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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    You're forgetting her power to turn intangible, which most pyrokinetics can't do.

    I wouldn't even say her original power set was original. Just a mish mash of unconnectd powers.
    Regardless, wasn't her role in the Giffen/Dematteis Leagues what pushed her into a higher level of fandom?

  2. #32
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    Black Canary: people tend to forget that she started out as a fairly generic martial acrobat in a wig. Her Canary Cry was added when they moved her to E1 to join the JL. Good call.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    Black Canary: people tend to forget that she started out as a fairly generic martial acrobat in a wig. Her Canary Cry was added when they moved her to E1 to join the JL. Good call.
    One of the best.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Darknight Detective View Post
    I don't consider anything from the show's universe worth talking about in this context, since that was a de facto comedy (even nominated for an Emmy as such!)
    Beg your pardon but then why did you agree with KNIGHT OF THE LAKE when they first brought it up?

    Anyway, I'll add Dolphin's bio-luminescence power. It was a great way to add distinction to her power-set in terms of what she brings to the table and also provides a way for her to communicate despite her muteness.
    Last edited by hareluyafan1; 07-26-2020 at 10:19 AM.

  5. #35
    DC/Collected Editions Mod The Darknight Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hareluyafan1 View Post
    Beg your pardon but then why did you agree with KNIGHT OF THE LAKE when they first brought it up?
    I was referring to serious Batman, not funny Bats.
    A bat! That's it! It's an omen.. I'll shall become a bat!

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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    Black Canary: people tend to forget that she started out as a fairly generic martial acrobat in a wig. Her Canary Cry was added when they moved her to E1 to join the JL. Good call.
    Ooh yeah. I've always had a weakness for those golden age two-fisted adventurer type heroes who were '1 gimmick and a mean right hook,' with the 'gimmick' ranging from blackout bombs to a sleep-gas gun to the canary cry. Most fights can be handled with just fisticuffs, but when it hits the fan and a next level threat shows up, there's the equalizer!

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrNewGod View Post
    Black Canary: people tend to forget that she started out as a fairly generic martial acrobat in a wig. Her Canary Cry was added when they moved her to E1 to join the JL. Good call.
    Actually, I don't mind her without it. I mean, I like it fine, but it's not essential to me. Probably because I read a lot of her bronze age, when it wasn't used all that often for several years. Definitely don't like the singer angle used more recently. My bronze age love also means I hated her being split into two people (mother/daughter), unlike most who love it. There were a couple weird one-offs in that era, too, such as one story where she could briefly pick up thoughts for some reason, as I recall. But one-offs really don't have the lasting impact I was going for here.
    Last edited by Tzigone; 07-26-2020 at 11:45 AM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    Actually, I don't mind her without it. I mean, I like it fine, but it's not essential to me. Probably because I read a lot of her bronze age, when it wasn't used all that often for several years. Definitely don't like the singer angle used more recently. My bronze age love also means I hated her being split into two people (mother/daughter), unlike most who love it. There were a couple weird one-offs in that era, too, such as one story where she could briefly pick up thoughts for some reason, as I recall. But one-offs really don't have the lasting impact I was going for here.
    It gave her a way to stand out in the JL. The JSA she was part of were mostly low-wattage types (The Atom [until he got inexplicably superstrong], Dr. Midnight, Hawkman), so it wasn't such an issue.

    Going back to the OP, Ultra Boy was originally introduced as only having his various Ultra Vision powers. The rest of the Kryptonian Suite came later, and IIRC his not using those other abilities in his first outing was explained away as being part of his initiation test to join the Legion.

  9. #39
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    When did Wonder Woman get the power to fly? To me that is a great one since I have always thought the invisible plane was just beyond stupid, and am happy it has been phased out in favor of Diana just being bale to actually fly instead.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Hunter View Post
    When did Wonder Woman get the power to fly? To me that is a great one since I have always thought the invisible plane was just beyond stupid, and am happy it has been phased out in favor of Diana just being bale to actually fly instead.
    She could "glide on air currents" as early as 1958. But she still used the invisible jet to get to places faster than air currents could take her. Eventually her floating around just got accepted as full blown super speed style flight. And later it just got wrapped up into her sandals that give her Hermes' speed and flight.

