[Theory] - Have the Mutants been actually tricked?

[Sylarmax]

The point is .
What they say is true is a matter of time before all this explodes in their faces.
Krakoa villain paradise is a terrible idea

[Rev9]

That's funny as hell being that Apocalypse can't actually die.

Ikr? I know Krakoa has this cool new Xerox machine,but for one it is lame that immortal characters are being killed to get in line with the rest
Secondly it robs us audience of a better pov of these very immortals discussing if the Krakoa project is viable or not. Apoc may not give a rat's ass but I expect Sinister and Exodus to chime in and give perspective and wise counsel on whether this is sustainable or at the very least discuss the implication of going through the process dependent on others to resurrect you instead of having the power of immortality within yourself-imbued with this gift and identity! I hope it can still happen.

[Will Evans]

New theory: Krakoa storyline will culminate in a battle between those mutants who have been raised from the dead by the five on Krakoa and those that moved straight there without dying. One of these two groups is “not right” and it will be interesting to see which one.

Who would be in the latter group?

Magneto, Emma, Sebastian, Exodus, Sinister, Apocalypse, Storm?

[Rev9]

Who would be in the latter group?

Magneto, Emma, Sebastian, Exodus, Sinister, Apocalypse, Storm?

Apocalypse has already been resurrected off panel (weird I know) but yeah all the rest are pretty much the squad.

But on the topic ,let's go through some of the serious mis-steps

1.Mystique being strung along when she already has been warned by Destiny to blow the whole island to kingdom come

2.Sinister being given the keys to the kingdom,he can totally screw everyone over with the flick of a gene and they won't know what hit them

3.Moira playing the Machiavellian game with Xavier and Magnus,they think they've got it figured out yet they are but pawns in her scheme.Incredibly I think because of her vast knowledge and recall,Xavier cannot read her mind like he can others.I'm speculating that it's not just because he absolutely believes her but even if he doubted, with her looking for a ruse would be like looking for a grain of sand on a beach.

5.Looking back at life 6, Scott may have absolutely screwed the X-Men with the CoV suicide mission,Darwin ,Laura and Synch could come out of there hacked and evolved by the vault to the point they are not mutants and kickstart homo novissima right with that 'trinity'

There could be more points like Kitty not being resurrected or being able to enter Krakoan gates implies the system is not flawless or Krakoa as an entity is selective in its hospitality.

[Ursalink]

Re–read the stories you are mentioning because you are missing points that makes your theory unrealistic. First, the Librarian explains in detail how he is not gonna kill Moira but send her outside of Hearth not only to avoid that her death reset the timeline, but because once the phalanx will assimilate Hearth they will know of her even if she dies because the exist out of time and can kill her in the past. He just didn't imagine Wolverine would have been able to kill him. Additionally, the Phalanx is only interested in assimilating highly technologically evolved species, and starting the war a bit sooner won't make up for 10 thousands year of that. Finally, both the Librarian and the Phalanx don't care about time or the concept of "sooner", so they wouldn't care about "speeding up" events.

How are you sure of that? The Librarian could have simply lied Moira, because if he knew about Moira's abilities, he should have guessed she only needed to kill herself to reset the timeline. Wolverine's actions were irrelevant, as he already tricked Moira. And yes, they would be interested into speeding things because they would be interested in eliminating mutants because they are a serious obstacle to their "mission", and once the mutants are erradicated, humanity convertion into "homo novissima" will take its natural course without "interferences". Otherwise, why do you think Moira didn't success in her previous 3 lifes to avoid it. Because the Phalanx could actually be already altering events to stop her.

[Micabe]

the point is ... he couldn't help it.
As she put her hands on top of him he couldn't do anything anymore.


in addition that Rogue has knocked down much more powerful characters than Apocalypse.
so that's nothing strange


in fact she absorbed the full power of all the heroes on the planet when she is in control.

What?!? Rogue has never absorbed the full power of all the heroes on the planet.

[Rev9]

I've never heard of that either, maybe Sylarmax means the 8 billion minds she absorbed from the Hecatomb in XmL #199

[numberthirty]

Apocalypse has already been resurrected off panel (weird I know) but yeah all the rest are pretty much the squad.

But on the topic ,let's go through some of the serious mis-steps

1.Mystique being strung along when she already has been warned by Destiny to blow the whole island to kingdom come

2.Sinister being given the keys to the kingdom,he can totally screw everyone over with the flick of a gene and they won't know what hit them

3.Moira playing the Machiavellian game with Xavier and Magnus,they think they've got it figured out yet they are but pawns in her scheme.Incredibly I think because of her vast knowledge and recall,Xavier cannot read her mind like he can others.I'm speculating that it's not just because he absolutely believes her but even if he doubted, with her looking for a ruse would be like looking for a grain of sand on a beach.

5.Looking back at life 6, Scott may have absolutely screwed the X-Men with the CoV suicide mission,Darwin ,Laura and Synch could come out of there hacked and evolved by the vault to the point they are not mutants and kickstart homo novissima right with that 'trinity'

There could be more points like Kitty not being resurrected or being able to enter Krakoan gates implies the system is not flawless or Krakoa as an entity is selective in its hospitality.

