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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member JackDaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    Again, not sure, I am not an expert on either character. For Shazam, maybe more generic energy blasts (non-lightning) and/or GL energy blasts/constructs?
    One possibility that occurred to me was the total absence of magic in an area...effectively just deprive Shazam of his power source.

    Basically you set up a device that runs on magic in an area...and run it and run it until all the magic power in the area is depleted. Then lure Shazam into the area...he has nothing to power him...and is as vulnerable as any ordinary man. Clearly no effect whatever on Superman...

    Itís effectively the equivalent of depriving Superman of yellow sunlight.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alphaxman View Post
    I'm not really into that. Maybe because I'm not the biggest Supes fan so I don't like it when he's the "best at everything". Magic is basically rewriting reality to fit the user's will, depending on their power-level and imagination. So I don't feel Superman, a being of "science" should be exempt to magic's effects. Like I said, I think magic should affect him just like it would affect Lois or any other human. But when it comes to magically based heroes like Cap and Wonder Woman, they should have a lot more durability against magical attacks, like "bolts" and certain spells.
    Like, let say Doctor Psycho tried to mentally manipulate Supes, he would have difficulty because of Superman's strong will and "super-brain". Conversely, if Zatanna or Mordru wanted to erase his memory or dominate his mind, Superman would fall just like any other mortal who didn't have magical training or ability to fight against it.
    That's why I hate it when I see him manhandling magical beings like gods or demons like they're super-aliens. He should struggle. He should ask for help from Zatanna or Dr. Fate or God forbid, Constantine (I hate him) when he comes across powerful magical threats. He can survive a nuclear blast but be fried to the bone by a fully powered Trigon.

    ***Speaking of which -- I can't stand that Bizzaro was able to beat Trigon in the latest issue of Red Hood. DC is pwning him like Marvel is doing Galactus. JUST NOT RIGHT!!!!

    I also liked during Kingdom Come that Diana's blade was able to cut his finger, the same way it would cut anyone else's.
    I want "reasonable" limits on Superman and magic is the antithesis of reason.
    If magic is a weakness of superman because he is a science character, I suppose that the powers of science are a weakness of magic characters.

  3. #18
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    Thing is, Shazam has to be "The World's Mightiest Mortal", which means he has to be tough enough to impress Superman himself. Also, in the old days, nothing ordinary, including lightning, could harm Shazam, the Marvel Family or anyone else with the power of invulnerability. Therefore, one had to use other means (including "wisdom") to defeat an invulnerable foe.

  4. #19
    Fantastic Member The_Lurk's Avatar
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    In raw power they are all, details pushing the borders in various directions from time to time aside, pretty even with Supes being shown in experience advantage over Captain Marvel. Cap takes magic threats better than Superman though. Superman/Shazam! - First Thunder from 2005 seems to be a good read abut that IIRC.
    Last edited by The_Lurk; 08-09-2020 at 10:55 AM. Reason: forgot a letter

  5. #20
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Magic being a physiological weaknesses makes no sense even by the given rules of the DCU. Superman just has no particular resistance to it so he's effectively human against it and that's fine. Any resistance he has should be to his determination or grit, but that's true of most characters. I'm fine with Shazam having that over Clark. Let him be more resistant to it since DC is unlikely to let him be physically stronger. As of now, he gets to throw lightning bolts and that's quickly become Flash's domain, so he's just not particularly great at anything.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackDaw View Post
    One possibility that occurred to me was the total absence of magic in an area...effectively just deprive Shazam of his power source.

    Basically you set up a device that runs on magic in an area...and run it and run it until all the magic power in the area is depleted. Then lure Shazam into the area...he has nothing to power him...and is as vulnerable as any ordinary man. Clearly no effect whatever on Superman...

    Itís effectively the equivalent of depriving Superman of yellow sunlight.
    That'd be a great plan for someone like Sivana to try out! (With the eventual goal of stealing all that stored up magic somehow, but it all going **** up and the magic rushing out and re-empowering Cap 'cause Sivana bit off more than he could chew, as usual, and isn't as smart as he thinks, as usual.)

    And yeah, I prefer Cap being more resistant to magical attacks than Supes, who is not more vulnerable than a normal person to magic (it's not a *weakness* like Kryptonite), just 'less invulnerable' to magic *than he is to bullets.* But Superman has stuff that Cap does not, like super-senses and freeze breath and whatnot. (Magic lightning and heat vision kind of cancel out, both are just ranged zaps.)
    Last edited by Sutekh; 08-02-2020 at 01:41 AM.

  7. #22
    Incredible Member Jovan2013's Avatar
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    Was never a fan of magic being a weakness to Superman. I always see it that he has no special defense so it would affect him just like any other being. If a wizard use magic as a catalyst to manipulate fire then it should not really damage him but if it was hellfire then it should cause him damage.

    Shazam and Black Adam are beings of magic, so they would be more resistant to the forces of magic.

  8. #23
    Spectacular Member Knightmare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackDaw View Post
    So what things should Shazam be more vulnerable to??
    I can't remember where I read it, but I thought that only high-order magic can harm Captain Marvel/Shazam. Think The Spectre, Dr.Fate etc etc

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