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  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I think this is the first time I've seen anyone complain about that death.
    It was hugely controversial back then.

    Hasbro decided to move on to new G1 toys and the decision was made to kill Prime in the movie and discontinue his toys.

    Hasbro and the producers got so much backlash that they had to change the end of the G.I Joe movie. A movie which had been finished already (Duke died originally but they later changed it to him being unconscious or something).

    They underestimated how much Prime meant to us at the time.
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  2. #137
    Extraordinary Member Cyke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    It was hugely controversial back then.

    Hasbro decided to move on to new G1 toys and the decision was made to kill Prime in the movie and discontinue his toys.

    Hasbro and the producers got so much backlash that they had to change the end of the G.I Joe movie. A movie which had been finished already (Duke died originally but they later changed it to him being unconscious or something).

    They underestimated how much Prime meant to us at the time.
    Just to reinforce this post, here's a bit of a deeper dive, and even some slight back-stage drama, about the death of Optimus.

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoganAlpha30X33 View Post
    Yes she did, that death was bad especially since it wasn't so that Carmen and Rico could get back together either
    I had rather they killed off Carmen. I couldn't stand her, but loved Dizzy. But I still love watching Starship Troopers in spite of her death.

  4. #139

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Just to reinforce this post, here's a bit of a deeper dive, and even some slight back-stage drama, about the death of Optimus.
    I always had a theory on this based on the size of the toys. Ultra Magnus and Galvatron were the same size and listed as "City Commanders". Rodimus was the same size as Cyclonus and simply listed as "Autobot Hero." I think Hasbro intended for Ultra Magnus to be the true replacement for Prime, and wanted the movie to convey this, and in preparation for this made the toys as such. But I figured a writer said "nah" and created Rodimus, and Hasbro had to create a toy for him after the fact. That writer, was Ron Friedman.

    He couldn't break the edict of killing Optimus, so I think he tried to mitigate it by replacing him with a sort of "teenager". Watching his interviews, I think I can gleam why. Here's one. Basically both Autobots and Decepticons are families, only the 'bots were a "good" family, and the 'cons were a "bad" family. But in any good family, when the father figure dies, sometimes the oldest child has to step up to the plate. Or an uncle (Magnus) until the child is ready. This is juxtaposed when the "bad" family lost its "patriarch", almost instant in-fighting for control until said patriarch returned.

    Its all fascinating because, I didn't realize it until your link/watching Friedman's interviews, he carefully crafted Optimus Prime as a father figure. HASBRO DID NOT UNDERSTAND THAT, so they didn't think anything of killing him off to push more toys.

  5. #140
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username taken View Post
    It was hugely controversial back then.

    Hasbro decided to move on to new G1 toys and the decision was made to kill Prime in the movie and discontinue his toys.

    Hasbro and the producers got so much backlash that they had to change the end of the G.I Joe movie. A movie which had been finished already (Duke died originally but they later changed it to him being unconscious or something).

    They underestimated how much Prime meant to us at the time.
    I think they even animated a funeral scene for Duke that they cut out of the movie.

    I believe there was added narration saying "Optimus Prime will return" after the controversy over Prime's death. I don't know if it was retroactively added with the theatrical run or the DVD release or only when they planned out the "Return of Optimus Prime" arc in season 3.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Just to reinforce this post, here's a bit of a deeper dive, and even some slight back-stage drama, about the death of Optimus.
    Jeez, as bad as the deaths in the movie were, I could only imagine how bad it would've been to see all the other classic Autobots die charging into a hail of laser blasts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Grey View Post
    I always had a theory on this based on the size of the toys. Ultra Magnus and Galvatron were the same size and listed as "City Commanders". Rodimus was the same size as Cyclonus and simply listed as "Autobot Hero." I think Hasbro intended for Ultra Magnus to be the true replacement for Prime, and wanted the movie to convey this, and in preparation for this made the toys as such. But I figured a writer said "nah" and created Rodimus, and Hasbro had to create a toy for him after the fact. That writer, was Ron Friedman.

    He couldn't break the edict of killing Optimus, so I think he tried to mitigate it by replacing him with a sort of "teenager". Watching his interviews, I think I can gleam why. Here's one. Basically both Autobots and Decepticons are families, only the 'bots were a "good" family, and the 'cons were a "bad" family. But in any good family, when the father figure dies, sometimes the oldest child has to step up to the plate. Or an uncle (Magnus) until the child is ready. This is juxtaposed when the "bad" family lost its "patriarch", almost instant in-fighting for control until said patriarch returned.

    Its all fascinating because, I didn't realize it until your link/watching Friedman's interviews, he carefully crafted Optimus Prime as a father figure. HASBRO DID NOT UNDERSTAND THAT, so they didn't think anything of killing him off to push more toys.
    I remember they were comparing the movie to Star Wars, so they might have wanted to have a Hero's Journey type story with Hot Rod where he loses his mentor and then becomes this big hero. "Arise Rodimus Prime" was his "use the force, Luke" moment.

