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  1. #1
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    Default How would you rate Nick Lowe's run as Spider-Editor?

    The title says it all. How do you feel about Nick Lowe's run as Spider-Editor compared to Steven Wacker? Has he been able to grow the Spider-Titles? Did he bring new ideas that has helped with sales? Post your comments....

  2. #2
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    It's really hard to judge what makes a good editor in comics, and in Spider-Man.

    Generally, the best editor in Spider-Man titles is considered to be Jim Salicrup. Salicrup was rated highly by Stern, Defalco, Michelinie. He was the one who commissioned and supported KLH and made the decision to tell a single story across all monthly Spider-Man titles, the first time it ever happened. He also encouraged Todd Macfarlane to do his own comic and tell his own stories and that led to the (then) best selling single issue of all time. So if we use Salicrup as a model, then I don't think either Wacker or Lowe measure up to the heights of that.

    Stephen Wacker in technical terms was more of an innovator. He was the one who oversaw ASM going thrice-monthly and co-ordinated the BND team. The actual quality of the stories though was inconsistent and forgettable in the main. At the same time, Wacker can't be entirely blamed since the reason for that was OMD and that was decided before he came along so there's a qualifier there for him. But Wacker also gets some demerits for his celebrity-like preening and attempts to make himself a big deal, in some cases for his hostile interaction with fans. In any case since then he has become a producer of Spider-man cartoons that, to quote Alan Moore, are "marrow-chilling dreck".

    Whereas Nick Lowe by comparison has stepped back and allowed the work to speak for itself. Like a real editor should. He has been hands off. I think the main think Nick Lowe has to recommend is that he has managed to bring different and diverse voices in Spider-Man. He was the one who got Zdarsky to do Spectacular Spider-Man, Tom Taylor to do Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man, Conway to do Spiral. Likewise the way he oversaw the HUNTED event, where over two months you got HUNTED and a ".HU" issue per week and so on was quite commendable.

    We also forget Tom Brennan, he was the editor who occupied the interim between Wacker and Lowe. Brennan was the one who greenlit and oversaw Spencer's SUPERIOR FOES OF SPIDER-MAN.

  3. #3
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    It's really hard to judge what makes a good editor in comics, and in Spider-Man.

    Generally, the best editor in Spider-Man titles is considered to be Jim Salicrup. Salicrup was rated highly by Stern, Defalco, Michelinie. He was the one who commissioned and supported KLH and made the decision to tell a single story across all monthly Spider-Man titles, the first time it ever happened. He also encouraged Todd Macfarlane to do his own comic and tell his own stories and that led to the (then) best selling single issue of all time. So if we use Salicrup as a model, then I don't think either Wacker or Lowe measure up to the heights of that.

    Stephen Wacker in technical terms was more of an innovator. He was the one who oversaw ASM going thrice-monthly and co-ordinated the BND team. The actual quality of the stories though was inconsistent and forgettable in the main. At the same time, Wacker can't be entirely blamed since the reason for that was OMD and that was decided before he came along so there's a qualifier there for him. But Wacker also gets some demerits for his celebrity-like preening and attempts to make himself a big deal, in some cases for his hostile interaction with fans. In any case since then he has become a producer of Spider-man cartoons that, to quote Alan Moore, are "marrow-chilling dreck".

    Whereas Nick Lowe by comparison has stepped back and allowed the work to speak for itself. Like a real editor should. He has been hands off. I think the main think Nick Lowe has to recommend is that he has managed to bring different and diverse voices in Spider-Man. He was the one who got Zdarsky to do Spectacular Spider-Man, Tom Taylor to do Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man, Conway to do Spiral. Likewise the way he oversaw the HUNTED event, where over two months you got HUNTED and a ".HU" issue per week and so on was quite commendable.

    We also forget Tom Brennan, he was the editor who occupied the interim between Wacker and Lowe. Brennan was the one who greenlit and oversaw Spencer's SUPERIOR FOES OF SPIDER-MAN.
    That's a really solid analysis of the different editorial styles for the Spider-Editors. Well done, Jack!

    I would also agree that Nick Lowe has been a high point for editors since Wacker. Even decimal point numbering that people used to have a problem with end up being actual integral parts of the story, not just random tie-ins. My only gripe with Lowe is the need to get a consistent art team. We've had nearly 18 artists on this book across 44 issues; that's a lot of artists to cycle through this series. I wish Lowe would lock down someone else to compliment Ottley's style (I know he's the main artist, but he can do a long run) and just have two consistent artists. Otherwise, he's a great editor.
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    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebSlingWonder View Post
    That's a really solid analysis of the different editorial styles for the Spider-Editors. Well done, Jack!

