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  1. #91
    Fantastic Member Foon4000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    Soon it will be enough to go after someone for what they didn’t say. Just their “privilege” alone will be enough if they’re not using it to toe the line and promote the cause du jour.

    Our outrage is being cultivated and fed back to us. We’re all being played.
    Lol no.

    Sexual harassment is rampant in male-dominated spaces like the creative industries and academia. In 2013-15 the head of my PG programme was known to prey on 20-25 year old students to the extent that it was a running joke that you shouldn't be in a room alone with him.

    A certain proportion of people with power have and will behave this way if they think they can get away with it. Because of the way the comic industry (and other industries) have formed, the higher-ups are mostly straight men who can exploit their position in the industry to hit on, extort sex from, or otherwise harass women. Warren Ellis, Scott Lobdell, Brian Wood et al have been knowingly acting like dirtbags so they can get their end away. I've enjoyed Ellis' work in the past, but he writes women like a letch.

    IMHO the difference in quality between Lobdell's X-men run and Generation-X is the involvement of Chris Bachelo. Those characters were as much his as Lobdell's, and now they belong to the fans as well.

    ETA: In 'unexpectedly not a total ****', Mark Millar was the only person not creeping on me at Dublin Comic Con 2006, albeit he seemed like a space cadet. Grant Morrison also was a non-creeper space-cadet when I met him.
    Last edited by Foon4000; 07-01-2020 at 04:24 AM.

  2. #92
    The King Fears NO ONE! Triniking1234's Avatar
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    If something illegal went down, tell the proper authorities. Kath Leth claimed she was groomed because an artist gave her a drawing of Vampirella and Mags Visaggio tried to cancel Sean Gordon Murphy even though she claimed in the same tweets he didn't do anything to her.
    "Cable was right!"

  3. #93
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triniking1234 View Post
    If something illegal went down, tell the proper authorities. Kath Leth claimed she was groomed because an artist gave her a drawing of Vampirella and Mags Visaggio tried to cancel Sean Gordon Murphy even though she claimed in the same tweets he didn't do anything to her.
    To this...

    I've seen a number of tweets from both men and women coming out in support of their acquaintances stating..."I saw this guy doing this...at the time" And "We knew so and so was doing that...at the time"

    But none...none...of those tweets ever ended with .."...so I/we went to the HR/the director/the editor to make a report and I followed up on it to make sure something was being done."

    Am I to presume they saw/knew an injustice being committed and did nothing to help their fellow colleague in distress?
    My Summer rain. My rooftop in Japan. My quiet in the storm. *cries* Al Ewing is GOD...Praise His name! Uplift Him in song! Glorify His works!

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    To this...

    I've seen a number of tweets from both men and women coming out in support of their acquaintances stating..."I saw this guy doing this...at the time" And "We knew so and so was doing that...at the time"

    But none...none...of those tweets ever ended with .."...so I/we went to the HR/the director/the editor to make a report and I followed up on it to make sure something was being done."

    Am I to presume they saw/knew an injustice being committed and did nothing to help their fellow colleague in distress?
    Some probably did.

    And like in real life-they got hit with retaliation.

    In this industry I would suspect that would be not getting gigs at certain companies.

    Or not being considered for certain books (see McDuffie).

  5. #95
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    So facing personal retaliation is the excuse for not speaking up and out sooner and louder.
    When you break it down like that...it's easy to see why that sort of behaviour has pervaded the industry since inception.

    It's really boggling to think (as I learnt when the Harvey W. stories broke) that ALL these industry people knew, some first hand, but it was more convenient at the time to stand aside and do nothing, say nothing (or very little at all) until it became imperative or "popular" to do so.
    Last edited by Devaishwarya; 07-01-2020 at 09:30 AM.
    My Summer rain. My rooftop in Japan. My quiet in the storm. *cries* Al Ewing is GOD...Praise His name! Uplift Him in song! Glorify His works!

  6. #96
    Benefactor / Malefactor H-E-D's Avatar
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    Behavior doesn't need to be illegal to be shitty and worth calling out.

  7. #97
    Fantastic Member Foon4000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    To this...

    I've seen a number of tweets from both men and women coming out in support of their acquaintances stating..."I saw this guy doing this...at the time" And "We knew so and so was doing that...at the time"

    But none...none...of those tweets ever ended with .."...so I/we went to the HR/the director/the editor to make a report and I followed up on it to make sure something was being done."

