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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    I really didn't expect Rictor to be that important in this series, I thought he was going to be the typical character overshadowed by others but I'm glad I'm wrong, he's interesting and adds much-needed representation to mutants.
    I don't think "Rictor" is important in this series. His powers are. But it is 11 issues but we still didn't see anything about his personality. He (like all the others on this team) looks like just another tool to me. Don't get me wrong, I like Rictor and want him to be more than just a tool.

    That is my problem with this title. There are things happening but all the characters (maybe except Apocalypse) are just tools. I mean some of them are even generic tools. You can use any other mutant instead of Jubilee, Gambit, or Rogue. I want the story to form around the characters (their histories, personalities, contacts, etc.) not the other way around. Just because a character we like becomes an important tool doesn't change the fact that they are being used just as tools. (Wow I said tool 6 times [7 with this] I think I have a problem )

  2. #77
    Extraordinary Member Glio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laemar View Post
    I don't think "Rictor" is important in this series. His powers are. But it is 11 issues but we still didn't see anything about his personality. He (like all the others on this team) looks like just another tool to me. Don't get me wrong, I like Rictor and want him to be more than just a tool.

    That is my problem with this title. There are things happening but all the characters (maybe except Apocalypse) are just tools. I mean some of them are even generic tools. You can use any other mutant instead of Jubilee, Gambit, or Rogue. I want the story to form around the characters (their histories, personalities, contacts, etc.) not the other way around. Just because a character we like becomes an important tool doesn't change the fact that they are being used just as tools. (Wow I said tool 6 times [7 with this] I think I have a problem )
    Excalibur is a plot driven series, not a character driven series but I respect that other people may prefer a different style to another.

  3. #78
    Mighty Member Malachi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    Excalibur is a plot driven series, not a character driven series but I respect that other people may prefer a different style to another.
    X-men comics in general have been known for it's strong characters. So I wouldn't be suprised if users here prefer it that way. I know I certainly do.

  4. #79
    Extraordinary Member Glio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malachi View Post
    X-men comics in general have been known for it's strong characters. So I wouldn't be suprised if users here prefer it that way. I know I certainly do.
    It is also the case that there are many readers who only want certain characters and with a certain specific characterization. Each one, their tastes.

  5. #80
    Mighty Member Psyknight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GodfatherIV View Post
    What is this jumbled mess?? I know it may not be pc but geez i miss Psylocke-Betsy. Betsy as Captain Britain has done absolutely nothing. They've wasted everything
    This is devastatingly accurate.

  6. #81
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andresdavidmr View Post
    It's a reference to Shatterstar, they share a bond, and Ric is his anchor. I do think Shatty is going to appear next issue.
    So Rictor is the bottom
    lol but FrFr....
    Good catch! This was a fun issue but stuff about if that's Saturnyne or satur9 confusing me as does Candra's motivation for making the gem? Can anyone explain??
    GrindrStone(D)

  7. #82
    Moderator Nyssane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    as does Candra's motivation for making the gem? Can anyone explain??
    She didn't want the other High Lords to gain her power.

  8. #83
    Mighty Member Malachi's Avatar
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    Considering this issue is much more linear and takes places during a smaller time span, it's no suprise that the flow is better. Often Tini gets stuck on the big picture. Trying to lay different puzzle pieces in a limited place. Seemingly relying on that the overall effect of the finished puzzle. Hoping that readers will gloss over the cracks the same way she does. With that process it's no suprise that every issue taken as it is presents numerous flaws. Often the enjoyment comes from overlooking the use, or more often the non existant use, of characters to favor larger themes and plots.

