Why haven't any of the Black female X-men caught on other than Storm?

[skyvolt2000]

I agree.

Characters like Kamala, Miles and even Blue Beetle at DC prove that if you give a character enough push they will succeed despite whatever critics they have.

Gwenpool's only been out for a few years but has had a lot more push than say M. Not saying the writer's on Gwenpool didn't help her get a large following though.

When was the last time Jaime Reyes has been seen at DC??

What push did he get? Dc PANDERS to critics.

When it comes to POC. How many MIA folks did we see in the Juneteenth poster not to mention how many names got repeated? They have a Hispanic Heritage poster with Jaime and SUPERMAN.

Unlike Miles & Khan-who have NOT been without a solo since they were introduced.

Kamala becomes the all time Asian descent solo female star next month bypass Cassandra Cain.

Miles hits 100 solo issues sometime next year.

Gwenpool- here's something you don't know.
Disney higher ups did not get her and wanted her GONE.
Marvel has been fighting with Disney to keep her around.
That is why you saw that mini by Leah Williams.

[davetvs]

I read original Generation X when it came out and especially noted M and thought 'man, this girl is going to be huge. Great visual design, cool powers, defined personality, mysterious past.' And did she? No...Generation X seemed to be pretty much kiss of death to anyone involved. They never caught on to anything same degree as New Mutants did in previous decade. Even Jubilee who was mega-popular at that time of groups creation took a dip. Now I missed a ton of stuff in the '90s/early 2000's so I am not up to date with everything but that was my impression anyway. Emma Frost was saved because Morrison gave her a central role right after.

Monet's background revelations which were - shall we say - not the best idea ever - IMO were a major reason for this and hurt the character bigtime even after the title ended.

Now lots of people say that it is hard to break through glass ceiling estabilished by O5 and Claremonts' GSXM1 lineup. And to some degree it's true, but lets face it, not everyone of those character is an A-lister today (or ever was) and it's well known that O5 were never really super popular in their own time. Several people already made this point but I again give the example of Magik - character of 3rd generation who was virtually forgotten for 20 years and is now an A-lister. How did it happen? Well, there were writers who loved the character, wanted to bring her back, did their homework and put her to limelight in cool story arcs.

Now, some people might be under impression that this kind of thing is purely an editorial decision but it's not like you can just tell your writers "Hey you, go hit a home run". You need someone who has the inspirational spark and motivation to make it happen and THEN the editor greenlights them. You need several stars to align for any of these characters to make it big but above all, you need someone who is willing to dedicate paneltime and effort to make them tick in a series where they are in a central role instead of making cameos every now and then in a 20+ character mega crossover.

I think this circles back to the dearth of minority writers being the crux of the issue. Obviously, you don't have to be a minority to have favorite characters who are, but it's more likely that the X-Verse's endless parade of straight white male writers aren't going to spend a lot of time focusing on Black women. Not everyone is a Chris Claremont. I'm Black, M is one of my favorite characters. If I was writing a book, she'd be in it. I also loved Oya.

[OopsIdiditagain]

When was the last time Jaime Reyes has been seen at DC??

What push did he get? Dc PANDERS to critics.

When it comes to POC. How many MIA folks did we see in the Juneteenth poster not to mention how many names got repeated? They have a Hispanic Heritage poster with Jaime and SUPERMAN.

Unlike Miles & Khan-who have NOT been without a solo since they were introduced.

Kamala becomes the all time Asian descent solo female star next month bypass Cassandra Cain.

Miles hits 100 solo issues sometime next year.

Gwenpool- here's something you don't know.
Disney higher ups did not get her and wanted her GONE.
Marvel has been fighting with Disney to keep her around.
That is why you saw that mini by Leah Williams.

Jaime Reyes not getting push? Jaime got a lot of non-comics exposure. Jaime Reyes has been featured in Batman cartoons and had a whole season dedicated to him in Young Justice. Jaime was used in Injustice. He was in the Teen Titans movie. Keep mind more people watch the tv shows and movies than read the comics.

Jaime is more recognizable to the mainstream society as blue beetle than Ted. I wouldn't be surprised if people think Jaime's the only BB.

[Alphaxman]

I know it is nearly universally agreed that Marvel and comics in general has a problem with lighting their black characters, especially Monet and Sunspot. But if Marvel ever created a standard which all colorist had to use, which characters would be dark skinned, medium complexed and controversially -dun dun dun -- light skinned? I'm talking about Beyonce/Aaliyah complexion, not Mariah Carey's.

Its hard to go be 60s-80s standards, because all black characters were colored the same brown shade. We knew Sunspot was mixed, yet he was the same shade of brown as Storm.
X-Men&NewMutants.jpg

But with computer programs, all shades can be represented.

Would Storm and Oya be around Lupita Nyong'o's complexion or maybe as dark as model Nyakim Gatwech?

Would Cecilia Reyes be around Zoe Saldana's complexion or Rossario Dawson -- both are Afro-Latinas?