    Am I to presume they saw/knew an injustice being committed and did nothing to help their fellow colleague in distress?
    I’ve sat on a rape trial that got thrown out because the woman, when reporting it, said ‘I think I’ve been raped’ instead of ‘I’ve been raped’. I’ve reported harassment to HR on behalf of other people. I’ve reported harassment to the head of diversity and inclusion and the union. It did nothing. It does nothing. I know dozens of people who’ve been assaulted or harassed and they haven’t reported it for reasons that are nobody’s business but their own.

    Quote Originally Posted by Devaishwarya View Post
    It's really boggling to think (as I learnt when the Harvey W. stories broke) that ALL these industry people knew, some first hand, but it was more convenient at the time to stand aside and do nothing, say nothing (or very little at all) until it became imperative or "popular" to do so.
    The Catholic Church and Catholics worldwide knew priests were molesting kids for years and nobody did anything about it. Plenty of people reported it the way they were supposed to and were gaslight or cast out of the community.
    Last edited by Foon4000; 07-01-2020 at 12:06 PM.

  8. #98
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    Unfortunately...I fully expected that response.

    Sadly...cancelling the creative in question is just a band-aid as the systemic issues pervading the Industry would still continue to exist as those who've covered up, looked past and enabled the reprehensible behaviours are not held to account for their part.

    Weinstein, Allie, Stewart, Catholic Priests etc...are just one part of a much larger, deeper, pervasive problem.
    Last edited by Devaishwarya; 07-01-2020 at 12:19 PM.
    My Summer rain. My rooftop in Japan. My quiet in the storm. *cries* Al Ewing is GOD...Praise His name! Uplift Him in song! Glorify His works!

  9. #99
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    You do nothing. What these men did in their personal lives has little to do with books you read decades ago

    Quote Originally Posted by Vishop View Post
    Ellis's entire bibliography is better than the combined Dawn of X writers. I have enjoyed his Transmet and Planetary but what he did is just profoundly wrong.
    IDA. Ellis work has always been boring to me. Never cared for any of his X-work to be honest. I didnt mind Excalibur but other X-writers were doing better

  10. #100
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    Jeez now Joss Whedon too I figure I mentioned him since his Astonishing Run with Cassaday was 2nd to Grant Morrison in being prominent 00s xmen runs

  11. #101
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    At this rate, those who feel so inclined should drop Marvel and DC entirely and have absolutely nothing to do with their movies, games, merchandise, and comics.

    And since it's systemic throughout the industry...add Dark Horse and Image and IDW to that "cancelled" list of problematic companies for good measure.
    My Summer rain. My rooftop in Japan. My quiet in the storm. *cries* Al Ewing is GOD...Praise His name! Uplift Him in song! Glorify His works!

  12. #102
    Grizzled Veteran Jackraow21's Avatar
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    We really need comics to come back. And football.

  13. #103
    Braddock Isle JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    We really need comics to come back. And football.
    One more week, friend. We will crawl there if we must.
    "Danielle... I intend to do something rash and violent." - Betsy Braddock
    Krakoa, Arakko, and Otherworld forever!

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    You do nothing. What these men did in their personal lives has little to do with books you read decades ago



    IDA. Ellis work has always been boring to me. Never cared for any of his X-work to be honest. I didnt mind Excalibur but other X-writers were doing better
    *opinion*

    His x-books weren't really worth mentioning. His in-depth views of social commentary and modern culture themes have been explicitly creative and exemplified in various media. He is like a time-lord of comics for me.
    Last edited by Vishop; 07-01-2020 at 08:13 PM.

  15. #105
    Incredible Member Technopriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foon4000 View Post
    IMHO the difference in quality between Lobdell's X-men run and Generation-X is the involvement of Chris Bachelo. Those characters were as much his as Lobdell's, and now they belong to the fans as well.
    I actually agree with this sentiment, I still consider Generation X to be Lobdell's best run in the X-titles but it is true that a big part of my enjoyment was Bachalo's art. Plus it is true, those characters are as much Bachalo's as they are Lobdell, so in my mind it is easier to separate them from him. Wisdom though doesn't get that pass from me, he is just pure unaltered Ellis creepy behavior in the form of a Constantine light template.
    Last edited by Technopriest; 07-01-2020 at 10:57 PM.

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