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  1. #121
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    I guess the MJ we know for sure that Peter was her first is Ultimate MJ.

  2. #122
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    I was unaware of the physical abuse. It kind of makes sense, though to me Norman hasn't really shown that side over the years so its inconsistent with his character. I mean, put him in a goblin mask with Spider-Man tied up and sure, he's abusive. But he has always had a genuine soft spot for Harry, or at least thats how I think if their relationship.
    Norman cared for Harry, part of it was genuine paternal love but it was also the fact that he was an Osborn and the legacy behind that name (thougth is more the later than the former).

    The reason of why their relationship is toxic is because Norman is following the example of his own abusive father and pretty much treats Harry the same way he was treated, thinking than that would make a man out of him, but it just let him deeply insecure and starving from love. So for a long time, Norman did care, hell he was genuely hurt as parent after knowing about his death, it was why he "even the score" with Peter by killing or kidnapping Mayday, but is care is not healthy.
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  3. #123
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    Norman arguably never cared about Harry in any healthy way. By that I mean that his love was always conditional. Once Harry got to an age where it was clear that he would never be like Norman, he kinda stopped caring. Norman in a twisted way has more love for Peter even with all the **** he put him through.

  4. #124
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitou D. Kid View Post
    Norman arguably never cared about Harry in any healthy way. By that I mean that his love was always conditional. Once Harry got to an age where it was clear that he would never be like Norman, he kinda stopped caring. Norman in a twisted way has more love for Peter even with all the **** he put him through.
    It was never healthy, i think that at the beginning before Emily died (or dissapeared, i heard that Slott retconed that) his care might have been genuine, but then it became all about the Osborn Legacy and standing above everyone else. His interest on Peter is sparked by the fact that he has all the quality that he wanted Harry (also Norman would never admit this out loud, but he knows that deep down Peter is an stronger man that he would ever be, so he wants to bring him down to his level) to have, he probably saw something of himself on Peter i even remember a flashback story when the Parkers visited Osborn installations when Peter was a kid and Norman took a liking to Peter for being a kid interested on science and scientific pursuits and wishing that Harry was the same.
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  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    It was never healthy, i think that at the beginning before Emily died (or dissapeared, i heard that Slott retconed that) his care might have been genuine, but then it became all about the Osborn Legacy and standing above everyone else. His interest on Peter is sparked by the fact that he has all the quality that he wanted Harry (also Norman would never admit this out loud, but he knows that deep down Peter is an stronger man that he would ever be, so he wants to bring him down to his level) to have, he probably saw something of himself on Peter i even remember a flashback story when the Parkers visited Osborn installations when Peter was a kid and Norman took a liking to Peter for being a kid interested on science and scientific pursuits and wishing that Harry was the same.
    That makes him sound a lot like the Joker with Batman, or Harvey Dent if you count The Dark Knight.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    That makes him sound a lot like the Joker with Batman, or Harvey Dent if you count The Dark Knight.
    Ditko studied at the feet of Jerry Robinson, Joker's original artist and designer, so Goblin has a lot of Joker in him. He's Ditko's homage to the Clown Prince of Crime.

  7. #127
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    Mark Hamill voiced The Hobgoblin. Just sayin' .

  8. #128
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huntsman Spider View Post
    That makes him sound a lot like the Joker with Batman, or Harvey Dent if you count The Dark Knight.
    I supposed, i think that what it makes work between Peter and Norman is the amount of personal history between, both in and out of costume, that's something that Joker can't really claim.
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  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutionary_Jack View Post
    Ditko studied at the feet of Jerry Robinson, Joker's original artist and designer, so Goblin has a lot of Joker in him. He's Ditko's homage to the Clown Prince of Crime.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Mark Hamill voiced The Hobgoblin. Just sayin' .
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    I supposed, i think that what it makes work between Peter and Norman is the amount of personal history between, both in and out of costume, that's something that Joker can't really claim.
    Good points there.
    The spider is always on the hunt.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rzerox21xx View Post
    I guess the MJ we know for sure that Peter was her first is Ultimate MJ.
    Who was MJ first in the main Universe

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Yeah, it's pretty definitive that MJ was Peter's First Time.

    I think a more interesting question would be if Peter was MJ's First.
    Having read her backstory and Parallel Lives... I think Peter also took her virginity

  12. #132
    Mighty Member witchboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
    There's also protection, which is not just against STDs.
    I don't understand what protection has to do with anything.
    The non intercourse sexual encounter is a way to reconcile Sins Past saying Peter and Gwen never had sex, and Spider-Man:Blue showing them about to get intimate in his bedroom. Protection or not is irrelevant to the issue as far as I can tell.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    I don't understand what protection has to do with anything.
    The non intercourse sexual encounter is a way to reconcile Sins Past saying Peter and Gwen never had sex, and Spider-Man:Blue showing them about to get intimate in his bedroom. Protection or not is irrelevant to the issue as far as I can tell.
    I don't think Gwen and Peter went farther than just kissing.

  14. #134
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    Gwen seems like the type to not kiss on the first date and not have sex until marriage. MJ probably did kiss on the first date, but I don't think she would have had sex until a few dates down the road. Maybe she'd be inclined to wait until marriage as well, but I think she could do it out of love.

    For different reasons though - Gwen was more of a traditionalist, and would be disinclined to sleep around, and MJ had emotional and physical baggage from abuse in her past, which could prevent easy intimacy.

    I know that flies in the face of Sins Past, but what doesn't? If you want to make an argument for Gwen lapsing, its because her father had just recently died a horrific and meaningless death and she had just broken up with Peter. Emotionally compromised.
    Last edited by Scott Taylor; 11-17-2020 at 02:24 PM.
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  15. #135
    Extraordinary Member Jman27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    Gwen seems like the type to not kiss on the first date and not have sex until marriage. MJ probably did kiss on the first date, but I don't think she would have had sex until a few dates down the road. Maybe she'd be inclined to wait until marriage as well, but I think she could do it out of love.

    For different reasons though - Gwen was more of a traditionalist, and would be disinclined to sleep around, and MJ had emotional and physical baggage from abuse in her past, which could prevent easy intimacy.

    I know that flies in the face of Sins Past, but what doesn't? If you want to make an argument for Gwen lapsing, its because her father had just recently died a horrific and meaningless death and she had just broken up with Peter. Emotionally compromised.
    oh thats when it happen during that timeline? i know she told Norman off after her dad die
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