Sony Universe of Marvel (Spider-Man) Characters Movie Thread

[Metro]

They wanted to invoke that relationship when she said "my friends call me MJ". It was treated as THE REVEAL at the end of Homecoming. Comparing them is absolutely fair game.

No the reveal was Vulture being Liz's dad, this was a best a wink to the audience.
And that doesn't change facts, you can't compare the relationships as if the context and circumstances around them aren't completely different, you aren't at trying to be fair to compare a relationship that was just started by two teens to the relationship of two young adults where one was getting over the death of his previous love

[Kevinroc]

No the reveal was Vulture being Liz's dad, this was a best a wink to the audience.
And that doesn't change facts, you can't compare the relationships as if the context and circumstances around them aren't completely different, you aren't at trying to be fair to compare a relationship that was just started by two teens to the relationship of two young adults where one was getting over the death of his previous love

The Vulture being revealed as Liz's dad wasn't the ending of Homecoming.

This is another version of Peter and MJ. From something that is nominally supposed to be an adaptation of the source material.

[CosmiComic]

The Vulture being revealed as Liz's dad wasn't the ending of Homecoming.

This is another version of Peter and MJ. From something that is nominally supposed to be an adaptation of the source material.

I still don't understand what exactly you want

[Kevinroc]

I still don't understand what exactly you want

Better Spider-Man movies.

[Metro]

The Vulture being revealed as Liz's dad wasn't the ending of Homecoming.

This is another version of Peter and MJ. From something that is nominally supposed to be an adaptation of the source material.

How is this supposed disprove anything I've said?
That doesn't change facts

Better Spider-Man movies.

Sounds more like you want movies catered specifically to you

[Kevinroc]

How is this supposed disprove anything I've said?
That doesn't change facts

The fact is that once she said her friends called her MJ, that is how the movies addressed her from that point forward. It doesn't matter that her name isn't technically Mary Jane. "Michelle" was only ever there to throw off the audience and her being MJ was treated as the big reveal at the ending of Homecoming. (Kind of like "John Blake" in The Dark Knight Rises.)

Sounds more like you want movies catered specifically to you

I wouldn't have tied Spider-Man around Iron Man like the movies have, if that's what you're asking.

[Metro]

The fact is that once she said her friends called her MJ, that is how the movies addressed her from that point forward. It doesn't matter that her name isn't technically Mary Jane. "Michelle" was only ever there to throw off the audience and her being MJ was treated as the big reveal at the ending of Homecoming. (Kind of like "John Blake" in The Dark Knight Rises.)



I wouldn't have tied Spider-Man around Iron Man like the movies have, if that's what you're asking.

It wasn't treated as a big reveal though, it was a wink the audience at most

[Kevinroc]

It wasn't treated as a big reveal though, it was a wink the audience at most

Considering her bigger role in FFH (and presumably NWH), it was more than a wink.

[CosmiComic]

Better Spider-Man movies.

I'd also like them to be better, but I don't think a lot of what you're criticizing is the problem. Some of the changes were good IMO

[Kevinroc]

I'd also like them to be better, but I don't think a lot of what you're criticizing is the problem. Some of the changes were good IMO

The big problem was Iron Man. Iron Man is given too much focus in what are nominally supposed to be Spider-Man movies. Peter is motivated by Tony Stark. Even the villains are motivated by their hatred of Tony Stark. Peter is coded as a working class hero, so having him beat up people personally wronged by a billionaire feels... gross...

Giving Ganke to Peter Parker and renaming him Ned, after the fake Hobgoblin, is another problem. I get that nobody wanted to do Harry Osborn again, but Peter himself has other friends that he doesn't need to take from Miles Morales. (I would have loved to have seen the Robertsons finally getting some screen time in a Spider-Man film. The Robertsons are some of my favorite supporting characters, and they never get their due in Spider-Man adaptations.)

I wish MCU MJ had more of that "Face it, tiger" attitude. I think Zendaya could have done great with that material. The material they gave her is so unremarkable that what should have been a bold casting decision feels so dull. We've seen these kind of romances before in plenty of other movies. (Also, she's "MJ, but not Mary Jane" will always be dumb. Their half-assed approach are why people are still arguing about it going into the third MCU Spider-Man film.)

Would have also been nice if Aunt May weren't just reduced to a sex object for all the older men to lust after.

[Frontier]

Getting back on topic, it looks like a Black Cat movie is back in the works with Felicity Jones being looked at to play a new version of Felicia Hardy (natch).

[CosmiComic]

The big problem was Iron Man. Iron Man is given too much focus in what are nominally supposed to be Spider-Man movies. Peter is motivated by Tony Stark. Even the villains are motivated by their hatred of Tony Stark. Peter is coded as a working class hero, so having him beat up people personally wronged by a billionaire feels... gross...

Giving Ganke to Peter Parker and renaming him Ned, after the fake Hobgoblin, is another problem. I get that nobody wanted to do Harry Osborn again, but Peter himself has other friends that he doesn't need to take from Miles Morales. (I would have loved to have seen the Robertsons finally getting some screen time in a Spider-Man film. The Robertsons are some of my favorite supporting characters, and they never get their due in Spider-Man adaptations.)