  11. #41
    DC/Collected Editions Mod The Darknight Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Hunter View Post
    When did Wonder Woman get the power to fly? To me that is a great one since I have always thought the invisible plane was just beyond stupid, and am happy it has been phased out in favor of Diana just being bale to actually fly instead.
    There was nothing stupid about the plane itself. What was stupid, however, was artwork or the old show having Wondy being seen within it.
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  12. #42
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Darknight Detective View Post
    There was nothing stupid about the plane itself. What was stupid, however, was artwork or the old show having Wondy being seen within it.
    That is problematic. Though even an outline would still be kinda visible. And actual invisibility would give us boring panels of empty sky. And having a cool gadget and never showing it would be less fun for kids reading, I'd think.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Darknight Detective View Post
    There was nothing stupid about the plane itself. What was stupid, however, was artwork or the old show having Wondy being seen within it.
    Yeah an invisible jet is cool, but seeing the passengers just floating along is goofy and defeats the purpose.
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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    Giving any speedster actual lightning powers. The absolutely stupidest thing.
    I don't really care for that either, they already have an array of cool and devastating powers.
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  15. #45
    duke's casettetape lemonpeace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Korath View Post
    The Signal's current dark powers. They aren't bad per se, and are fitting for a Bat-family meta... but they are a downgrade for me compared to his light powers which made him more unique and linked to many an Immortal, which opened plenty of possibilities for Duke as a solo character.
    I was just about to pick this one, but I would go a step further and say that the darkness powers are actually detrimental to the character because it muddies the waters for a character that is still establishing themselves. what makes the shadow powers a problem is two fold:

    for one, the darkness powers have zero tangible effect on anything. with his light powers they have a tangible effect, they allow him to see things others can't see, making him a better detective, and they make him a better fighter. on the other hand we have the shadow powers that appear to do nothing but have Duke be a distraction while other characters do the actual fighting. that relegates him to a permanent second class role because it appears he can't win a battle without someone else there to do the actual work; which isn't interesting to see in a character that was pitched to audiences as Batman training a new up and coming hero.

    the second thing is, it throws everything they've built up for Duke out the window. the light powers served a thematic purpose, Duke is supposed to be a counterpoint to the usual shadowy bat archetype of Batman. that idea of him being the opposite of Batman thematically is why his suit is the way it is: why it's bright, why it's yellow and black as an opposite to the black and yellow of Batman's N52 chest symbol, why his chest symbol is reflective, it all is to highlight that motif of light to contract the Batfamily's darkness (which has always been my problem with Duke's costume having so much bat iconography but that's a different story). the "brilliant" idea to demote him to just another shadowy bat which these nebulous shadow powers undercuts that. then that's coupled with how they have been used to give him less agency in the field, it pushes the character further into the background as just another shadowy bat-character which is antithetical to what the character is supposed to represent.

    they don't symbolize anything, they don't do anything, and they don't generate intrigue for the character, so what's the point of changing something so fundamental to the character? there doesnt appear to be any rhyme or reason for it it just feels like Hill wanted to nix the light powers because he thought the shadow thing would be cool, and it's objectively not. by nixing that unique element of his character it muddies the waters as to what this character is supposed to be and decreases the likelihood of him growing in his identity and establishing himself. for a character this relatively unrefined, that kind of mixed messaging is not something they can afford so early in their career. add on top of that that he has spent every issue of Hill's run getting beaten up, punked, and/or generally having no agency, it all amounts to effectively just character assassination whether Hill intended to do it or not.
    Last edited by lemonpeace; 07-26-2020 at 06:45 PM.
    THE SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist so I made him a fandom wiki

    also, check out "The Signal Tape" a Duke Thomas fan project.

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    "power does not corrupt, power always reveals."

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