Classic Strange vs. Parallax

[The Dork Knight]

Recharging entire universe isn't a feat now? Emotional Spectrum is what literally powers the universe.

Which run would that be then?

For starters Parallax has actually overpowered Spectre Force (Not a host, mind you).

Isnt that same arc where Ganthet is said to be more powerful than the Spectre?

[Sharpandpointies]

Isnt that same arc where Ganthet is said to be more powerful than the Spectre?

wat

I mean, if the Spectre is in one of his Not So Great™ phases, I suppose.

[Superfan90]

Isnt that same arc where Ganthet is said to be more powerful than the Spectre?

No. Under Johns (the same writer) Ganthet himself says that if they come between Parallax and Black Lantern Spectre (Just a shell of Spectre), they will be vaporized.



And its not like Guardians are some lightweights. Johns had Volthoom become creator of the universe by Guardians' leftover energy which they gave to Volthoom.

[Superfan90]

"Volthoom was now the very light that created the universe".

https://i.postimg.cc/8zcm5L3G/Green-...-Digital-N.jpg

And its not just a statement. Volthoom literally had universe in his palm.



And Sinestro with Parallax literally punched his heart out.

https://postimg.cc/N22rJLTG
https://postimg.cc/pym8Xc7N

So yeah, Parallax is pretty powerful.

[The Dork Knight]

No. Under Johns (the same writer) Ganthet himself says that if they come between Parallax and Black Lantern Spectre (Just a shell of Spectre), they will be vaporized.



And its not like Guardians are some lightweights. Johns had Volthoom become creator of the universe by Guardians' leftover energy which they gave to Volthoom.

Here's a "Yes" or "No" question

That first scan, you posted, is that from GL Rebirth, yes or no?

Edit- To clarify, the one where Parallax rips open Hal's face

[The Chou Lives]

Not really, he is a fear lord who reigns over Earth's nightmares. Nothing more.

Dormammu is hardly universe destroying level threat we are talking about. Yes, he has a few feats on that level but he has admitted himself that he is equal to Odin and Zeus.

Retconned by Mark Waid. There are sorcerer supremes on different planets. Strange is Sorcerer Supreme of Earth only.

Not really.

You do realize Dormammu “COULD” destroy universes right? He just rather bond them for magic power, sort of lie a demonic Halactus, except planes of existence than worlds and does so because want, not nerd.

[Superfan90]

Here's a "Yes" or "No" question

That first scan, you posted, is that from GL Rebirth, yes or no?

Edit- To clarify, the one where Parallax rips open Hal's face

No, that's from Green Lantern 51. Actually there are two statements in GL rebirth, Ganthet says Spectre's power dwarfs Guardians.



Then Parallax says Ganthet's power dwarfs Spectre's.



But weren't you saying in the other thread that statements aren't actually proofs and only feats are? Why the sudden reversal?

[Superfan90]

You do realize Dormammu “COULD” destroy universes right? He just rather bond them for magic power, sort of lie a demonic Halactus, except planes of existence than worlds and does so because want, not nerd.

Dormammu has destroyed no universes that I know of. Last I checked, this forum doesn't accepts statements as feats. By Dormammu's own mouth, he accepted that he is equal to Odin or Zeus.



That doesn't sounds like a universal character.

[Sharpandpointies]

Dormammu is hardly universe destroying level threat we are talking about. Yes, he has a few feats on that level but he has admitted himself that he is equal to Odin and Zeus.

Specifically, he knows rituals that allow him to corrupt entire universes. I would not say he's a 'universe buster'.

In any case, Stephen is NOT Dormammu's match.

Retconned by Mark Waid. There are sorcerer supremes on different planets. Strange is Sorcerer Supreme of Earth only.

Except that we're talking about Classic Strange, who was the Sorcerer Supreme for the Earth Dimension.

Also, Waid's retcon flies in the face of, oh, forty+ years of Dr. Strange under a bucketload of different writers, and how the Marvel Universe was set up as a whole, so frankly? I would take that with a huge grain of salt.

Recharging entire universe isn't a feat now? Emotional Spectrum is what literally powers the universe.

Got a scan, or did I miss it?

Which run would that be then?

