Empyre: X-Men #4 Preview

[Beetle]

right? Like wanda's been possessed A LOT now

is there something special about limbo and zombies that made magik like that?

Wanda's mostly been possessed by Chthon himself, he's got dibs

[Denkota]

Possessed Wanda, Dark Phoenix, Darkchylde Magic and Goblin Queen Maddie should have a cat fight in some mini series like I am possessed and so are you!

[Ichijinijisanji]

tfw i wanted to talk about the plot

[CGAR]

Can I ask. Why are certain people upset that Lorna isn’t showing up in this?

[Denkota]

Maybe because she was actually there as a witness to the destruction and cuz her guilt and anger over it was a major plot point of her character arc for some time.

[Glio]

Can I ask. Why are certain people upset that Lorna isn’t showing up in this?

And she was in the cover, like Cyclops.

[The92Ghost]

I have to admit that I am utterly disappointed, if Wanda ends up running away instead of fixing her mistake. To be honest I see a lot bigger story if this thing was turned around and Wanda actually managed to resurrect all those 16 million mutants, without turning them into zombies... I can see the fight with the Cotati being a lot more destructible and powerful, if all those 16 million mutants could have a blast with them and then seeing them joining Krakoa or turning Genosha into second Haven for mutants and Wanda would had her redemption, as well. I am utterly disappointed that they choose this path, instead of the other one, which held much more story and focal point for something greater.

[rhaenylis]

Can I ask. Why are certain people upset that Lorna isn’t showing up in this?

She is perhaps the most traumatized person by the genocide in the entire marvel universe
She was a direct witness to the massacre, seeing all these people she knew perish without her being able to help them
She was left alone, utterly devastated, among the ruins for months before being found by the X-Men
The drama made her so unstable that she had to undergo psychic therapy by Charles
She is clearly the character who "deserves" the most to confront Wanda about this and / or give her opinion about the resurrection of the victims
It's a huge part of her character arc

[nandes]

If this story actually meant to address Genosha then sure, that would be a knock against it, but at this point the main thing about this mini seems to be that the x-writers were given an order to make a Empyre tie-in and just decided to do a plants vs. zombies gag + randomly brought a few plot points to get there (that includes Wanda).

Maybe this issue will prove me wrong and Hickman will actually wrap it up in a nice manner, but I'd rather see him address Genosha/Wanda/Decimation in his own terms in his own book later.

[Soulsword323]

If this story actually meant to address Genosha then sure, that would be a knock against it, but at this point the main thing about this mini seems to be that the x-writers were given an order to make a Empyre tie-in and just decided to do a plants vs. zombies gag + randomly brought a few plot points to get there (that includes Wanda).

Maybe this issue will prove me wrong and Hickman will actually wrap it up in a nice manner, but I'd rather see him address Genosha/Wanda/Decimation in his own terms in his own book later.

This.

It's clear this book isn't going to address Genosha in any meaningful way. At this point I don't expect to see Polaris show up, and if she does, do nothing more then exist in the background like the other characters.

[salarta]

If this story actually meant to address Genosha then sure, that would be a knock against it, but at this point the main thing about this mini seems to be that the x-writers were given an order to make a Empyre tie-in and just decided to do a plants vs. zombies gag + randomly brought a few plot points to get there (that includes Wanda).

Maybe this issue will prove me wrong and Hickman will actually wrap it up in a nice manner, but I'd rather see him address Genosha/Wanda/Decimation in his own terms in his own book later.

Okay, I don't have much time to post, so I might have more that I need to come back and say. I'm saying what I can in the short time I have.

Marvel comics hasn't acknowledged Lorna's experiences with Genosha, including surviving the genocide, in 15 years. If you look at all media, they haven't acknowledged it in 11 years. Lorna witnessed millions of people die all around her, experienced a hell of a lot of trauma from it, and in the years after it happened, it had a huge impact on her outlook and actions. Then she got thrown into outer space, and ever since, Marvel completely ignores that she went through a genocide. T
They have no problem acknowledging this with Magneto surviving the Holocaust, but Lorna? For some reason, they can't be bothered.

We're not even talking "they haven't done anything major with it." We're talking not even a whisper. Not even a single line of dialogue. Nothing.

Jean Grey and Storm have been given more to say and do about the Genoshan genocide than Lorna, and they didn't even experience it. Jean got to have a fight with Cassandra Nova on Genosha's ruins over it. Storm got to be mad about the death toll in talking with another character. Yet with Lorna, they just refuse to do anything.

I'm also not saying Jean and Storm shouldn't have been allowed to have those moments. There is room for those characters to have such moments AND for Lorna to not be treated like the horror she witnessed never happened and never meant a single thing.

So with 15 years of nothing, any time Genosha has a big story raises the issue of how Marvel continues to do nothing involving Lorna with it. That's already a baseline issue with X-Men: Empyre.

Then you add in Wanda taking part. As her sister (or ex-sister, if you stick with the forced retcon), Wanda's involvement in this mini adds more reason for Lorna to take part. They haven't interacted at all since the Axis retcon. We don't even know if Lorna knows they retcon happened. For all we know, she thinks Wanda is still her sister. That Wanda revived the Genoshan dead as zombies - the very people that were murdered before Lorna's eyes) adds to this importance.