If Destiny has any value to her at all, there is no misstep.

[Rev9]

If Destiny has any value to her at all, there is no misstep.

True, but I mean from Magnus and Xavier perspective, they know what is at stake by choosing to have Mystique on the council and not giving her what she wants, they've dug themselves into a hole.They should not have accepted Mystique on Krakoa in the first place,instead of an enemy without who they could keep at bay,they have an enemy within.Offcourse as a reader I'm excited but I can't believe X and Magnus would be this dumb

[Steel Inquisitor]

what happens to every non xmen book? new mutants, x factor, x force, excalibur, etc etc ? do they get shoved into the mansion too? or they get trown around random locations that have no actual interest because for so many years the xmen were stuck in a stinky mansion witout many interesting locals.

No, they get their own locations, again, and have ongoing titles like they had before. X-men's been a massive franchise rivalling Spider-man, Superman and Batman ever since Claremont. They'll get very long series, reboots, one shots and mini-series like they do now. All those titles have had successful runs, many of them have been rebooted more than once.

Did you like any period of X-men before Krakoa?

is the mansion big enough for literaly an entire island of characters? what happens then?
oh wait, i know what happens, most of those will be canceled, put into limbo and used as wallpapper, any young mutant that had a shred of development will be reduced to a student status as a new writer makes up new students to be his pets, the stories will return to a spinning weel of rotating and repetitive villains that get not change whatsover because nostalgia is king.
until it reaches under 20 k sales then its time to reboot.

They get their own titles and live elsewhere, like they did before or find new locations. Characters are "wallpaper" as we speak, look at how Polaris fans have reacted to her status - they're not happy. Jean fans aren't, either. Bobbi Da Costa got a demotion when he came back to the X-men titles, he's back in New Mutants when he should be on the Quiet Council or in the X-Corps, after he founded and lead two Avengers teams!

The villains have growth in Krakoa, sort of, but changed? No. Nothing was going to stop Shaw icing Kitty, or Apocalypse abusing his "minions." All the rotating villains are in the titles right now. Nimrod even coming back! Nimrod!

we do know whats that like, the period after schism and especially utopia, where we went from an array of characters getting used and exploring the city of san francisco instead of all being clumped up in a mansion, allowed for teams such as x force, new mutants and x factor to have a level of space while remaining conected to the overarching narrative, once everyone was shoved into a mansion the conections that should have become stronger became weaker, any potential is strangled out becuase you know sentinels or purifiers will kill students and make the mansion explode.

Technically the “mansion” was active during that period when Wolverine left Utopia to create the Jean Grey School for Higher Learning.

Every time the xmen return to a status quo after a level of actual inovation, they suck, they suck immensly.
It sucked in the 90s, it sucked after utopia, it sucked in xmen gold, the mansion is a stiffle for the franchise.

The mansion built the franchise into the juggernaut it is today, that's why it's hard to get rid of. And that's not the limits of modern X-men status quo's, its having nations. Krakoa isn't the first time they've done this.

Krakoa is for the entire concept of mutants and all its difrent titles, its not just for the x-men and thats what many of you need to understand, the main team of superheroe dummies may return to the mansion sure, but if you remove krakoa you lose more than you win and thats a pure fact.

Krakao just expanded the Utopia concept and merged it with Genosha. That's your opinion, not fact.

Krakoa has done more to revitalize the franchise with new villains, visuals and stories than the mansion has in decades, because no matter how you change its name and layout, its still a forgetable base of operations that only worked when the xmen were barely above the double digit membership.
but even then it grew into a bigger school, krakoa is another change.

That's not Krakoa, that's Hickman's vision. Without good writers this all fails, where they live isn't the reason why titles are good or bad.

your last paragraph is immensly silly as well in theory, the 5 have 3 omega level mutants, one called freaking hope summers that in a mutant vs mutant fight is pratically unbeatable, if they want to take down anyone they can.

Nothing is unbeatable in comics, and they have villains new and old who could do this. Apocalypse and Sinister are known for soloing entire large rosters of X-men.

[jwatson]

No. It's safe survival and planning to interact with humanity vs being a target where buses of children are blown up, a whole island of mutants is decimated and your home is attacked every single week as though property laws mean nothing. Who is really running the con in the MU. I would say the avengers and the U.S. government. Countries are killing their own citizens or forcing them into servitude and no one is saying boo or doing a thing. Where is the marvel congress? Where is the senate? Where is the president?! In my opinion any tax paying mutant is being FAR too kind with how the laws of the land are treating them. Is there no constitution in marvel comics? At what point is it no longer the world outside your window? When it comes to rights?

[PeterParked]

How are you sure of that? The Librarian could have simply lied Moira, because if he knew about Moira's abilities, he should have guessed she only needed to kill herself to reset the timeline. Wolverine's actions were irrelevant, as he already tricked Moira. And yes, they would be interested into speeding things because they would be interested in eliminating mutants because they are a serious obstacle to their "mission", and once the mutants are erradicated, humanity convertion into "homo novissima" will take its natural course without "interferences". Otherwise, why do you think Moira didn't success in her previous 3 lifes to avoid it. Because the Phalanx could actually be already altering events to stop her.