I wish MCU MJ had more of that "Face it, tiger" attitude. I think Zendaya could have done great with that material. The material they gave her is so unremarkable that what should have been a bold casting decision feels so dull. We've seen these kind of romances before in plenty of other movies. (Also, she's "MJ, but not Mary Jane" will always be dumb. Their half-assed approach are why people are still arguing about it going into the third MCU Spider-Man film.)

Would have also been nice if Aunt May weren't just reduced to a sex object for all the older men to lust after.

Peter beats up working class villains all the time in the comics. Has he ever tried to address the root problem of crime, or just been a vigilante? Theoretically he could use his powers and knowledge for more.

Anyway, I do agree the MCU Spider-Man films have been too Iron Man-centric. I don't mind them working together and helping each other out, but I feel Peter should be more independent, although not a total "I don't need anyone" loner.

As for Ganke, I don't get why they did that exactly. I like Ned, but he could've just been Ned from the comics as a friend of Peter's. I would like to see the Robertsons appear again.

The Aunt May thing is a double-edge sword IMO. I don't like the male gaze at all, but I also don't like how Hollywood acts like women over 40 aren't attractive. Really, if the MCU switched Hank's and Hope's ages with May's and Peter's, respectively, I think it would be a bit more accurate.

I don't totally get your point about MJ. The original version was way too "male gaze" for me. The MCU is moving away from that, which IMO is good. I don't totally like how their relationship started, but I don't hate. I'd prefer MJ not be reduced to a sex object either

[CosmiComic]

Getting back on topic, it looks like a Black Cat movie is back in the works with Felicity Jones being looked at to play a new version of Felicia Hardy (natch).

So I've heard. What exactly would this be about?

[Frontier]

Peter beats up working class villains all the time in the comics. Has he ever tried to address the root problem of crime, or just been a vigilante? Theoretically he could use his powers and knowledge for more.

Maybe through Daily Bugle articles? Although there have been stories of Spidey being more involved in people's lives, when he can.

As for Ganke, I don't get why they did that exactly. I like Ned, but he could've just been Ned from the comics as a friend of Peter's. I would like to see the Robertsons appear again.

I think it's weird enough that Bugle people are going to high school with Peter.

If they were going to stay true to the Ultimate comics than they should've just had it be Zendaya.

The Aunt May thing is a double-edge sword IMO. I don't like the male gaze at all, but I also don't like how Hollywood acts like women over 40 aren't attractive. Really, if the MCU switched Hank's and Hope's ages with May's and Peter's, respectively, I think it would be a bit more accurate.

I think the problem is she can still look like Marisa Tomei but you don't need to call that much attention to it and give her more meat to work with.

I don't totally get your point about MJ. The original version was way too "male gaze" for me. The MCU is moving away from that, which IMO is good. I don't totally like how their relationship started, but I don't hate. I'd prefer MJ not be reduced to a sex object either

It always feels like she's unfairly penalized just for being attractive, like everything else about her character is somehow negated or made less relevant just because she's good-looking and confident about it, and that that has to be seen as a bad thing.

So I've heard. What exactly would this be about?

A heist movie?

[Metro]

The big problem was Iron Man. Iron Man is given too much focus in what are nominally supposed to be Spider-Man movies. Peter is motivated by Tony Stark. Even the villains are motivated by their hatred of Tony Stark. Peter is coded as a working class hero, so having him beat up people personally wronged by a billionaire feels... gross...

Giving Ganke to Peter Parker and renaming him Ned, after the fake Hobgoblin, is another problem. I get that nobody wanted to do Harry Osborn again, but Peter himself has other friends that he doesn't need to take from Miles Morales. (I would have loved to have seen the Robertsons finally getting some screen time in a Spider-Man film. The Robertsons are some of my favorite supporting characters, and they never get their due in Spider-Man adaptations.)

I wish MCU MJ had more of that "Face it, tiger" attitude. I think Zendaya could have done great with that material. The material they gave her is so unremarkable that what should have been a bold casting decision feels so dull. We've seen these kind of romances before in plenty of other movies. (Also, she's "MJ, but not Mary Jane" will always be dumb. Their half-assed approach are why people are still arguing about it going into the third MCU Spider-Man film.)

Would have also been nice if Aunt May weren't just reduced to a sex object for all the older men to lust after.

See so much of this is blatantly wrong and completely misrepresents what happens in the movies, Peter isn't motivated by Tony, he's motivated by the simple need to do good and help people, the fact he wanted to immediately skip to saving the world and solving big problems doesn't really change that.
And saying Vulture was wrong and motivated by Tony is just wrong, like you almost didn't watch the movie, his motivation is to provide for his family and stealing is the only way he knows how to do it, and Tony's involvement begins and ends with the fact the company who started collaborating with Shield to create Damage Control had his name on it, if anything Vulture was wronged more by those agents who acted condescending towards him.
Then Mysterio wasn't even wronged, he was just crazy, went ballistic, got fired for being crazy and then in response decided to destroy cities and kill people, is the fact the person who fired him was richer than him supposed to make up for the fact he's a vain, egomaniac who kills people without a second thought?
Like what is gross about a guy like this getting his butt kicked?

Then the Ned thing I really don't care about.
And MJ you're not giving any reason why it's a problem, you're just saying you don't like it.
And with May to say she's just a sex object is nothing but blatantly false, there are maybe two brief easy to miss jokes about people finding her attractive in Homecoming, after that she just acts an supportive figure for Peter like May should