What about Joanna (Frenzy)? We see they tried to lighten her on the new S.W.O.R.D. series, even though the artist has stated it was an error and she and Manifold would be darker.

And there's Angel Salvadore, Cipher, Tempo, Locus, Starlight and the New Warriors Debrii (I think she's a mutant). Not to mention all of the men.

[Havok83]

I know it is nearly universally agreed that Marvel and comics in general has a problem with lighting their black characters, especially Monet and Sunspot. But if Marvel ever created a standard which all colorist had to use, which characters would be dark skinned, medium complexed and controversially -dun dun dun -- light skinned? I'm talking about Beyonce/Aaliyah complexion, not Mariah Carey's.

Its hard to go be 60s-80s standards, because all black characters were colored the same brown shade. We knew Sunspot was mixed, yet he was the same shade of brown as Storm.
X-Men&NewMutants.jpg

But with computer programs, all shades can be represented.

Would Storm and Oya be around Lupita Nyong'o's complexion or maybe as dark as model Nyakim Gatwech?

Would Cecilia Reyes be around Zoe Saldana's complexion or Rossario Dawson -- both are Afro-Latinas?

What about Joanna (Frenzy)? We see they tried to lighten her on the new S.W.O.R.D. series, even though the artist has stated it was an error and she and Manifold would be darker.

And there's Angel Salvadore, Cipher, Tempo, Locus, Starlight and the New Warriors Debrii (I think she's a mutant). Not to mention all of the men.

Then do that for new characters created in the modern era. To change the coloring of older characters from what they were originally portrayed as is a bit of a retcon to me and it doesnt sit well as its part of racial erasure. Not all biracial people have light skin and Sunspot most definitely didnt

[thecoolaidkid]

I think part of the problem with black characters is visual recognition. Of course each artist has their own take on how a characters should look but there should be features that stay the same that makes them recognizable at least for a few years. Take Frenzy in the new sword comic. When I see a character I should know who Im looking at and that how character relevance grows IMO

[Devaishwarya]

Roberto can be mixed and still be as dark or even darker than Storm. It's a combination of genetics reaching back into one's ancestors and as such the outcomes can seem quite random, for want of a better term.

They didn't "Try" to lighten Frenzy and Manifold it was an error.

[Paleo_Rage]

Then do that for new characters created in the modern era. To change the coloring of older characters from what they were originally portrayed as is a bit of a retcon to me and it doesnt sit well as its part of racial erasure. Not all biracial people have light skin and Sunspot most definitely didnt

This right here.. Folks really thinking having a non black parent and a black parent= light skinned when Black folks with two Black parents can be light bright all on their own..It dont work like that.

[Paleo_Rage]

Roberto can be mixed and still be as dark or even darker than Storm. It's a combination of genetics reaching back into one's ancestors and as such the outcomes can seem quite random, for want of a better term.

also features because Darwin can stay chalk skinned but they can still use signifiers that show that he is Black.

[Kingdom X]

Roberto can be mixed and still be as dark or even darker than Storm. It's a combination of genetics reaching back into one's ancestors and as such the outcomes can seem quite random, for want of a better term.

They didn't "Try" to lighten Frenzy and Manifold it was an error.

Yeah I have to agree on this specific case of it being an error/ the camera flash.

HOWEVER, repeated errors do have to be addressed cause it parallels real world bias against darker skin.

[Devaishwarya]

The colouring errors should be brought up. But before we go casting aspersions as to who are "colourists" and/or on some "racist" agenda, some due diligence needs to be done to ascertain IF the pitch-forks and soap boxes should be brought out and the Cancel Crowd called to gather.

Both Ewing and Schiti have both used PoC in their books in the past on numerous occasions and the newest hot-shot go-to colourist Marte Gracia has also shown to be very astute in his skin colour applications where it comes to PoC in the many books he's done.

By all means, bring it to the attention, but be mindful of whom you attempt to tar and feather.

[BroHomo]

I meeean they def softened his more 'Black' Features

[Devaishwarya]

Different artists...draw the same character differently. This has been happening since...always.
Even the same artist will draw the same character slightly different because their art-style would have changed and evolved...Romita Junior, Lienil Yu...for examples.

[Kingdom X]

The colouring errors should be brought up. But before we go casting aspersions as to who are "colourists" and/or on some "racist" agenda, some due diligence needs to be done to ascertain IF the pitch-forks and soap boxes should be brought out and the Cancel Crowd called to gather.

Both Ewing and Schiti have both used PoC in their books in the past on numerous occasions and the newest hot-shot go-to colourist Marte Gracia has also shown to be very astute in his skin colour applications where it comes to PoC in the many books he's done.

By all means, bring it to the attention, but be mindful of whom you attempt to tar and feather.

I think you bring up some really good points. Still, I understand why fans get really upset. It’s almost impossible to figure out whose making honest mistakes, whose implicitly biased towards lighter features, and who has racist intent. It’s not like the racist ones are ever going to come out and say it lol.

[Killerbee911]

On the positive side Frenzy is now in a book.