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  1. #451
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Give it 3 years, we would be back here discussing how the Kevin naysayers were right with this one.
    I've noticed that betting against Marvel Studios is a fool's errand; every time they decide to do the impossible (crossover all their solo movies into one blockbuster, tell a space opera about a tree, raccoon, and Han Solo fanboy saving the universe with a magic rock, cross over all their franchises into one two-part epic with insane expectations, and make B and C list characters beloved superstars), they usually succeed on all fronts. So, if Kevin Feige things he can do the X-Men justice, he has the resume to prove that he could pull it off (heck, this guy was able to diagnose everything that went wrong with the ASM2 movie before it was finished).

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    There was past Hulk Projects and Spiderman Projects, you can use that to compare the strength and weakness of any upcoming MCU X-men.
    Let's see, Feige has gone on record for seeing the Raimi Spider-Man movies as examples of superhero movies done right, knew the flaws with the Mark Webb ones, and oversaw a good reboot of the property that had some exceptional villains, acting, and stories. Hulk's proven to be a good supporting character. That's all actually very encouraging. (Wasn't Feige involved in some of the Fox X-Men movies, too?).

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Lou Ferrigno is quite negative to the ''modern'' MCU Hulk.
    Which is his right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    MCU is just not going to wake up and change their formula because they have X-Men? star wars is a bigger movie series than X-Men and Disney tried to force the MCU formula on star wars.
    The "Marvel formula" is a myth. That is a simple fact (don't believe me; watch the frakking movies). It's time to let it die and focus arguments on actual stuff in the series itself (like maybe weak love stories and villains, or how substantial changes are kind of rare).

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    The perception that MCU actually plans on doing better than Fox is wishful thinking, MCU will make a very fluff generic xmen film . they expect everyone to look past that because it is all about X-Men in the MCU, this was the trick they already used with Spiderman.
    There's more to the MCU Spidey movies then that. In fact, Far From Home has been pushing the character in new directions and setting up stuff never done before. Can we at least give the devil his due?

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Does anyone truly believe the MCU can replicate the about Days Of Future Past/Logan for one of their own MCU films. Forget the very unapologetic adult theme story of the film.
    Days of Future Past, sure; they've got the chops for large team stories and emotional story arcs; they could do it. Logan, maybe not, but do we need a MCU Logan? (Also, I'm not sure you really get what "adult" means; "adult" has nothing to do with a lack of color, comedy, and hope. Heck, some of the most childish stuff in the genre was grimdark, had lot of violence, muted, colors, and people who never cracked smiles or were ever happy -- you know, like real human beings. The Guardians of the Galaxy films are some of the funniest, most comic booky movies out there, but, if you actually look at the story and themes, there's complexity there on the level of Logan. Hint: watch the characters' stories, not the glitz in Guardians or the gore in Logan. That's where real maturity and adult themes are found.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    MCU cannot make a movie that looks like a grounded sci fiction reality.
    The X-Men had their share of wacky sci-fi, stuff, too (killer robots?). It's fair game and most of the really out there MCU movies are out there by artistic design. (Also, what about the Captain America movies?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    You can't sell too many toys with that type of movie.
    Dunno, the original X-Men movie had toys. Heck, I'd pay for Marvel Legends figures of the Fox X-Men characters if they made them (and the X-Men: Evolution show, for that matter -- and no, not just because I want Cyclops and Rogue figurines as alternative wedding cake topper options to Spider-Man and Mary Jane in case I ever got married, thank you very much ). They're currently making Funko Pops of the original X-Men movie characters, too...

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Its going to be cringe inducing to see X-Men looking as colourful and as animated as Avengers, Ant Man or GOTG .
    Like they did in the First Class movies (and Beast's old uniform in X3)? Why was that okay, but the MCU embracing the color wasn't?

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    That alone sucks already compared to X-Men 1 or X-Men 2. If you guys want to jeep bringing up DC. The trailer for The Batman has TDK Vibes, MCU X-Men sending out Logan Vibes will be made possible if Disney announced 6 months before that the movie is coming out under Touchstone.
    Seeing as we don't know a thing about what Marvel Studios has in mind, it's a bit early for doom and gloom; at least know what it is your're damning before actually doing it.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  2. #452
    Fantastic Member Castle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    I've noticed that betting against Marvel Studios is a fool's errand; every time they decide to do the impossible (crossover all their solo movies into one blockbuster, tell a space opera about a tree, raccoon, and Han Solo fanboy saving the universe with a magic rock, cross over all their franchises into one two-part epic with insane expectations, and make B and C list characters beloved superstars), they usually succeed on all fronts. So, if Kevin Feige things he can do the X-Men justice, he has the resume to prove that he could pull it off (heck, this guy was able to diagnose everything that went wrong with the ASM2 movie before it was finished).
    You are talking of two different things. What I am saying is Marvel studios cannot come up with anything better than what Fox or Sony has done at their creatives heights.

