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  1. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormultt Divine View Post
    Debatable.

    Survival of the fittest is a natural form of survival that even humans acknowledge when documenting and studying nature....
    No?
    Apocalypse launched and attack on NYC which led the the deaths or an unknown number of innocent people in an attempt to start a war between humans and mutants....Evil.

  2. #167
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    you ally yourself with evil because the survival of a species is dependent on it and also you can take responsibility for them and keep them from doing more evil while also advancing global society through scientific development with the only political agenda being the hot take of "racism bad pls no kill us"

    i mean they could have a foreign policy more like america's where they have some mutants drone strike foreign civilians, would that be better
    Quote Originally Posted by ???
    The world has changed, and so have I.

  3. #168
    Fantastic Member Stormultt Divine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    I was simply wondering why you felt the need to include it at all.

    It feels somewhat disrespectful. I'm not sure if that was your intention or not but if you are trying to make a point, having a gif where people are applauding your statement is quite distracting.


    And murdering innocents is pretty much a big NO regardless of what culture you're in.
    I apologize, my intentions aren't to offend you.

  4. #169
    Fantastic Member Stormultt Divine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    Apocalypse launched and attack on NYC which led the the deaths or an unknown number of innocent people in an attempt to start a war between humans and mutants....Evil.
    Politicians sat idly by and let the sentinel program diminish mutant numbers for years, I'd wager their crimes aren't any better.

  5. #170
    Mighty Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    you ally yourself with evil because the survival of a species is dependent on it and also you can take responsibility for them and keep them from doing more evil while also advancing global society through scientific development with the only political agenda being the hot take of "racism bad pls no kill us"
    The interesting thing is that so far those villains have kept their word of leaving humanity alone which was the condition for them being allowed to live on Krakoa.

    i mean they could have a foreign policy more like america's where they have some mutants drone strike foreign civilians, would that be better
    They are no into creating sentinels to persecute people that´s Bolivar Traks thing.
    "The time for subtlety is passing. Now is the time for change." [New Mutants (Vol. 1) #38]

  6. #171
    Kinky Lil' Canine Snoop Dogg's Avatar
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    tfw the state of the world forces ethical compromises in the formation of a functioning and secure state for your people but you still end up with the most ethical nation that offers universal benefits to the world at no actual cost
    Quote Originally Posted by ???
    The world has changed, and so have I.

  7. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormultt Divine View Post
    Stop saying that like its fact, Krakoa does let non-mutant families and spouses onto the island who have connections to the Mutants, so let's just KILL this fable that you all have going around right now.
    Except they have be from mutants families or former mutants. If you're anything else, you're not welcome. Thats the problem.

    Those humans would have been hostile toward him or any other mutant showcasing Krakoa to them, they were thinking on PANEL of ways Krakoa could use their gateways for war, they came armed and ready before they even knew Magneto would be their tour guide so yeah...stop.
    I didn't say the humans were "good," but this doesn't change the circumstance of why Xavier left Magneto there. He was a warning, they're not shy about this message.

    And it really isn't, Humanity reached a point where they were the majority and anything that threatened their little pride and way of thinking and life was deemed evil.
    To Apocalypse humanity existing is an insult. That's why he's ok committing genocide and is ok with killing them as a first resort. Magneto is a scholar inhuman/mutant relations compared to him, that's how psychotic he is.

    Mutants, especially the ones that did not look at all human are/were at risk for imprisonment, experiments or worse, did Earth's mightiest heroes ever really step in to help the normalization of mutants? no, sweetheart...they didn't.
    Apocalypse really isn't someone who does this, he looks out for himself first and foremost. Apocalypse murdering entire nations didn't normalise mutants, he was rightfully feared in multiple nations as gods because he'd kill them.


    So why keep in-fighting and dividing themselves?
    why not come together and create something for people shunned across the globe JUST for them?!
    There's absolutely nothing wrong with that and like someone else stated in this thread, it is only humans ENTITLEMENT that wants to be on that island.
    Feeling entitled to everything because of being used to gaining access to everything around them....well not this time.
    Human privilege and entitlement holds no weight on Krakoa and it's going to rightfully stay that way.
    Xenophobia divides people, not brings them together. Krakoa is a nation, not a social club. Except Krakoa can be for mutants while also allowing other races to be there, tourism and immigration isn't a moral affront. Except it's not about entitlement, there's more to this than simply humans = bad, mutants = good. Krakoa won't let its own citizens vote for their leaders, of course they're not going to let foreigners have any rights.

