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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Default What do you guys think would happen if a villain superman portrayal got popular?

    What if a villain superman portrayal got popular? I mean, it's villains are hugely appreciated. Would that prompt a face turn like harley or jason(anti hero turn) ? Or could it become a hugely popular villain character like joker, lex or darkseid? What would you prefer happen.

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Already is. Of the three major outside medium Supermen, Cavill, Hoechlin, and Injustice, 1 is evil (Injustice) and 1 was going to be evil (Cavill). Injustice is popular while Cavill is not so I don’t know what the long term effects will be. Hopefully the Snyder Cut will flop like Snyder’s movies tend to do and that will be the end of that. If not I guess they’ll let Snyder make his “arc” on HBO Max.

    As for the long term impact of all these evil Supermen? Lois has become a liability for the character. Her repeated fridging as a cheap way to make him evil has made me ever more sour towards the entire Clois relationship, and makes me more and more open to the idea of other relationships.

  3. #3
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    People still don't know the difference between evil by free will and evil by brainwashing which has happened to virtually every superhero. I won't even get into the pettiness of wanting a movie to flop for your own preferences.

    As for what will happen, the same thing with every story about an evil Superman: nothing. We've had evil Superman stories for decades. The majority of the character's history still has him as a hero.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    Already is. Of the three major outside medium Supermen, Cavill, Hoechlin, and Injustice, 1 is evil (Injustice) and 1 was going to be evil (Cavill). Injustice is popular while Cavill is not so I don’t know what the long term effects will be. Hopefully the Snyder Cut will flop like Snyder’s movies tend to do and that will be the end of that. If not I guess they’ll let Snyder make his “arc” on HBO Max.

    As for the long term impact of all these evil Supermen? Lois has become a liability for the character. Her repeated fridging as a cheap way to make him evil has made me ever more sour towards the entire Clois relationship, and makes me more and more open to the idea of other relationships.
    In which world is cavill superman evil? Seriously, dude you got issues with the whole portrayal that just doesn't seem to be from the portrayal itself.Injustice man is popular as a villain ? I doubt it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    People still don't know the difference between evil by free will and evil by brainwashing which has happened to virtually every superhero. I won't even get into the pettiness of wanting a movie to flop for your own preferences.

    As for what will happen, the same thing with every story about an evil Superman: nothing. We've had evil Superman stories for decades. The majority of the character's history still has him as a hero.
    Riiigth, a corporate entity is gonna sit there do nothing with a character that can make them money. Popularity can be used to pull in cash.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 07-04-2020 at 11:39 PM.

  5. #5
    Astonishing Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    People still don't know the difference between evil by free will and evil by brainwashing which has happened to virtually every superhero. I won't even get into the pettiness of wanting a movie to flop for your own preferences.

    As for what will happen, the same thing with every story about an evil Superman: nothing. We've had evil Superman stories for decades. The majority of the character's history still has him as a hero.
    If I don’t like a take I’m under no obligation to wish it success. Sorry you can’t grasp that concept. Given Snyder’s ability to fall upwards as a white straight male in Hollywood, I think he’ll be ok.
    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    In which world is cavill superman evil? Seriously, dude you got issues with the whole portrayal that just doesn't seem to be from the portrayal itself.Injustice man is popular as a villain ? I doubt it.


    Riiigth, a corporate entity is gonna sit there do nothing with a character that can make them money. Popularity can be used to pull in cash.
    I said he “was going to be evil”, meaning he wasn’t evil yet, important distinction there bud. Cavill was meant to be the final boss for JL along with Darkseid.
    Last edited by Vordan; 07-04-2020 at 11:47 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    In which world is cavill superman evil? Seriously, dude you got issues with the whole portrayal that just doesn't seem to be from the portrayal itself.Injustice man is popular as a villain ? I doubt it.


    Riiigth, a corporate entity is gonna sit there do nothing with a character that can make them money. Popularity can be used to pull in cash.
    The only evil Superman that has pulled in cash is the Injustice version and even that has other factors attached to it. Evil Superman isn't really that big a draw.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    If I don’t like a take I’m under no obligation to wish it success. Sorry you can’t grasp that concept. Given Snyder’s ability to fall upwards as a white straight male in Hollywood, I think he’ll be ok.
    There's plenty of things I don't like without wishing failure upon them. That's just being petty and entitled.

    I said he “was going to be evil”, meaning he wasn’t evil yet, important distinction there bud. Cavill was meant to be the final boss for JL along with Darkseid.
    This is like calling Hawkeye the final boss of the Avengers because he spends the majority of the movie brainwashed by Darkseid.