    I would also agree that Nick Lowe has been a high point for editors since Wacker. Even decimal point numbering that people used to have a problem with end up being actual integral parts of the story, not just random tie-ins. My only gripe with Lowe is the need to get a consistent art team. We've had nearly 18 artists on this book across 44 issues; that's a lot of artists to cycle through this series. I wish Lowe would lock down someone else to compliment Ottley's style (I know he's the main artist, but he can do a long run) and just have two consistent artists. Otherwise, he's a great editor.
    Thanks.

    As for Lowe and not having a consistent art team, I think that was an issue for some time.
    -- Go back to BND and remember how Carlie Cooper's appearance changed issue-by-issue to the extent that one artist made her look like MJ and readers thought Peter and MJ got together (LOL). It was less of an issue in BND because different writers and others cycled in and out.
    -- Dan Slott also cycled in different artists in his long run.
    -- Likewise, no matter what, Spider-Man always ships out on time. That's the cardinal rule of editorial for a long time. Spider-Man always gets out on time, because too much is to tied to him, so that means editors can't wait for artists to set and follow their deadline.

  5. #5
    Spider-Fan Since '95 WebSlingWonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Thanks.

    As for Lowe and not having a consistent art team, I think that was an issue for some time.
    -- Go back to BND and remember how Carlie Cooper's appearance changed issue-by-issue to the extent that one artist made her look like MJ and readers thought Peter and MJ got together (LOL). It was less of an issue in BND because different writers and others cycled in and out.
    -- Dan Slott also cycled in different artists in his long run.
    -- Likewise, no matter what, Spider-Man always ships out on time. That's the cardinal rule of editorial for a long time. Spider-Man always gets out on time, because too much is to tied to him, so that means editors can't wait for artists to set and follow their deadline.
    That makes sense about meeting the deadline. I rarely, if ever, see ASM ship late (except for the pandemic). So you have a point there.
    And yes, it was incredibly awkward how often Carlie Cooper changed appearances! Hilarious too, though!
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    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    I think he's doing a fantastic job!

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    Astonishing Member CrimsonEchidna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    In any case since then he has become a producer of Spider-man cartoons that, to quote Alan Moore, are "marrow-chilling dreck".
    To be fair there though, Wacker took that position while Jeff Loeb was still the head hancho of Marvel's television production and it was Loeb's thumbprints all over the dumbing down of the animation front because he held the belief that kids wouldn't watch serialized shows.
    The artist formerly known as OrpheusTelos.

  8. #8
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    He seems pretty hands-off from what I've seen.
    Quote Originally Posted by CrimsonEchidna View Post
    To be fair there though, Wacker took that position while Jeff Loeb was still the head hancho of Marvel's television production and it was Loeb's thumbprints all over the dumbing down of the animation front because he held the belief that kids wouldn't watch serialized shows.
    Yeah, and for what it's worth, Wacker's era did see a bit of a quality improvement in the cartoons. Not to where I would call any of them excellent or stellar Superhero cartoons, but they became more watchable.

    And, of course, he was still the ultimate hype man. Comparing "Hulk: Where Monsters Dwell" animated movie to Killing Joke of all things .

  9. #9
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    Agree on art team. I think Ottley and Gleason would make a great pairing. With another artist filling in where absolutely needed.

    Ottley still hasn’t drawn any of the big stories, which is a bummer. My one gripe with the current run is they aren’t giving Ottley anything to shine with.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by your_name_here View Post
    Agree on art team. I think Ottley and Gleason would make a great pairing. With another artist filling in where absolutely needed.

    Ottley still hasn’t drawn any of the big stories, which is a bummer. My one gripe with the current run is they aren’t giving Ottley anything to shine with.
    Ottley, Gleason and Bagley would make the ultimate art team for this book. Hopefully, with the latter drawing "Sins Rising," and Gleason coming back with "Last Remains" we can have that trifecta.
    As for Ottley not getting much to shine with, to be fair, he did get the first arc for the book and that was pretty big due to the return of Peter/MJ and setting up the entire story. And he's also going to draw #850 as well.
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  11. #11
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I sometimes forget Ottley was on the book at times. It seems like they really hyped him and Gleason up but haven't really used either much.

  12. #12
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    This is an interesting question. A lot of people have the wrong sense of what editors do, thinking it mainly comes down to being continuity cops.

    Brevoort's editorial simulation is useful as a consideration of what modern editors have to do.

    https://tombrevoort.com/category/editorial-simulation/

    Lowe's basically been in charge since February 2014.

    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/he...-editor-677082

    Credit for some things can be difficult to assess. How much did he have to do with the quality of Superior Foes of Spider-Man, as he started editing the line around its sixth issue? For the first two months of an editor's tenure, they're often dealing with decisions made by their predecessors.

