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  1. #1
    Spectacular Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Default Doomsday clock part 1 and 2 spoilers

    Forgive me if some thread already exists but I searched the forum and googled it as well and seemed like there were no current Doomsday Clock discussions. Though there were some older threads speculating on the various floppy issues.


    Seems like some people really dislike this book, as well as dislike Crisis's or large events/reboots.

    Some speculate since this series was so delayed it is meaningless and has no impact on continuity.

    Some just hate the idea of Watchmen and the DC Universe mixing.

    Recent news seems to suggest Doomsday Clock will be impacting DC though.

    As for the story in and of itself, regardless of long term impact, was it enjoyable.


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    For me personally volume 1 was a good read, it held my interest and I enjoyed myself, I'm a fan of allot of Geoff material, for me he is top rate and rarely can he do wrong for my tastes.

    Volume 2 was a rapid page turner for me, I loved it and I wanna go back and read what related materials I can, such as, the Button, etc. And see how things all tie together, as this all came out over such a long period, it warrents a reread to experience it all fresh.

    The CBR community has a lot of knowledge and vocal fans as well as "haters" ... so who enjoyed this and who didnt and why.

    If you got relevant current thread to link to feel free to include that and I'll give it a read.
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  2. #2
    Mighty Member C_Miller's Avatar
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    I put it solidly in the okay camp. I don’t personally like the idea of Watchmen related characters in the DCU. And while Geoff Johns did a decent job aping Alan Moore’s style, the soul of Watchmen, like in so many other adaptions was missing. While there were some statements on the superhero genre, none of them had any real depth and the social commentary was either shallow or just not there.

    But the art was amazing and I really like how they included the JSA and Legion.

  3. #3
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    I honestly really liked it, not just for the Legion, JSA, and Superman but even the new Watchmen characters who I would actually like to see again. I know this will sound almost sacrilegious to some, but I don’t mind DC doing more with Watchmen, I get that it is entirely unfair to Alan Moore but as a business they have the complete right to use the property that they own and you know sometimes it will be good like the HBO series and this and sometimes it will be before Watchmen which was a mixed bag.

    I enjoyed it because it was I thought the overall story was well told including all of the political stuff and the uneasiness of the world at the time of the world which ultimately culminated in Superman being inspiring to save the world and the return of the Legion and the JSA. I also enjoyed the issues that were devoted to the Watchmen characters, such as the new Rorschach and Mime and Marionette.

    As for it’s impact that’s hard to say. I think DC is trying to fix the problem it’s had as we can see in Death Metal and Flash Forward and I think the special issues where we see WW2 era JSA help but I think DC caused a lot of its own problems. I mean the Legion series is currently not connected to the ending of Doomsday Clock, heck Superman didn’t even know them when they appeared in his book, and the JSA outside a handful of characters haven’t shown up even though other characters like Ma and Pa Kent have. It wouldn’t have hurt anything to have a JSA ongoing or heck even just a Firestorm book dealing with the aftermath of the Superman Theory.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  4. #4
    Astonishing Member batnbreakfast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    I honestly really liked it, not just for the Legion, JSA, and Superman but even the new Watchmen characters who I would actually like to see again. I know this will sound almost sacrilegious to some, but I don’t mind DC doing more with Watchmen, I get that it is entirely unfair to Alan Moore but as a business they have the complete right to use the property that they own and you know sometimes it will be good like the HBO series and this and sometimes it will be before Watchmen which was a mixed bag.

    I enjoyed it because it was I thought the overall story was well told including all of the political stuff and the uneasiness of the world at the time of the world which ultimately culminated in Superman being inspiring to save the world and the return of the Legion and the JSA. I also enjoyed the issues that were devoted to the Watchmen characters, such as the new Rorschach and Mime and Marionette.

    As for it’s impact that’s hard to say. I think DC is trying to fix the problem it’s had as we can see in Death Metal and Flash Forward and I think the special issues where we see WW2 era JSA help but I think DC caused a lot of its own problems. I mean the Legion series is currently not connected to the ending of Doomsday Clock, heck Superman didn’t even know them when they appeared in his book, and the JSA outside a handful of characters haven’t shown up even though other characters like Ma and Pa Kent have. It wouldn’t have hurt anything to have a JSA ongoing or heck even just a Firestorm book dealing with the aftermath of the Superman Theory.
    Please God, let them just ignore what isn't working as I don't want another story about fixing continuity in the next 20 years. It feels like every second issue is about fixing continuity theese days.

  5. #5
    Astonishing Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by batnbreakfast View Post
    Please God, let them just ignore what isn't working as I don't want another story about fixing continuity in the next 20 years. It feels like every second issue is about fixing continuity theese days.
    Oh yeah they got to knock that off, I’m fine for right now but if they continue the “time is broken and we’ve forgotten people and things” soon after this I will be a bit annoyed.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  6. #6

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    I liked it but i thought the end was underwhelming. Granted iblike the new characters created for the Watchmen-verse and i wouldn't mind seeing them again.