THEN you add in the cover for X-Men: Empyre #3. It has Lorna on it. Front and center, notable. It implies Lorna is going to actually be in the issue, and raises expectations of such, that she's going to at least APPEAR somewhere. Which may not be an issue for other characters with less stake in Genosha, but means a WHOLE lot for Lorna when you factor in everything I said above.

I need to wrap this up. In closing, Lorna not in this wouldn't be an issue if Marvel had just used and acknowledged her experiences with Genosha recently elsewhere. It also wouldn't be an issue if we knew of some big Genosha event coming up with Lorna involved with a key role and big presence. But we have neither, so the fact it's not happening here is a big deal. If she shows up in Empyre #4, then great, and perhaps that will resolve the problem. But if not? It just adds weight to the view that Marvel either has no respect for the character or hates her.

[ExodusCloak]

Okay, I don't have much time to post, so I might have more that I need to come back and say. I'm saying what I can in the short time I have.

Marvel comics hasn't acknowledged Lorna's experiences with Genosha, including surviving the genocide, in 15 years. If you look at all media, they haven't acknowledged it in 11 years. Lorna witnessed millions of people die all around her, experienced a hell of a lot of trauma from it, and in the years after it happened, it had a huge impact on her outlook and actions. Then she got thrown into outer space, and ever since, Marvel completely ignores that she went through a genocide. T
They have no problem acknowledging this with Magneto surviving the Holocaust, but Lorna? For some reason, they can't be bothered.

We're not even talking "they haven't done anything major with it." We're talking not even a whisper. Not even a single line of dialogue. Nothing.

Jean Grey and Storm have been given more to say and do about the Genoshan genocide than Lorna, and they didn't even experience it. Jean got to have a fight with Cassandra Nova on Genosha's ruins over it. Storm got to be mad about the death toll in talking with another character. Yet with Lorna, they just refuse to do anything.

I'm also not saying Jean and Storm shouldn't have been allowed to have those moments. There is room for those characters to have such moments AND for Lorna to not be treated like the horror she witnessed never happened and never meant a single thing.

So with 15 years of nothing, any time Genosha has a big story raises the issue of how Marvel continues to do nothing involving Lorna with it. That's already a baseline issue with X-Men: Empyre.

Then you add in Wanda taking part. As her sister (or ex-sister, if you stick with the forced retcon), Wanda's involvement in this mini adds more reason for Lorna to take part. They haven't interacted at all since the Axis retcon. We don't even know if Lorna knows they retcon happened. For all we know, she thinks Wanda is still her sister. That Wanda revived the Genoshan dead as zombies - the very people that were murdered before Lorna's eyes) adds to this importance.

THEN you add in the cover for X-Men: Empyre #3. It has Lorna on it. Front and center, notable. It implies Lorna is going to actually be in the issue, and raises expectations of such, that she's going to at least APPEAR somewhere. Which may not be an issue for other characters with less stake in Genosha, but means a WHOLE lot for Lorna when you factor in everything I said above.

I need to wrap this up. In closing, Lorna not in this wouldn't be an issue if Marvel had just used and acknowledged her experiences with Genosha recently elsewhere. It also wouldn't be an issue if we knew of some big Genosha event coming up with Lorna involved with a key role and big presence. But we have neither, so the fact it's not happening here is a big deal. If she shows up in Empyre #4, then great, and perhaps that will resolve the problem. But if not? It just adds weight to the view that Marvel either has no respect for the character or hates her.

Emma survived too, and she's arguably one of the higher profiled mutants to survive. They didn't use her either

Toad is the other high profile survivor

[rhaenylis]

Emma survived too, and she's arguably one of the higher profiled mutants to survive. They didn't use her either

That's true, however, we still have reminders of Emma's trauma about the deaths of her students (I think), while Lorna has not been involved in any way (not even a cameo, I think) with Genosha since at least the debate with Charles when she builds the memorial

[nandes]

I need to wrap this up. In closing, Lorna not in this wouldn't be an issue if Marvel had just used and acknowledged her experiences with Genosha recently elsewhere. It also wouldn't be an issue if we knew of some big Genosha event coming up with Lorna involved with a key role and big presence. But we have neither, so the fact it's not happening here is a big deal. If she shows up in Empyre #4, then great, and perhaps that will resolve the problem. But if not? It just adds weight to the view that Marvel either has no respect for the character or hates her.

All I was saying is that I understand your complaints about Lorna possibly not being present in a history about Genosha but that's not the case here when the purpose of this book isn't really to tell a story about Genosha. It's just a silly intentional mess built around a pun on the name of a famous game.

Covers always lie because the cover artist only really gets some instructions of what to draw and really have no idea what is going on the actual comic. Cyclops and Magneto are in the same cover and are nowhere to be found either. Magneto himself was the leader of Genosha and he has no role in this story. I doubt his or Lorna's absence is a sign of disrespect towards the characters, that's just not the story the writers are interested in telling right now. Maybe it will be later, who knows.

[Veitha]

I mean, no offense, but I don't think that Marvel acknowledged Polaris in general, not just the Genosha stuff.

Until X-Factor, that is.