    There's more to the MCU Spidey movies then that. In fact, Far From Home has been pushing the character in new directions and setting up stuff never done before. Can we at least give the devil his due?
    How much did far from home push the character to the other films. Let MCU Spiderman deal with marriage, miscarriage, bipolarity and personal loss then we will talk again.


    Days of Future Past, sure; they've got the chops for large team stories and emotional story arcs; they could do it. Logan, maybe not, but do we need a MCU Logan? (Also, I'm not sure you really get what "adult" means; "adult" has nothing to do with a lack of color, comedy, and hope. Heck, some of the most childish stuff in the genre was grimdark, had lot of violence, muted, colors, and people who never cracked smiles or were ever happy -- you know, like real human beings. The Guardians of the Galaxy films are some of the funniest, most comic booky movies out there, but, if you actually look at the story and themes, there's complexity there on the level of Logan. Hint: watch the characters' stories, not the glitz in Guardians or the gore in Logan. That's where real maturity and adult themes are found.)

    they don't have the chops for it. For them to do so, means MCU would have to rethink what they censor. There is no such thing as ''real maturity'' in the MCU. Its pseudo at best when you compare it to DOFP. This is how and why they throw away all the harder gritter part of the comics.

    from screencrush, a site that is very favourably to MCU movies. they love mcu and they were not so kind to films like Logan and Joker. However screencrush explains what makes X-Men 1 a true adult comic movie that does not exist today with MCU.

    The X-Men had their share of wacky sci-fi, stuff, too (killer robots?). It's fair game and most of the really out there MCU movies are out there by artistic design. (Also, what about the Captain America movies?)
    I think MCU has ran too much away with the wacky stuff. Close Encounters or Space odyssey or Arrival could have been as wacky as the MCU but there was some pull back. Captain America movies was more A-Effort, after MCU had many movies that never went part fluff .its not a fair comparison to xmen

    Like they did in the First Class movies (and Beast's old uniform in X3)? Why was that okay, but the MCU embracing the color wasn't?
    While First class did not have the dark grit look of the others, I won't say first class looked like an MCU movie. First class is more siren in look with a period piece setting of the 40s and 60s.
    Seeing as we don't know a thing about what Marvel Studios has in mind, it's a bit early for doom and gloom; at least know what it is your're damning before actually doing it.
    24 movies bro, 24 movies, they have 24 movies. we know more about MCU movies than we do to DC or Fox. lol. All 24 MOVIES are clones. 1% chance of X-Men not looking the same
    Last edited by Castle; 09-05-2020 at 08:59 AM.

  3. #453
    Astonishing Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Humans were already angry and scared. Magneto was just being Magneto. However the best part was Magneto trying to kill the president and his team on live tv to show who really has the true power. You will never see this type of aggressive social theme in an mcu movie because if magneto is a villain, so is the president.
    Sabotaging the sentinels was a clever move, but giving reason to the humans that the mutants are really the threat they suspect, not so much…

    But, yes, typical villain behaviour…

  4. #454
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    Its going to be cringe inducing to see X-Men looking as colourful and as animated as Avengers, Ant Man or GOTG .
    Why do you hate color?

  5. #455
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    So...this thread has once again predictably become a Marvel versus Fox debate fest again? I knew the thread topic was going to be an invitation for this to happen, but sheesh, lol.

    Let me answer the thread question: Feige knows the Marvel characters inside and out, and he already was involved in the original X-Men movies as an associate producer, and he learned enough in that time where he had little creative say to shape him into being the maestro that he is now. Kevin’s MCU certainly has better quality control than Fox Marvel ever had, and that’s largely attributed to Feige’s experience working on Marvel films that were licensed by other studios. With this mind, one can at least assume he’ll be able to make a decent X-Men movie that’s more aesthetically closer to the comics than what the Fox movies were comfortable with.

    Whatever happens with MCU X-Men, I know at the very least it won’t be a rehash of what’s come before. Heck, it’s very likely we won’t even see Magneto in the first film since I suspect Marvel would want to avoid too many comparisons to the Fox versions, and opt for a fresh spin on the mythos. Like what they did with their version of Spider-Man. Marvel would want to explore different aspects of the comics that haven’t been tapped into before by the Fox films. So I’m pretty stoked for that alone.
    Last edited by Amadeus Arkham; 09-06-2020 at 09:36 AM.
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  6. #456
    Incredible Member Kingdom X's Avatar
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    As others have mentioned I really think we’ll just have to wait and see.