Doctor Strange, Master of the Mystic Arts, has his best feats. It's pre-Black Magic Strange, and while he supposedly got all of his powers and goodies back after Strange Tales vol 2 (by issue 4 of Dr. Strange SS, as I recall, or in that area), he never, ever showed the kind of power that he did before and then Sorcerer Supreme became a roller coaster of 'Strange loses his powers, Strange gets new powers, Strange loses his powers, Strange gets new powers'.

[Sharpandpointies]

Just to note, I'm totally fine if Parallax is more powerful than Stephen. Lotsa stuff is more powerful than Stephen.

Just want to make sure on that, and correct some minor issues with what people are saying about Strange. And Furnace Face.

[Superfan90]

Specifically, he knows rituals that allow him to corrupt entire universes. I would not say he's a 'universe buster'.

In any case, Stephen is NOT Dormammu's match.

Oh that's my view as well.

Except that we're talking about Classic Strange, who was the Sorcerer Supreme for the Earth Dimension.

Sure, but titles aren't an indication of power. Roma, the omniverse Monitor isn't say omniversal in power.

Also, Waid's retcon flies in the face of, oh, forty+ years of Dr. Strange under a bucketload of different writers, and how the Marvel Universe was set up as a whole, so frankly? I would take that with a huge grain of salt.

Eh, it's in continuity now. We have to accept it now.

Got a scan, or did I miss it?

Already posted it on the previous page. The universe actually imploded when the reservoir of emotional spectrum was emptied.

Doctor Strange, Master of the Mystic Arts, has his best feats. It's pre-Black Magic Strange, and while he supposedly got all of his powers and goodies back after Strange Tales vol 2 (by issue 4 of Dr. Strange SS, as I recall, or in that area), he never, ever showed the kind of power that he did before and then Sorcerer Supreme became a roller coaster of 'Strange loses his powers, Strange gets new powers, Strange loses his powers, Strange gets new powers'.

But Sorcerer Supreme had Strange actually competing with Adam Warlock with infinity gauntlet (one gem at a time). I don't think any other run had Strange that powerful.

Here are the scans of emotional spectrum.

When the emotional reservoir in Relic's previous universe was depleted, the entire universe collapsed into a void of nothingness:
http://i.imgur.com/H3LFKF5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Zb8KuAT.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/FLCr2T6.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/lr11YUW.jpg

And six entities (Minus Parallax) filled source wall by sacrificing themselves.

https://i.postimg.cc/hjJvqsZk/image.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/d1z1QCzL/image.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/j2PjD5bv/image.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/05wjWtwm/image.jpg

[Sharpandpointies]

Oh that's my view as well.

I know. I'm not arguing with you, specifically. There's stuff on this thread that isn't good from both directions.

I personally know almost squat about Parallax, and can't really comment on it. Does Parallax beat Strange? If he's waaaay up on the cosmic ladder, sure, why not? So long as he has the feats (and again, I'm unfamiliar).

Sure, but titles aren't an indication of power. Roma, the omniverse Monitor isn't say omniversal in power.

I'm correcting the comment about Strange, not noting it gives him power.

Eh, it's in continuity now. We have to accept it now.

Again, it's not continuity for Classic Strange. It's also one writer's idea weighed against 40+ years, and I suspect we'll see it get tossed out by the next writer.

Already posted it on the previous page. The universe actually imploded when the reservoir of emotional spectrum was emptied.

The Imgur stuff, I can't see. I guess that's it. I'll maybe look at it when I'm home.

But Sorcerer Supreme had Strange actually competing with Adam Warlock with infinity gauntlet (one gem at a time). I don't think any other run had Strange that powerful.

That's...probably one thing in the entire series which otherwise presented him as pretty weaksauce by comparison to the other series.

And he never overpowered the Infinity Gems. What happens is that Warlock sends him into the future with the time Gem, he uses a spell to return. Warlock sends him far away with the space Gem, he uses a spell to return. Warlock uses the reality Gem to mess with his senses, he uses the Eye to see clearly. Warlock uses the Mind Gem to futz with his memories, Stephen says 'I know you're doing that and I reject the ideas it gives me'.

Then Warlock STARTS using the Power Gem on him, and Stephen calls on everything he has, all of his gear, all of his magic, and momentarily can hold it back. That's it.