    Why are you erasing the other races in Marvel Earth from this conversation?

    Politicians sat idly by and let the sentinel program diminish mutant numbers for years, I'd wager their crimes aren't any better.
    But this stance isn't a wash, the argument is that Apocalypse should be rewarded for murdering humans and he is now a politician doing things like that. He's abused his position to manipulate and abuse Excalibur with impunity.
    Last edited by Steel Inquisitor; 07-12-2020 at 05:08 PM.

  8. #173
    Fantastic Member Stormultt Divine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    Except they have be from mutants families or former mutants. If you're anything else, you're not welcome. Thats the problem.
    Yes, they do have to.
    It's their nations policy...Krakoa is a holy land to the Mutants and that should not be questioned or judged by humans...who have their OWN countries and places to live and are universally accepted by their surroundings...



    I didn't say the humans were "good," but this doesn't change the circumstance of why Xavier left Magneto there. He was a warning, they're not shy about this message.
    As I stated before the situation would have went the same way had Magneto and cuckoos not been there, they were smart about it because they knew how predicable the ambassadors would be.



    To Apocalypse humanity existing is an insult. That's why he's ok committing genocide and is ok with killing them as a first resort. Magneto is a scholar inhuman/mutant relations compared to him, that's how psychotic he is.



    Apocalypse really isn't someone who does this, he looks out for himself first and foremost. Apocalypse murdering entire nations didn't normalise mutants, he was rightfully feared in multiple nations as gods because he'd kill them.
    For the most part, Apocalypse and the anti-mutant brigades have some of the same qualities and beliefs vice versa.
    Except those anti-mutant parties are not jailed and held accountable of their actions.

    Until Apocalypse usurps Krakoa which a lot of people thinks he will...I'll hold off on writing him off as hopeless.




    Xenophobia divides people, not brings them together. Krakoa is a nation,
    Krakoa IS a nation, it's OWN nations, their immigration policies are their own, their laws are their own.
    They look at Krakoa as a holy-land and don't want to threaten that, the mutant experience is different from the human experience.

    Humans have 99% of the Earth to live, Not being allowed on Krakoa isn't going to kill anyone or starve any human children.
    It's one nations LAW and that is all.

  9. #174
    Mighty Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop Dogg View Post
    tfw the state of the world forces ethical compromises in the formation of a functioning and secure state for your people but you still end up with the most ethical nation that offers universal benefits to the world at no actual cost
    Agreed, the state of things is not a perfect situation but it´s working and the X-men are actually doing something good for the world by keeping their villains at bay, keeping their super hero world savior missions as X-men and selling medicine that can cure bassically any sickness.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 07-12-2020 at 05:26 PM.
    "The time for subtlety is passing. Now is the time for change." [New Mutants (Vol. 1) #38]

  10. #175
    Incredible Member ARkadelphia's Avatar
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    THREAD: SHOULD MUTANTS HAVE MORE OF A PRESENCE OUTSIDE THE X-BOOKS?


    Yes. It’s about time the mutants start to carry their own weight in-universe
    “The Scarlet Witch is the only thing that will scare them. It’s the only thing they’ll respect.” - Hope Summers, Avengers vs X-Men #7

  11. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormultt Divine View Post
    Yes, they do have to.
    It's their nations policy...Krakoa is a holy land to the Mutants and that should not be questioned or judged by humans...who have their OWN countries and places to live and are universally accepted by their surroundings...
    They choose to, they don't "have" to do anything. Just because the Krkaoa governmentt have power don't make them right because they have power. Numerous countries do horrible acts under the color of authority, like oppressing mutants. The question is if it's ethical and it's not. There are no mutants from Marvel in this conversation, just two humans from ours. There's nothing divine in Krakoa, its not Asgard or Wakanda. It thrives on science.