  6. #141
    Mighty Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synestra View Post
    I never watched The 100, but the amount of backlash that show got for killing Lexa is well known even outside of its fandom. It was all over the internet and came up in numerous panels at various Cons.
    I know I already addressed what really happened with Lexa and why she was killed with you. But my wife had never seen the show so with the series winding down to the end now, just a few weeks left before the series finale, she and I are watching it again from the beginning.

    From the the first season there are exactly five, just five, characters out of dozens introduced that are still alive today on the show: Clarke, Bellamy, Octavia, Murphy, and Raven. So many seemingly main characters were killed off early, my wife couldn't believe they killed Wells since the show seemed to indicating a Clarke / Finn / Wells love triangle early on. We just reached season two so I'm really anxious to see her reaction to Finn's death. I told her this show was Game of Thrones only worse as far as killing off main characters and told her that only five of the ones she was seeing were still alive - she only guessed two of them right - Clarke and Bellamy.

    It just made me think even more how unfair the bashing this show took for Lexa was because this show kills nearly everyone except those five. The only characters introduced in season two that are still alive are Indra, Miller, and Emori. Meanwhile a few dozen more new characters including Lexa get introduced in season II only to be killed off at some point in the future.

  7. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I remember they were comparing the movie to Star Wars, so they might have wanted to have a Hero's Journey type story with Hot Rod where he loses his mentor and then becomes this big hero. "Arise Rodimus Prime" was his "use the force, Luke" moment.
    That doesn't fit anything Friedman has said, though. The closest is that when he told Hasbro that this was a bad idea their response was they had "great things planned" which even he interpreted as selling toys. HE was the one who conceived Rodimus, so the family dynamic (I basically quoted him verbatim from that link I posted) wouldn't be broken since Hasbro was going to be hard headed about this. It could have become that (a hero's journey) but that wasn't the original intention.

    Side note: for those who think he didn't have that kind of pull, remember he also created Arcee and Unicron.

  8. #143
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    Cottonmouth in Luke Cage

  9. #144
    Northern Lights Beaubier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    I thought her death was great because it gave Dexter actual consequences.
    Not really. Nothing really came of it. Cody and Astor got dumped, and Dexter thought helping Lumen absolved him for Rita. Not to mention the whole Lumen season was godawful.

  10. #145
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    Baz and Smurf on Animal Kingdom. I liked having the whole crazy family working together.

  11. #146
    Paranoid Android ChadH's Avatar
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    Lol. This whole thread is just one great big spoiler.
    The Cover Contest Weekly Winners Thread So much winning!!

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  12. #147

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    Generation X here: Killing off Eddie Torres (Michael DeLorenzo) in New York Undercover was a mistake. The show was produced by Dick Wolf, through Universal as the studio, but Fox was the network. This happened at the end of the third season when a white officer, Tommy McNamara (Jonathan LaPaglia) was made a co-partner to Torres, Williams (Malik Yoba) and Moreno (Lauren Velez). A female terrorist ended up killing McNamara and Torres in the final episode. The follow up season took place in the winter, 13 episodes. This time, the surviving Williams and Moreno were now not simply based in Harlem for their assignments, but were on a 'special city wide task force' that was headed up by the arrogant Lieutenant Malcolm Barker (Tommy Ford). There were also two new white officers as co-partners. This set up really did not work and the original fans did not buy into it. Wolf and Fox executives were trying to get more mainstream (read: white) fans with all the drastic changes that were made, but ultimately the show didn't grow the audience and the core audience simply lost interest. This is before Internet outrage had the potential to change things (for better or worse)..

  13. #148
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caj View Post
    Baz and Smurf on Animal Kingdom. I liked having the whole crazy family working together.
    The series has been downright charitable compared to the film.

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by caj View Post
    I loved Starship Troopers when it came out in the late 90s but I didn't like that they killed off Dizzy. She was one of my favorite characters in the film.
    Ouch, mate, that was a real bullseye. I do recall when I watched to movie first time, I really liked her and Rico would be better with this girl, than that hoity-toity pilot girl. And when she said something like "I was happy that I had you" when dying, that was sweet and horrible at the same time.

  15. #150
    Astonishing Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadH View Post
    Madison and Nick Clark in Fear the Walking Dead.
    When they killed the only two remaining interesting characters the show became unwatchable for me.

    Going back a ways to Highlander: the Series, the death of Ritchie Ryan, especially the way it was written piss me and a lot of other fans off.


    There's been rumors over a few years that Madison could come back, since we don't see her die directly or a zombie version (although we do see a lot of charred zombies when they return to the stadium, and one of them could've been her. Daniel also seemed to perish in a fire too but showed up in the next season alive if not all that well.
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