    I understand why they went with a lighter approach with the MCU Spider-Man. Sony had just botched the Death of Gwen Stacy and the average moviegoer was tired of seeing the same Spider-Man stories.

    I think the MCU X-Men are going to have an advantage since many of their most popular characters and stories didn’t get adapted by Fox (or at least get adapted properly) so the MCU has a treasure trove of material to adapt.

  7. #457
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    If I get an X-Men film that is a cross between the radical and bold weirdness of Morrison’s New X-Men. and the fun dynamic character-driven nature of Whedon’s Astonishing X-Men then I think I will get my ideal X-Men movie basically.
    "I love mankind...it's people I can't stand!!"

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  8. #458
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    There is no such thing as ''real maturity'' in the MCU. Its pseudo at best...
    No, there is; the filmmakers just know that being mature doesn't also mean that you can't have fun along the way (heck, even Logan had its comic relief)



    Could say more, but I don't think you're listening to anything I'm saying and I honestly think that you don't want to actually discuss this, so I think it's time we let this tangent drop.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  9. #459
    Fantastic Member Castle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus Arkham View Post
    So...this thread has once again predictably became a Marvel versus Fox debate fest again? I knew the thread topic was going to be an invitation for this to happen, but sheesh, lol.

    Let me answer the thread question: Feige knows the Marvel characters inside and out, and he already was involved in the original X-Men movies as an associate producer, and he learned enough in that time where he had little creative say to shape him into being the maestro that he is now. Kevin’s MCU certainly has better quality control than Fox Marvel ever had, and that’s largely attributed to Feige’s experience working on Marvel films that were licensed by other studios. With this mind, one can at least assume he’ll be able to make a decent X-Men movie that’s more aesthetically closer to the comics than what the Fox movies were comfortable with.

    I can off felt the debate was over after Logan and Disney closed the deal around 2018. there is only still a debate if fox were making more movies. The onus now is on Kevin Feige. Fox is a thing of the past, though a pretty strong legacy compared to what Disney thinks of comic books movies.

    What a lot of Feige fans don't realise is they are also telling us Kevin Feige won't do any better than Fox did because they keep bringing up all of the worst fox movies only.

    Whatever happens with MCU X-Men, I know at the very least it won’t be a rehash of what’s come before. Heck, it’s very likely we won’t even see Magneto in the first film since I suspect Marvel would want to avoid too many comparisons to the Fox versions, and opt for a fresh spin on the mythos. Like what they did with their of Spider-Man. Marvel would want to explore different facets of the comics that haven’t been tapped into before by the Fox films.
    If we don't see Magneto, it would be for the same reasons as we don't see Kingpin. One of the least things to look forward to is Feige's villains. MCU does not have many good villains. I don't see Feige making X-Men villains as dangerous and unbeatable like the Future Sentinels or more POV Grey Villains like Senator Kelly and Trask.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    Why do you hate color?
    I don't hate color. I love when movies take place in a grounded brash real world instead of Disney land Paris.

  10. #460
    Extraordinary Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    What a lot of Feige fans don't realise is they are also telling us Kevin Feige won't do any better than Fox did because they keep bringing up all of the worst fox movies only.
    Um, no?

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    One of the least things to look forward to is Feige's villains. MCU does not have many good villains.
    Loki, Thanos, Alexander Pierce, Killmonger, Ego, Vulture, Mysterio (and Zemo, Ghost, and Hela were pretty effective characters, too). Villains are frankly one thing on the list that the MCU has a better track record with then Fox (Magneto and Stryker [Brian Cox version] are the only real standouts).

