular characters on Chicago Med (Sharon Goodwin, Maggie, April). In Chicago Fire, the unit is led by Chief Boden, and one of its newer recruits is Ritter, making two black regular cast members.

    Can anyone name a cop show that's had more than one black regular at the same time?

    Of course, it's important to note that cop shows, despite the supposed 'real world' setting are basically fantasies, and in real life police departments are bloated, overbudgeted, and often inefficient. In the real world, sadly, a lot of rapes, murders, arsons, and so forth go unsolved, and cop shows only acknowledge it when doing 'reopening a cold case' episodes where the detective is going after the (previously unmentioned) real criminal that got away years ago.

    And sometimes, cop shows go so far out of their way to make their protagonists superheroes that it impacts real-life juries. A particularly egregious offender is CSI, where forensic science is portrayed as working so fast and so accurately that it might as well be magical. In the real world, the analyses can take a lot longer, and there's no guarantee they will be right. Unfortunately, members of a jury have been known to take too much of what they saw on CSI as being reflective of actual forensics.

    As far as brutality goes, Chicago PD is, again, an offender, as it's led by Hank Voight, a sergeant who believes in bending the rules in the name of dishing out justice. He's been known to beat up suspects and intimidate informants, sometimes by locking them in a cage. He's balanced out by more level-headed characters such as Jay Halstead and the aforementioned Kevin Atwater, but still one has to wonder how he's managed to stay as head of the Intelligence Unit for six whole seasons given how many times he's gone overboard.

    Elliot Stabler on SVU certainly has had his hot-headed moments, and moments where he's been brutal toward a perp, though usually the people he's been brutal toward were unrepentant jerks who enjoyed the abuses they themselves had committed. But again, Olivia Benson was there to be the more level-headed one.

    Anyway, yes, there are indeed a number of elements of cop shows that are problematic, and if they are to continue, they will need to address these things that have been the elephants in the room for a long time.
    An older show. But Homicide:Life on the Street has several black cops at the same time during its run. In fact, they were there during the entire run.
    Last edited by Will Evans; 06-28-2020 at 05:09 AM.

  6. #36

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    Interestingly enough, they finally convinced Meloni to return as Stabler to the L&O universe. He'll either be the lead or one of the lead characters in the SVU spinoff, "Law & Order: Organized Crime." Apropos for the thread, one of L&O:OC's writers have already been fired.

    What exactly is the deal with Voight on Chicago PD? He seems like early Stabler if he was somehow put in charge of people.

    Shades of Blue, that Jennifer Lopez / Ray Liotta, show, dealt with crooked cops.

  7. #37
    Ultimate Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    The problem is the rule breakers always do it to the guilty person. When has a cop show shown an office beat or kill a completely innocent person? Cop shows in general are not a problem, how they portray Police Brutality is.
    There was "The Shield" where the main character was an outright bad guy who thought he was doing some good. They kinda tempered him a bit over the course of the show though ... and I don't think he was racist, so they didn't make him that bad...(although from his actions dealing with civilians I'm sure he'd be labelled a racist cop)
    Last edited by j9ac9k; 06-28-2020 at 05:51 AM.

  8. #38
    Extraordinary Member Güicho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Grey View Post
    ....., dealt with crooked cops.
    One of the most famous as far as portrayal in pop culture, Pacino classic 1973 take on him.
    In this context worth mentioning - Interview with Frank Serpico - Police Racism: ‘We Have This Virus Among Us’
    https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/06/11...Q6hehA_v5n5cWo


    Again: Cops like any profession and groups are full of good and bad people.
    TV shows good and bad for better and worse can portray and reflect that.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuinnFillory View Post
    there have been called to remove them from the air.
    Imagine blanket removing "them" from the air? You'd likely lose broadcast of the above as well.
    Removing good and bad, positive and negative, consequentially any vehicle for commentary, parody, critique as well. Who is deciding?
    You're approaching totalitarianism level censorship and control.
    Horrible idea.
    Last edited by Güicho; 06-28-2020 at 06:26 AM.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Grey View Post
    Interestingly enough, they finally convinced Meloni to return as Stabler to the L&O universe. He'll either be the lead or one of the lead characters in the SVU spinoff, "Law & Order: Organized Crime." Apropos for the thread, one of L&O:OC's writers have already been fired.