It's not exactly 'Stephen manages to win against them, or the Infinity Gauntlet'. It's 'Warlock conjures up a number of effects, some of which are really simplistic, and Stephen manages to not lose, but notes he will if Warlock really wants to squoosh him.'

It's kind of like how he 'manages not to lose' against Dormammu. And as feats go, while it's nice, and yes, with the Power Gem one he talks about 'The power both of us are using would lay waste to multiple worlds', this kind of thing isn't exactly outside his Classic Level of power. It would be, at best, one time where he approached or hit his Classic level. And it's pretty much noted as being 'with all of my magical doodads behind me', which he normally doesn't have when pulling off his most impressive stuff in Dr. Strange MotMA.

[Superfan90]

I know. I'm not arguing with you, specifically. There's stuff on this thread that isn't good from both directions.

I personally know almost squat about Parallax, and can't really comment on it. Does Parallax beat Strange? If he's waaaay up on the cosmic ladder, sure, why not? So long as he has the feats (and again, I'm unfamiliar).



I'm correcting the comment about Strange, not noting it gives him power.



Again, it's not continuity for Classic Strange. It's also one writer's idea weighed against 40+ years, and I suspect we'll see it get tossed out by the next writer.



The Imgur stuff, I can't see. I guess that's it. I'll maybe look at it when I'm home.



That's...probably one thing in the entire series which otherwise presented him as pretty weaksauce by comparison to the other series.

And he never overpowered the Infinity Gems. What happens is that Warlock sends him into the future with the time Gem, he uses a spell to return. Warlock sends him far away with the space Gem, he uses a spell to return. Warlock uses the reality Gem to mess with his senses, he uses the Eye to see clearly. Warlock uses the Mind Gem to futz with his memories, Stephen says 'I know you're doing that and I reject the ideas it gives me'.

Then Warlock STARTS using the Power Gem on him, and Stephen calls on everything he has, all of his gear, all of his magic, and momentarily can hold it back. That's it.

It's not exactly 'Stephen manages to win against them, or the Infinity Gauntlet'. It's 'Warlock conjures up a number of effects, some of which are really simplistic, and Stephen manages to not lose.'

It's kind of like how he 'manages not to lose' against Dormammu. And as feats go, while it's nice, and yes, with the Power Gem one he talks about 'The power both of us are using to lay waste to multiple worlds', this kind of thing isn't exactly outside his Classic Level of power. It would be, at best, one time where he approached or hit his Classic level. And it's pretty much noted as being 'with all of my magical doodads behind me', which he normally doesn't have when pulling off his most impressive stuff in Dr. Strange MotMA.

Fair enough. But I don't think even the MoTMA feats would make him beat Parallax. He was never at Spectre level even in that book.

[Sharpandpointies]

Fair enough. But I don't think even the MoTMA feats would make him beat Parallax. He was never at Spectre level even in that book.

No idea.

His best stuff would be things like 'making suns go supernova and eating that supernova in the face', 'casually exploding planets', and 'not dying immediately when fighting Dormammu, and actually forcing Furnace Face to work'. There's also the whole 'Avatar of Eternity' thing, but he did that all of once and it's *wiggles hand* for Strange in terms of being consistent. Thus, I'm loathe to bring it up in Rumbles.

Edit: Also, I guess, knocking Thanos on his ass with a gang-sign bolt of bedevilment. ^_^ But I think that was later.

If we want Strange at his most powerful, it's Black Magic Shuma-Gorath-Consuming Strange, and then we're getting into an area where I'm perfectly happy arguing him against Cosmic Abstracts. ^_^ But that's a different Strange entirely than Classic Strange, and actually bookmarks the end of the Classic Strange era.

[Pendaran]

Fair enough. But I don't think even the MoTMA feats would make him beat Parallax. He was never at Spectre level even in that book.

The entities being "spectre level" still looks to be pretty dubious, and when you're talking about retcons and things like that, it's interesting that you're dipping into both post crisis and new 52 showings.

You post scans that contradict each other even from the same comics at that, having notes of both the Spectre's power dwarfing the guardians, and then being nothing to Ganthet.

This does not make a coherent case for the things you are trying to say.

It seems mostly like you're basically heavily leaning on the Relic arc as compared to a variety of other things as a result.