Batman: Three Jokers #1 Discussion/Spoilers

[Wrestler]

I noticed that in Three Jokers, Jim Gordon doesn't know Babs is Batgirl. Batman says Jim gave him a disapproving look and he asks Batgirl if Jim knows her secret. And she says "Of course not." (Even if Jim does secretly know, it's clear Babs isn't open with Jim about it, which contradicts a ton of stories from like many post-COIE incarnations)

This aspect alone makes this story nearly impossible to square with continuity (though I haven't been following Batgirl's continuity much since Rebirth, I admit), if one dared to try.

I've just read Batgirl #48 (which just came out yesterday and I'm reading for the sake of Joker War, it's a tie-in) and Barbara literally told JJ that their father doesn't know she is the batgirl.

[JBatmanFan05]

I've just read Batgirl #48 (which just came out yesterday and I'm reading for the sake of Joker War, it's a tie-in) and Barbara literally told JJ that their father doesn't know she is the batgirl.

Ok, interesting. After TKJ, in Post-COIE canon, Jim knew and he and Babs would talk about it. "Faces" (Batman Annual #13 from 1989) is an example of that. It has a flashback to after Babs retired (in Batgirl Special #1) but before Killing Joke, where she briefly came out of retirement to help avenge a cop killed by Two-Face.

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[dietrich]

It's not in continuity. Abernathy and Tynion made that clear in the same interview where they also informed readers that Bat/Cat also wasn't going to be in current continuity.

I don't think it matters that much. I just need it to be good.

[Coal Tiger]

It's not in continuity. Abernathy and Tynion made that clear in the same interview where they also informed readers that Bat/Cat also wasn't going to be in current continuity.

I don't think it matters that much. I just need it to be good.

Well if they’re not even gonna acknowledge the run that immediately preceded theirs, it seems that continuity in general is pretty fluid.

[Restingvoice]

Ok, interesting. After TKJ, in Post-COIE canon, Jim knew and he and Babs would talk about it. "Faces" (Batman Annual #13 from 1989) is an example of that. It has a flashback to after Babs retired (in Batgirl Special #1) but before Killing Joke, where she briefly came out of retirement to help avenge a cop killed by Two-Face.

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I didn't know this. I know he knows, but I thought he keeps to himself that he knows.

He didn't know in New 52 either, or at least, he acted like he didn't know, so they just continue from there

[Denkota]

Indeed continuity has long since become a joke in the DCU so it's foolish speaking about it mattering.

[Badou]

I'm pretty sure Jim knew she was Batgirl in the New 52. Wasn't there some story where he refused to turn around in some Batgirl story because if he did it would admit that he knew who she was or something. So he was pretending not to know basically. I'm pretty sure something like that happened, but I can't remember the story.

[Swallowtail]

Jim knows everyone’s identity, hence the whole ‘I’m blind without my glasses’ moment in year one and him calling Batman ‘Bru-‘ at the end of New 52.

The status quo is he pretends not to know, though.

[Korath]

Well if they’re not even gonna acknowledge the run that immediately preceded theirs, it seems that continuity in general is pretty fluid.

Tynion is mostly acknowledging King's run on Batman, just not his Bat/Cat mini, I think.

[Restingvoice]

I'm pretty sure Jim knew she was Batgirl in the New 52. Wasn't there some story where he refused to turn around in some Batgirl story because if he did it would admit that he knew who she was or something. So he was pretending not to know basically. I'm pretty sure something like that happened, but I can't remember the story.

He said that he didn't want to know because it means he has to arrest her, and if he wants to know he would've found out long ago.

[bat39]

I noticed that in Three Jokers, Jim Gordon doesn't know Babs is Batgirl. Batman says Jim gave him a disapproving look and he asks Batgirl if Jim knows her secret. And she says "Of course not." (Even if Jim does secretly know, it's clear Babs isn't open with Jim about it, which contradicts a ton of stories from like many post-COIE incarnations)

This aspect alone makes this story nearly impossible to square with continuity (though I haven't been following Batgirl's continuity much since Rebirth, I admit), if one dared to try.

I think its set in its own continuity that could maybe fit into current Rebirth continuity if one squints hard enough, and could probably become part of continuity down the line, but can work as a standalone just fine.

This seems to be a continuity where the old Golden Age story of Lew Moxon ordering a hit on the Waynes counts, but where Joe Chill was arrested and is doing life in Arkham (nearly every other version in which Chill is identified as the killer ends with him dying). Obviously, the three key stories Johns is referencing - Batman # 1, TKJ and DITF - count, as do a few other stories like 'The Laughing Fish' and Under the Hood, but otherwise I think its pretty much a case of anything goes. Apparently in this continuity, the Joker has been around for decades, which means at least 20 years...

Incidentially, TKJ was in a similar space continuity-wise when it first came out. But they pretty swiftly incorporated it into mainstream Post-COIE canon.

[Lucky Looke 90]

Within the continuity or not, with contradictions or not, the closure promises to give something to talk about.