    What exactly is the deal with Voight on Chicago PD? He seems like early Stabler if he was somehow put in charge of people.

    Shades of Blue, that Jennifer Lopez / Ray Liotta, show, dealt with crooked cops.
    There's The Shield which also dealt with corrupt cops.

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Güicho View Post
    In this context worth mentioning one of the most famous as far as portrayal in pop culture, made famous by Pacino classic 1973 take on him
    Interview with Frank Serpico - Police Racism: ‘We Have This Virus Among Us’
    https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/06/11...Q6hehA_v5n5cWo
    Dealt with = the two leads were crooked. Probably should have specified. I thought it was clear based on the two previous examples I listed but, guess not so my bad. The impetus for the show was the FBI wanted Lopez to turn on her fellow dirty cops, especially ringleader Liotta, for either a lighter sentence or no sentence at all, I forget which. I'm not sure how long such a premise can sustain itself, I couldn't see it running a decade for instance, but it lasted three seasons.
    Last edited by Nate Grey; 06-28-2020 at 06:09 AM.

  11. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    There's The Shield which also dealt with corrupt cops.
    Damn forgot all about that. I think we all did, since we were struggling to come up with shows with bad cops as the lead and we're 3 pages deep before someone mentioned The Shield.

    Speaking of which, since such shows happen but are rare, it seems what is standard is to have a force or a group of people in the background trying to stop the bad cops(s). They can't just exist and are stopped because their corruption isn't sustainable long-term, there has to be another party involved.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    There was "The Shield" where the main character was an outright bad guy who thought he was doing some good. They kinda tempered him a bit over the course of the show though ... and I don't think he was racist, so they didn't make him that bad...(although from his actions dealing with civilians I'm sure he'd be labelled a racist cop)
    Vic Mackey may not be racist but he's among the worst criminals on the show. He's a gang leader posing as a policeman who does nearly every crime you can think of. In the first episode he murders someone simply because they're a mole for authorities to arrest him for his crimes. He's the manifestation of a "bad cop." They had to make him have qualities which aren't despicable since he's a person, and his charisma draws viewers into his con, as well as making him an engaging lead. He's Tony Soprano with a badge.

  13. #43
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    If the "Misaimed Fandom" page on tv tropes is to be believed, there were real life cops who idolized Vic Mackey.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuinnFillory View Post
    Thanks to recent real-life events, there is more scrutiny on the institution of police than ever before. And, some of that scrutiny is landing on cop shows and how they depict the way law enforcement is supposed to behave. While some of these shows have promised to take more care with their writing, there have been called to remove them from the air.

    https://tvline.com/2020/06/26/trevor...u-*********pd/

    So, what do you think?
    Only for people too stupid to tell the difference between reality and fiction. Do you also blame gun violence on video games?
    People who are smart know how to separate the worlds they see on TV from the one outside their house, hell they would start learning how to separate reality from what they see on TV when they realize that recess isn't like Recess and field trips aren't like what the Magic School Bus showed them in preschool.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by PD98 View Post
    Only for people too stupid to tell the difference between reality and fiction. Do you also blame gun violence on video games?
    People who are smart know how to separate the worlds they see on TV from the one outside their house, hell they would start learning how to separate reality from what they see on TV when they realize that recess isn't like Recess and field trips aren't like what the Magic School Bus showed them in preschool.
    The CSI effect is real. As is the fact that people expect to be able to make a phone call after being arrested.

    I imagine that there's a cognitive difference between a video game where you control the action, and where you watch actors portraying something you think is realistic.

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