Homo novissima arise exactly because of mutants, so eradicating them wouldn’t speed up their advent, all the contrary.

She failed 3 times because she is trying to accomplish something very complicated: making a tiny minority hated and feared survive despite the rest of world population wanting them dead. How many “lives” have been spent, for example, fighting for racial equality in the USA? We are still well behind the goal though. 3 lives are not that much for something like that.

[Ursalink]

Homo novissima arise exactly because of mutants, so eradicating them wouldn’t speed up their advent, all the contrary.

She failed 3 times because she is trying to accomplish something very complicated: making a tiny minority hated and feared survive despite the rest of world population wanting them dead. How many “lives” have been spent, for example, fighting for racial equality in the USA? We are still well behind the goal though. 3 lives are not that much for something like that.

After humanity exterminates mutants, their would still be paranoia until the possibility of them returning somehow, so they would still "evolve" into Homo Novissima to avoid another danger like the Mutatns to appear again.

The X-Men have always acted wrong in their tries to be accepted. First of all, they reject the idea of a cure, even when it was obvious that some mutantions are EXTREMLY too dangerous to be allowed to exist. So instead of accepting they have to remove such potential danger, they left it be until it blows up, causing a disaster that increase humanity's hate over them. Professor X is also the worst's greatest hypocrist, as he talk about being accepted, but even before his current status quo, he already manipulated people with his powers for his own gain. Reading someone's mind is like reading your daughter's diary, a clear violation of privacy. Also, they know evil mutants like Magneto, Mr Sinister and Apocalypse would always make troubles that will cause humanity to hate mutants. So, they take them out? No, they let them continue to cause disasters. Just like Batman does with the Joker.

[jwatson]

After humanity exterminates mutants, their would still be paranoia until the possibility of them returning somehow, so they would still "evolve" into Homo Novissima to avoid another danger like the Mutatns to appear again.

The X-Men have always acted wrong in their tries to be accepted. First of all, they reject the idea of a cure, even when it was obvious that some mutantions are EXTREMLY too dangerous to be allowed to exist. So instead of accepting they have to remove such potential danger, they left it be until it blows up, causing a disaster that increase humanity's hate over them. Professor X is also the worst's greatest hypocrist, as he talk about being accepted, but even before his current status quo, he already manipulated people with his powers for his own gain. Reading someone's mind is like reading your daughter's diary, a clear violation of privacy. Also, they know evil mutants like Magneto, Mr Sinister and Apocalypse would always make troubles that will cause humanity to hate mutants. So, they take them out? No, they let them continue to cause disasters. Just like Batman does with the Joker.

Hmm thinking about it this could be a good idea. Lets have Xavier and them create a cure for human hate and bias using Krakoan flowers. After all human hate and bias are the most dangerous things in the world. I am sure the many humans in the MU will jump at the chance to be able to think and approach the mutant situation free of all hate and bias.

Ohh or better yet, if dangerous mutants agree to a cure humans have to agree to getting rid of all their destructive weapons as well. Lets level the playing field. Magneto would be happy to dispose of them for them. Then EVERYONE can be safe. Because if there is no dangerous mutants surely humanity will love them and if there are no weapons surely mutants will feel safe enough to cure their ticking time bombs.

[Ursalink]

Hmm thinking about it this could be a good idea. Lets have Xavier and them create a cure for human hate and bias using Krakoan flowers. After all human hate and bias are the most dangerous things in the world. I am sure the many humans in the MU will jump at the chance to be able to think and approach the mutant situation free of all hate and bias.

Ohh or better yet, if dangerous mutants agree to a cure humans have to agree to getting rid of all their destructive weapons as well. Lets level the playing field. Magneto would be happy to dispose of them for them. Then EVERYONE can be safe. Because if there is no dangerous mutants surely humanity will love them and if there are no weapons surely mutants will feel safe enough to cure their ticking time bombs.

You really are blind, don't you? Magneto's power can invert the magnetic poles of Earth, which will cause an ecological catastrophe that could cause all life on Earth to die. Rogue's powers makes her incapable of touching anyone with her hands (except maybe Asgardians and some others), so her mutation is not a bless, but a curse. Proteus (Kevin MacTaggert) is literally a psychic vampire that turns his victims into undead zombies, how can you say that mutation shouldn't be cured? Not to mention his ability to warp reality can cause the end of the world at any time. Sure, there are mutations that are a bless, like Wolverine's healing factor, and it could be used to save a lot of lives; but some other mutations are too dangerous to allow them to exist.

Also, the whole thing about Mutants hating Scarlet Witch, what's the big idea? It was MAGNETO who used her for years and made her believe she was her daughter and a Mutant. It was of Magneto's manipulations that Scarlet Witch came to a breaking point and decided to erase Mutants from Earth. It's MAGNETO who should be hated, because he manipulated Wanda; while Wanda was merely a victim and a tool of his plots.