    And again, there is a big difference between being evil by choice and being brainwashed into it, the latter of which is more common with superheroes so I don't see why people complain about this happening with Superman anyway.
    Last edited by Agent Z; 07-05-2020 at 12:16 AM.

  7. #7
    Astonishing Member manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The only evil Superman that has pulled in cash is the Injustice version and even that has other factors attached to it. Evil Superman isn't really that big a draw.
    .
    That's the scenario. Ain't it? What if any of these evil Superman become a draw. The way i see it. The company is gonna keep making these evil Supermen. It stands to reason that maybe one of them might get popular.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I said he “was going to be evil”, meaning he wasn’t evil yet, important distinction there bud. Cavill was meant to be the final boss for JL along with Darkseid.
    I have said this before, untill i actually see the movie i can't make that call. Brainwashing nonsense is a standard troupe that happens to superman. Even, that hitman story had it.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 07-05-2020 at 12:48 AM.

  8. #8
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    For second when you said evil Superman, I thought you meant Bizarro or Ultraman.

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member Yoda's Avatar
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    Cavill’s Superman wasn’t well received generally because he was a little grumpy sometimes. And Brightburn didn’t exactly light up the box office. General audiences don’t like a non-heroic Superman. So I don’t think there’s much chance of it actually catching on outside of video games and a pretty niche comic.

    If we’re talking like a different character within the mythos, Superboy Prime kinda already fits that. Or like the Regime Superman coming over. Kingdom Come Superman is basically a villain even within that story so it’s pretty much already happened.

    If it’s the “real” Superman, it’s be received like Hydra Cap I think though. It’ll be hated by a lot of people in comics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    As for the long term impact of all these evil Supermen? Lois has become a liability for the character. Her repeated fridging as a cheap way to make him evil has made me ever more sour towards the entire Clois relationship, and makes me more and more open to the idea of other relationships.
    Do you actually think it is Lois that is a liability and that magically writers would stop fridging a woman love interest for cheap drama because it was someone else? Like Lana, Wonder Woman, Maxima, whoever wouldn’t get the same treatment when they wanted to tell these type of stories? I don’t think an absence of Lois would magically make a bunch of bad writers suddenly good.
    Last edited by Yoda; 07-05-2020 at 06:21 AM.

  10. #10
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    It would get mined for all it could be by WB/DC. If it's absurdly popular it might bleed back into mainstream comics but I doubt it as it's a direction most writers don't care for even people that don't like Superman see him as a backdrop or standard of good for other characters they actually like to surpass or rebel against.

    Then again All Star Superman was ultra popular in a decade that is largely seen as kind of a bust for Supes yet it's bleed into the mainstream has been relatively minimal. So who knows.
    Rules are for lesser men, Charlie - Grand Pa Joe ~ Willy Wonka & Chocolate Factory

  11. #11
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    People still don't know the difference between evil by free will and evil by brainwashing which has happened to virtually every superhero. I won't even get into the pettiness of wanting a movie to flop for your own preferences.

    As for what will happen, the same thing with every story about an evil Superman: nothing. We've had evil Superman stories for decades. The majority of the character's history still has him as a hero.
    It would be a little better than a straight up Injustice take, but it's still cut from the same cloth and involves yet another fridging of Lois to get it to happen.

    Another movie of Cavill being mopey or scowling at the camera without much character development to get attached to this Superman is a pretty lousy story. Let the movie come out and sink or swim on its own merits, but I can't imagine this cut was going to redeem this specific Superman overall for the general audience. Two strikes already, at least Hawkeye was only mind controlled in his first major appearance and got more to do later, and it helps that he's a more minor character in comparison to begin with.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    I mean, that's kind of already happened with Injustice.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  13. #13
    Mighty Member Ra-El's Avatar
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    The reason most people like evil Superman is because it gives a reason to Batman kick his ass. That's the truth. But i going to say this, the next time DC decides to do an Evil Superman, the least they can do is doing a truly evil one, not a "they killed my woman and now I'm crazy", not a "I can't handle the Joker" and definetely not a brainwashed one. Give me a Evil Superman on the mold of the Lords of Justice, a Superman that by his own decisions and actions turns Evil.

    But mostly, just don't do Evil Superman, Superman can work on his own, the character work for decades and I believe he will again.

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    I've never read it but apparently that's the premise of Irredeemable. A Superman who started out good but just became evil over time as people never fully trusted him.
    Now listen to me, Clark! This great strength of yours--you've got to hide it from people or they'll be scared of you!

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    No more evil Supermen, but if we must have one, can we have an equally evil Batman to go along with him?

    Or Evil Superman just kills his version of Batman and it's up to another hero to take him down (either a good version of Superman or the likes of Supergirl, Wonder Woman or Captain Marvel).

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