    The general consensus seems to be that some of the weaker sections of Slott's run occurred under him, with the Big Time and Superior Spider-Man better regarded than the Parker Industries era.

    It was also a period when we didn't have that many Spider-Man books.

    The satellite of Peter Parker the Spectacular Spider-Man and Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man didn't have much impact, despite impressive creative teams.

    Silk, Spider-Gwen and Miles have become mainstays of the series, as have alternate dimensions, something that was reflected in Into the Spider-Verse.

    Nick Spencer's been doing well on the title, and the twice-monthly schedule with occasional specials works for him, although it does seem to drag on at times. Did Hunted need to be 12 issues, and did it need to take so long to figure out Peter's employment situation? The art is sometimes inconsistent.

    I would ultimately rate him a B.
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  13. #13
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    This is an interesting question. A lot of people have the wrong sense of what editors do, thinking it mainly comes down to being continuity cops.
    Can you clarify this? because when you say "a lot of people have" it sounds like you are describing the actual thread here. No one here mentioned or judged Wacker or Lowe in terms of how they handled continuity.

    Credit for some things can be difficult to assess. How much did he have to do with the quality of Superior Foes of Spider-Man, as he started editing the line around its sixth issue? For the first two months of an editor's tenure, they're often dealing with decisions made by their predecessors.
    Which is why I mentioned Tom Brennan, who greenlit the series and edited the original stories. Again already covered.

    The general consensus seems to be that some of the weaker sections of Slott's run occurred under him,
    Spider-Verse happened on Lowe's watch and that brought many civilians to the entire run as well as Spider-Gwen, who along with Miles Morales is the biggest character after Venom and Carnage (and bigger certainly than any character featured in Slott's run). Remember that Slott's original concept and pitch for the character was a Gwen in her dying-clothes (Beige longcoat et al) with a Spider pattern. Robbi Rodriquez and Latour went rogue on his idea which Slott didn't think would catch on, so Lowe deserves credit for backing the team on that.

    It was also a period when we didn't have that many Spider-Man books.
    Not sure what you are talking about. But Spider-Verse happened and that led to a big proliferation of titles. You also had SPIRAL by Conway, followed by Zdarsky's Spectacular run.

    The satellite of Peter Parker the Spectacular Spider-Man and Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man didn't have much impact, despite impressive creative teams.
    What do you mean by impact? Zdarsky's Spectacular run sold pretty well, his final issue won an award, and stuff he introduced in his run (Jonah knowing Peter's identity, Teresa) have carried into Spencer's run. How does that qualify remotely as "didn't have much of an impact"?

  14. #14
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Can you clarify this? because when you say "a lot of people have" it sounds like you are describing the actual thread here. No one here mentioned or judged Wacker or Lowe in terms of how they handled continuity.



    Which is why I mentioned Tom Brennan, who greenlit the series and edited the original stories. Again already covered.



    Spider-Verse happened on Lowe's watch and that brought many civilians to the entire run as well as Spider-Gwen, who along with Miles Morales is the biggest character after Venom and Carnage (and bigger certainly than any character featured in Slott's run). Remember that Slott's original concept and pitch for the character was a Gwen in her dying-clothes (Beige longcoat et al) with a Spider pattern. Robbi Rodriquez and Latour went rogue on his idea which Slott didn't think would catch on, so Lowe deserves credit for backing the team on that.



    Not sure what you are talking about. But Spider-Verse happened and that led to a big proliferation of titles. You also had SPIRAL by Conway, followed by Zdarsky's Spectacular run.



    What do you mean by impact? Zdarsky's Spectacular run sold pretty well, his final issue won an award, and stuff he introduced in his run (Jonah knowing Peter's identity, Teresa) have carried into Spencer's run. How does that qualify remotely as "didn't have much of an impact"?
    The quality of Spider-Verse is still dubious though.

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member Revolutionary_Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    The quality of Spider-Verse is still dubious though.
    Should we blame Lowe for not firing Slott?

    I prefer to credit him for bringing in Zdarsky, and getting Conway back, and backing Latour-Rodriquez on Spider-Gwen.

    And in any case, a lot of people do like Go Down Swinging and that self-aggrandizing final issue that Slott wrote. I think Lowe as an editor should have pushed back on Slott's approach in GDS with all that Osborn-family drama that he introduced half-a---dly that makes no sense. Like Emily Osborn coming out of nowhere and so on. The main point of GDS is the confrontation and interactions between Goblin-Jameson-Spider-Man at Times Square. The rest is superfluous.

    So as an editor he should have pushed back on that, but it's Slott's last hurrah so I guess he assumed he earned his indulgence, not to mention that Slott was obviously a more senior figure than him.
    Last edited by Revolutionary_Jack; 07-27-2020 at 03:44 PM.

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