    As I stated before the situation would have went the same way had Magneto and cuckoos not been there, they were smart about it because they knew how predicable the ambassadors would be.
    Humanity could have only bought mutant supporters and got this reaction. It was intimidation.





    For the most part, Apocalypse and the anti-mutant brigades have some of the same qualities and beliefs vice versa.
    Except those anti-mutant parties are not jailed and held accountable of their actions.
    Since when has Apocalypse been jailed for anything? His power is so immense and he's so slick he's impossible to contain. They do share the same qualities, except Apcoalypse committed genocide akin to the Sentinels as a whole against every type of life in Marvel, including mutants. We've seen when he's able to "win" then we get into dystopia Age of Apocalypse settings, and Krkaoa is giving him the tools do build another on its foundations. Mutant life is valued less in Krakoa than having the mutant gene.

    Until Apocalypse usurps Krakoa which a lot of people thinks he will...I'll hold off on writing him off as hopeless.
    Please don't cherry pick, he's shown to be untrustworthy with what I told you. Don't erase the majority of his appearances as a super-villain.






    Krakoa IS a nation, it's OWN nations, their immigration policies are their own, their laws are their own.
    They look at Krakoa as a holy-land and don't want to threaten that, the mutant experience is different from the human experience.

    Humans have 99% of the Earth to live, Not being allowed on Krakoa isn't going to kill anyone or starve any human children.
    It's one nations LAW and that is all.
    So are Ameica's and Europes, doesn't make any of their bad policies about discrimination or oppressing right. The thing with Krakoa is that the status quo is flipped, the mutants are the ones doing the oppressing now. Including to their own kind, if any mutant wants to elect new leaders to the Quiet Council they're out of luck.
    Last edited by Steel Inquisitor; 07-12-2020 at 05:55 PM.

  12. #177
    Astonishing Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    They choose to, they don't "have" to do anything. Just because the Krkaoa governmentt have power don't make them right because they have power. Numerous countries do horrible acts under the color of authority, like oppressing mutants.
    Which group of people are Krakoa oppressing right the f--k now? There were no native inhabitants of Krakoa who were displaced by the X-Men.

    Again this is just shadow-kvetching. Kvetch at an imaginary projection of Krakoa rather than the one in the books (which so many here clearly don't read).

  13. #178
    Fantastic Member Stormultt Divine's Avatar
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    Krakoa is racist!
    Krakoa is xenophobic
    Krakoa is oppressive!

    Meanwhile on Krakoa


    Mutants are only trying to build a stable home and atmosphere for mutant children who have been abused at the hands of humans under human law.
    AS another user stated...it's human entitlement to want to be on an island Mutants just moved to...for safety and sanctuary.

  14. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormultt Divine View Post
    Meanwhile on Krakoa


    Mutants are only trying to build a stable home and atmosphere for mutant children who have been abused at the hands of humans under human law.
    AS another user stated...it's human entitlement to want to be on an island Mutants just moved to...for safety and sanctuary.
    WE hear about this, but who has been a success? Why hasn't anyone did this sort of thing to the super-villain community? Instead we get this



    and




    Just two known incidents. How is this possible?

    As well as the fact mutants in high authority in the government abusing their positions against other mutants isn't worth acknowledging. We're supposed to buy that in order for mutants to have a safe home in Krkao they have to be xenophobic to non-mutants, it's nonsense.

  15. #180
    Fantastic Member Stormultt Divine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Inquisitor View Post
    WE hear about this, but who has been a success? Why hasn't anyone did this sort of thing to the super-villain community? Instead we get this



    and




    Just two known incidents. How is this possible?

    As well as the fact mutants in high authority in the government abusing their positions against other mutants isn't worth acknowledging. We're supposed to buy that in order for mutants to have a safe home in Krkao they have to be xenophobic to non-mutants, it's nonsense.

    Krakoa has a lot of internal issues to work through.....but WHAT community or nation does not?
    Name a perfect place and I'll concede.

    Plus why are you pushing so hard for humans to around known x-men villains who are 'evil' and the like....please let me know.
    The nonsense is humans wanting to immediately get up and move somewhere just cause when they have the whole planet to themselves.

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