    A over simplication of that is the plot vs character driven stories argument. It's never so black and white. As we all have seen now Excalibur is comic that focuses more on worldbuilding, twists, overarching plots and trying to reframe marvel history(more prominently Krakoa, Apocalypse and Excalibur comics) to tell a story about mutant magic. It oftens uses new characters to introduce magic. Letting Rictor do most of the exploration with magic effecting a mutant. As it is with stage magic the missdirect of the trick and the reveal at the end isn't the point. You have to make the experience entertaining or the trick falls, even if it's super clever. Sometimes you need to add some flashy moves or setpieces and utilise them draw the audience in. This is the problem we face. A plot focused story that seemingly uses characters just because someone has told them X must appear in so and so many panels. Battles with little or no weight at all seemingly just because it is what Tini/Marvel expects from a story. Perhaps what they expect from us readers. All the way trying to missdirect and use flashy moves to give us panels that can be posted to gather attention or start discussions. Betting on that these things will sell the larger margic trick Excalibur is trying to pull off.

    With the limited space left to characters to interact it's clear that the cast is bloated. We are 11 comics in and we still follow the established pattern of Betsy being used as the hub of team communications. She is communicating with them and they with her. We have how many Rogue-Rictor interactions? Rogue-Jubilee? Gambit-Jubilee? Any combination of characters in 3-4 groups without Betsy? Even the interactions that happen are few and short. So we use the old maxim that many of these characters where suggested to Tini more then she asked for them. She probably could have told this story better with a smaller cast.

    I can't read this comic without seeing the flaws. It doesn't matter if we are going somewhere interesting as the journey there is a jumbled mess. The first scene with Jubilee and the guardians I believe makes a pretty good point of my argument. It has dramatic scenes. Panels that are good to post to gather attention. Flashy. It introduces new concepts and has a battle scene. It might be important in a larger context but as it is in the comic it's jumbled and more of a sidestep then a step forward in the story. A compressed interlude. The battle scene being so very brief and unimportant that it's seemingly there just to give us some action. Like an actionjunkie looking for the next hit.

  9. #84
    Ultimate Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    Cable suspected that Cannonball was an External but Selene claimed he was not. It was left ambiguous to the reader.
    IIRC Cannonball did the External rebirth thing at least once, and also Gideon, Crule and Absolom believed Cannonball was one. To me the only really solid evidence against is possibly just Selene lying.

  10. #85
    Ultimate Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AppleJ View Post
    The real question I have is whether A will have expected Remy to steal Candra's gem from Saturnyne so he can get his mits on it or is that an ace up their sleeve?
    I don't see how it could be Candra's gem. Cyclops shattered it in an effort to kill Candra. Which did leave her in a state of trying to rebuild herself for a long time....

    Also she's regenerated since then and no sign of her having a heart gem has been seen.
    Last edited by marhawkman; 08-22-2020 at 12:53 AM.

  11. #86
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyssane View Post
    She didn't want the other High Lords to gain her power.
    But It read to me as if she was willingly dying...why would she go to the trouble of dying but keeping her power outta the highs of the HL's?
    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    IIRC Cannonball did the External rebirth thing at least once, and also Gideon, Crule and Absolom believed Cannonball was one. To me the only really solid evidence against is possibly just Selene lying.
    To be Fair Gideon had his nose is Sunspot's butt cause he thought he was one.
    GrindrStone(D)

  12. #87
    Astonishing Member ARkadelphia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoganAlpha30X33 View Post
    I wonder if she's become less popular since the change to an English body...
    She may have become less popular, but I don’t think it is due to to the change to an English body
    “Generally, one knows me before hating me” -Quicksilver

  13. #88
    Extraordinary Member Glio's Avatar
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    I don't see any change in trend caused by Betsy's body change.

    In the last two decades she has tended to frequent secondary titles like X-Force before the main series.

  14. #89
    Astonishing Member Veitha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glio View Post
    I don't see any change in trend caused by Betsy's body change.

    In the last two decades she has tended to frequent secondary titles like X-Force before the main series.
    Exactly. She's more prominent now, she's got an important title and her book will be at the centre of the next big event.

  15. #90
    Mighty Member Psyknight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ARkadelphia View Post
    She may have become less popular, but I don’t think it is due to to the change to an English body
    I’m inclined to agree. If she is less popular it’s because of how insufferably dull and irrelevant she is to her own book. The loss of two signifanct trademarks, the Psylocke name and the butterfly and a clunky, frumpy costume don’t help either.

    She’s freaking white now. People like to pretend like that’s not still an advantage, but it is.

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