  7. #7
    Incredible Member Slim Shady's Avatar
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    I had so many doubts and worries at first about mixing Watchmen with the DCU, but I have to say I think Johns did it about as good as it could've been done. This had every right to be bad and forced, but it was much better than I expected. I don't too much care about making continuity all pretty, I just wanted a good story. It delivered for me.

    I loved Mime and Marionette.

  8. #8
    Spectacular Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by batnbreakfast View Post
    Please God, let them just ignore what isn't working as I don't want another story about fixing continuity in the next 20 years. It feels like every second issue is about fixing continuity theese days.
    I for one am not against all the multiverse / event / reboot stories ... frankly these are some of my favorite... flashlpoint, the new 52 era, rebirth, reborn, metal has some great stuff...

    Having said that I do agree DC needs some other story talking points other then the multiverse--, the next big events need a new twist, leave continuity alone for a while...

    Tho 5G seems to tease something new, it is a multiverse/time shift story... many seem to hate the idea... depending what it becomes...

    Continuity fixing for no reason does create fatigue.

  9. #9
    Spectacular Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim Shady View Post
    I had so many doubts and worries at first about mixing Watchmen with the DCU, but I have to say I think Johns did it about as good as it could've been done. This had every right to be bad and forced, but it was much better than I expected. I don't too much care about making continuity all pretty, I just wanted a good story. It delivered for me.

    I loved Mime and Marionette.
    Yah exactly, good stories are what matter, this did feel like a really good story to me!

  10. #10
    Spectacular Member Menacer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Miller View Post
    I put it solidly in the okay camp. I don’t personally like the idea of Watchmen related characters in the DCU. And while Geoff Johns did a decent job aping Alan Moore’s style, the soul of Watchmen, like in so many other adaptions was missing. While there were some statements on the superhero genre, none of them had any real depth and the social commentary was either shallow or just not there.

    But the art was amazing and I really like how they included the JSA and Legion.
    Definitely agree with your JSA, Legion talking points and would like to watch that HBO Watchmen mini series as people seem to really dig it

  11. #11
    Extraordinary Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    I liked it, but I felt like it was ultimately a collection of great concepts that crowded one another. Almost every issue felt like it promised a different trajectory, only for the story's apparent focus to switch completely by the next issue.

    A "Superman Theory" accusing the government of generating metahumans that sparks global superhero conflict? Cool.

    A Watchmen sequel story where several primary characters deal with the aftermath of their actions? Also cool.

    Mime and Marionette? Very cool.

    Reggie Long as a new Rorschach? Potentially cool.

    An easter egg hunt that leads to the JSA's return? Belatedly cool.

    A new multiverse explanation? Somewhat cool.

    A ham-fisted commentary on 2020 politics? Not quite as cool.



    All of that thrown together? Hints of genius that don't quite add up to the masterpiece we hoped for.

  12. #12
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    I recently reread this story and I have to say itís pretty good, but not great. The insane delays lessened my enjoyment of it the first time around. I think it started off really strong but in typical Johns fashion, petered out a bit at the end. I still donít understand why Dr. Manhattan couldnít see anything past the point of Superman flying towards him. I understand the whole thing is a time paradox but that part I donít get. During his time in the DCU, Manhattan has learned how to not just observe all of history but alter the course of time. Including saving himself from the accident which erased himself from existence (which should have undone everything he was involved in).

    The whole metaverse stuff was somewhat interesting. We the readers know that Superman is the start of everything and will always persevere throughout time and reboots, but at the same time the people living in the DCU will remember the JSA and Wonder Woman as the first modern superheroes. I guess.

    It still bums me out that the delays lessened the importance of this story for the current DCU. It seemed like it was going to usher in a new era but the delays caused DC to spin its wheels for over a year and end up changing their plans as a result. The return of the JSA should have been a huge deal, but they had already appeared by then in Snyderís Justice League in an underwhelming fashion. Saturn Girlís story arc is also depressing. They had been building up something with her as she was stuck in this timeline since the start of Rebirth, but she ended up just fading away and eventually reappearing as Bendisí version. Seemed very anticlimactic.
    Last edited by Robotman; 07-05-2020 at 11:44 PM.

  13. #13
    Extraordinary Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotman View Post
    I still don’t understand why Dr. Manhattan couldn’t see anything past the point of Superman flying towards him. I understand the whole thing is a time paradox but that part I don’t get.
    That confuses me too, actually. Did anyone else infer a reason for that?

  14. #14
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    The story doesn't make much sense unless you squint and ignore Dr. Manhattan seeing past, present, and future. They hand wave it away with sci-fi mumbo jumbo, just as they did in Watchmen and the HBO show.

    I'm gonna let this story sit for a couple years then re-read it again with a little distance. I think it suffered greatly coming so close to the much more interesting HBO show.

  15. #15
    Spectacular Member Hol's Avatar
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    I am waiting for both volumes to go on sale digitally before picking this up. Looking forward to it for the art alone...plus I love a lot of Geoffs older work. I don't have expectations of it setting this back to pre Flashpoint anymore and the delays aren't an issue so I am hoping to enjoy this as I was really looking forward to it after I read the Rebirth One shot.

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