    [Edit: forgot about Sebastian Shaw in First Class; he's not a complicated character -- just a hammy guy who loves being evil -- but it's the best kind of hammy evil bad guy.]
    Last edited by WebLurker; 09-05-2020 at 10:55 AM.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  11. #461
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    I've noticed that betting against Marvel Studios is a fool's errand; every time they decide to do the impossible (crossover all their solo movies into one blockbuster, tell a space opera about a tree, raccoon, and Han Solo fanboy saving the universe with a magic rock, cross over all their franchises into one two-part epic with insane expectations, and make B and C list characters beloved superstars), they usually succeed on all fronts. So, if Kevin Feige things he can do the X-Men justice, he has the resume to prove that he could pull it off (heck, this guy was able to diagnose everything that went wrong with the ASM2 movie before it was finished).
    The Avengers were already beloved superheroes. Like Iron Man for example had been in develop for a movie for years same with captain america. Keep in mind after the Lee-Kirby and Byrne F4 they fell from being Marvel’s A or even B team and Avengers and X Men filled that slot. And as for GotG one of the most beloved movie franchises has a space Sasquatch as a lead and people criticized the recent movies for being too funny

    any moron could’ve seen why TASM2 was going to flop from the script changes, reshoots and rewrites. The writing was on the wall. All Feige has done is make a bunch of money from disposable action movies that will be mostly forgotten in the coming years. And i’ve made several successful predictions. I said that Captain Marvel would be mediocre yet still make money and i was right. I said that Black Panther would be overrated for its half backed message and it got nominated for an oscar, I said marvel will lose support after losing their prime heroes and now everyone is jumping ship to DC saying its their time. So I have little faith in a MCU XMen and can already see what they’ll do next. Probably make Cyclops or Jean or even Bobby a racial minority, play up Bobby’s sexuality despite it being a horribly done retcon from recent years and give us a dollar store version of Magneto or whatever cgi monstrosity they can laser and mutilate while keeping a PG13 rating

    There's more to the MCU Spidey movies then that. In fact, Far From Home has been pushing the character in new directions and setting up stuff never done before. Can we at least give the devil his due?
    MCU Spider-man has been awful. Holland is a great actor but the writing has been terrible. He focuses too much on Iron Man, has no difference between Peter and Spider-Man and makes stupid decision after stupid decision. The side characters have all been awful and besides the Mysterio illusions most of the action have been below average. I won’t give Feige dues for making Spider-man arguably the low point of the mcu SPIDER-MAN. People complain about the changes Zack Snyder makes but he hasn’t made a quarter of the changes mcu has made and the argument that mcu heroes weren’t popular and thus were bad and needed change is moot given how much spider-man was altered. At this point they may as well have gone with Miles and skipped Peter considering if they are going to introduce Miles what would make him different? Like Miles and Peter were already way to similar now there just is no difference between them

  12. #462
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post

    Loki, Thanos, Alexander Pierce, Killmonger, Ego, Vulture, Mysterio (and Zemo, Ghost, and Hela were pretty effective characters, too). Villains are frankly one thing on the list that the MCU has a better track record with then Fox (Magneto and Stryker [Brian Cox version] are the only real standouts).
    And marvel turned Loki to an anti hero. Thanos was 10 years of development. Pierce? Who was that guy? Ego was mediocre. Killmonger’s message was half baked. Zemo was awful and Ghost was a forgettable mook. Hela was cool though but she just hammed it up. As for X Men how about Trask? Or Mystique? How about Shaw and the Hellfire club? Even Apocalypse was better than most mcu villains

  13. #463

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dboi2001 View Post
    And marvel turned Loki to an anti hero. Thanos was 10 years of development. Pierce? Who was that guy? Ego was mediocre. Killmonger’s message was half baked. Zemo was awful and Ghost was a forgettable mook. Hela was cool though but she just hammed it up. As for X Men how about Trask? Or Mystique? How about Shaw and the Hellfire club? Even Apocalypse was better than most mcu villains
    Fox turned Mystique to an anti-hero.

    Trask? Who was that guy?

    Apocalypse was mediocre.

    Shaw was cool, but he just hammed it up.

    The Hellfire Club were just forgettable mooks.

  14. #464
    Spectacular Member Imago's Avatar
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    I dont trust Kevin Feige will do the x-Men Justice.... in fact im expecting to be disappointed.
    With that said, i still believe they'll do a better job than what Fox has been doing lately.

    I enjoy MCU movies (although i cant say im a big fan), but i dont think they can approach the X-men movies the same way they did with the Avengers, they are gonna need to take some risks with the mutants and i dont think they will.
    Oh and i hate the way they've been handling Spider-man

  15. #465
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    Loki, Thanos, Alexander Pierce, Killmonger, Ego, Vulture, Mysterio (and Zemo, Ghost, and Hela were pretty effective characters, too). Villains are frankly one thing on the list that the MCU has a better track record with then Fox (Magneto and Stryker [Brian Cox version] are the only real standouts).
    They used Stryker in four movies and his father in an additional movie and he's still a really forgettable character.

    Apocalypse was mediocre.
    No. Apocalypse was just a waste of a perfectly good character. He was bad.

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