Fabok on twitter:

"Well, the ending will cause waves. I'm sure you'll see the ramifications pop up again and again."

[K. Jones]

So Three Jokers.

I've read it once now. I have thoughts but they're very unformed thoughts, which I deem appropriate because it's 1 part of 3 and I truly don't care to speculate, I'd rather take it as it comes and be along for the ride and form an opinion on whether it works or not afterward.

I'll say I perked up at some possible red flags, and also think the idea of Three Jokers works about as well as the idea that there's been Three Bruce Waynes or Three Dick Graysons running around this whole time. But that doesn't mean I hate the premise, or even that I find it totally unnecessary or anything. Although if I was pretending there were Three Jokers for a story, I wouldn't be killing off the one with the JLGL style artwork giving off the Cesar Romero or Mark Hamill vibes. I'd kill the Golden Age guy and the Alan Moore by way of Jack Nicholson guy. (I read a little Nicholson in the Golden Age Joker, too, but bear with it.)

Again it's the first issue of three so I don't think there's any confirmation that the Golden Age Joker "doesn't smile" - just that in running with the fact that he didn't always smile in the G.A., he doesn't smile in this issue, whereby perhaps it's going to play as loads creepier when something in the book finally causes him to crack that Man Who Laughs rictus grin.

Jason reads as the Jason from Pre-Flashpoint here. He's come a long way in a lot of different titles, this guy feels like Jason from immediately in the aftermath of let's say, Morrison's run or something. Still with traces of Hush and Under the Hood in his play style. Babs' costume is awesome, but it also divorces her from like every recent thing. I suppose I don't really care about the canonicity of the book at all, but being that it's hard to reconcile them with Gotham Recent History and it's probably impossible to reconcile the Three Jokers concept, things stand out as pretty irrelevant to the shared universe. Which is weird because you know, "Three Jokers" was set up in Darkseid War (New 52-Central) and Rebirth Special (literally the thing that began Rebirth).

I still don't get a total read on what attributes Johns is ... assigning? ... to which Joker, either, although it seems clear enough that Criminal Joker is supposed to in most ways be representative of Finger & Robinson, Comedian is supposed to be the Alan Moore followup that Johns can't resist, and Clown covers the rest. Other than that, storytelling is well told and straightforward and the mystery is just the inherent mystery to the situation. Clown revisiting the classics (maybe being nostalgic?) weirdly fits a trend Joker has gone down in the last however many years. Although I guess Criminal and Comedian are basically replaying the hits, too. No actual motivation yet other than some notion of "building a better Joker". Definitely a little bit of Chris Nolan influence in the way he broached the subject of the Moxon gangland hit job though. So in spite of his pseudo-classic appearance, I felt like he had a lot more Heath Ledger in his DNA for the Criminal. Oh, and who's to even say Gaggy is dead? Crushed under the jaws of a shark? Maybe. Crushed under the weight of being gulped by a shark? Maybe. But I mean, that's a dead shark and EMTs or whatever else are on their way. That's an easy "if someone wants to use Gaggy again, they can" scenario. Gaggy tried to assassinate Harley Quinn just before the Flashpoint, and we haven't seen him since. He's pretty pathetic as old Joker henches go, but that's probably why Joker hasn't just offed him. Thinks it's funny. The self-referential nature of like, a big smiley shark (Five-Way Revenge) and a bunch of Joker-Fish (Sign of ...) interacting with Gaggy (Silver Age) is kind of neat, too, as 1980s-born but 1990s killer pastiche Jason has no patience for this Silver or even Bronze Age Schtick ... being paired with Babs and Bruce in a goofy aquarium is reminiscent of a '66 Batman Season 3 episode, except Jason's like "F*** THIS" the entire time, with none of the whimsy Grayson would have had. Nice touch.

So yeah ... observations maybe, but no strong opinions yet. On the story, that is.

Fabok on the other hand ... I'm of the strong opinion that Fabok is just utterly fantastic, and that having all the time he needed really created a polished piece of work. His colorist kills it. It honors TKJ maybe but doesn't feel beholden to it. His designwork for Gotham is great, bridging some kind of weird space between Art Deco, Silver Age Big Goofy, Tim Burton-esque and just lived-in and realish. Particularly the Aquarium.

I'm glad these dudes get to tell the weirdo story they want to tell and we'll see where it goes and if anything properly clever is done with it. I'm mostly just cool with Fabok getting to draw these scenarios that have some added subtext and throwbacks to classic stuff.

[Alan2099]

Although if I was pretending there were Three Jokers for a story, I wouldn't be killing off the one with the JLGL style artwork giving off the Cesar Romero or Mark Hamill vibes. I'd kill the Golden Age guy and the Alan Moore by way of Jack Nicholson guy. (I read a little Nicholson in the Golden Age Joker, too, but bear with it.)

I think Three Jokers with Nicholson, Romero, and Ledger based Jokers would be a lot more fun.

[Myskin]

I think Three Jokers with Nicholson, Romero, and Ledger based Jokers would be a lot more fun.

A three Jokers threesome would actually be even funnier.