Anyone see New Mutants this weekend?

[XPac]

I don’t see how Wonder Woman wasn’t groundbreaking for female Superhero movies.

If we're coming at it from purely the perspective of a female getting her own movie Super Girl, Electra and Cat Woman got there first. And that's not including more indy-sh characters like Tank Girl and Barb Wire.

Though I guess you can argue it was the first female super hero movie that didn't suck.

[Frontier]

If we're coming at it from purely the perspective of a female getting her own movie Super Girl, Electra and Cat Woman got there first.

Though I guess you can argue it was the first female super hero movie that didn't suck.

That’s what I meant .

[Cyke]

Well it is impossible to explain how DOFP, Batman Begins, Deadpool have the same RT as even the admitted average MCU movies. The word for it is bias.

It's not my place to judge behavior, but I really hope you see the commonalities of how people are responding to your tone in this thread and in the X-Board. You're facing an uphill battle against several populations just by the way you're engaging fellow posters by positing yourself as better than everyone, even those that endorse this movie. Like, there can be disagreement without disparagement.

[Castle]

Eh, 7 out of 10. Some weaker points and I suppose as a horror movie it was pretty tame (but then again, I hate scary movies). Solid cast, the plot was coherent (which isn't always the case for movies with troubled productions), and I respect it trying something different within the genre. I mean, I would've liked to have seen the rest of this planned trilogy. I did go in with low expectations and seeing the characters brought to life was very fun, having been reading the comics, so those are my biases, but it was by no means a disgrace. I'd say it was a better sendoff then Dark Phoenix was and was a heckuva lot better then most other poorly reviews superhero movies (Venom comes to mind).

6/10 or 7/10 looks to be the common score of comic fans. If the film was not fox, it would be high 70s or low 80s.

It's not my place to judge behavior, but I really hope you see the commonalities of how people are responding to your tone in this thread and in the X-Board, even by posters that have similar tastes as you. You're facing an uphill battle against several populations just by the way you're engaging fellow posters by positing yourself as better than everyone, even those that endorse this movie. Like, there can be disagreement without disparagement.

Please I hope this is not me you are talking about. I am nice and respectful to people. I felt RT was incoherent with all the comic films that was sent to me, how two movies can have the same rt score. I wanted anyone to explain what I was missing.

[XPac]

6/10 or 7/10 looks to be the common score of comic fans. If the film was not fox, it would be high 70s or low 80s.


Please I hope this is not me you are talking about. I am nice and respectful to people. I felt RT was incoherent with all the comic films that was sent to me, how two movies can have the same rt score. I wanted anyone to explain what I was missing.

I find it funny people think Rotton Tomatoes have a Disney bias against Warner Bros. movies when WB partially owns it.

[AnakinFlair]

This is why I never listen to critics. At the end of the day, a review is subjective, and depends entirely on the tastes of the individual reviewer- which may not be the same as my tastes. So I'll just see the movie and make up my own damn mind.

Eh, 7 out of 10. Some weaker points and I suppose as a horror movie it was pretty tame (but then again, I hate scary movies). Solid cast, the plot was coherent (which isn't always the case for movies with troubled productions), and I respect it trying something different within the genre. I mean, I would've liked to have seen the rest of this planned trilogy. I did go in with low expectations and seeing the characters brought to life was very fun, having been reading the comics, so those are my biases, but it was by no means a disgrace. I'd say it was a better sendoff then Dark Phoenix was and was a heckuva lot better then most other poorly reviews superhero movies (Venom comes to mind).

Here's the thing with New Mutants- I'm not entirely sure it ever got to truly be a troubled production. Don't get me wrong, it was headed that way- Fox wanted re-shoots, and now we're hearing they were talking of scrapping the whole movie and starting over. They wanted to make it more like a horror movie than they got because they were chasing 'It'. They even ended up delaying it so they could do some, or all, of this.

But then Disney happened. The reshoots never happened. The movie sat on a shelf for- what, three years? And Disney had no desire to go back and do anything to it, other than release it to get it out there so they didn't have to deal with it anymore. But what was released was the director's initial vision.

[Amadeus Arkham]

If we're coming at it from purely the perspective of a female getting her own movie Super Girl, Electra and Cat Woman got there first. And that's not including more indy-sh characters like Tank Girl and Barb Wire.

Though I guess you can argue it was the first female super hero movie that didn't suck.

It was also the first one that was actually successful at the box office. There was never a financially successful female lead superhero film before WW came out. All the female superhero movies until then were flops that lost money. That alone, is a big deal.

[Amadeus Arkham]

I thought New Mutants was pretty “meh” but I will say that I love that it’s the first superhero movie to have a LGBTQ couple as the central love story. That’s a great thing to see. Someone correct me if I wrong, but I think it may even feature the first gay kiss in a superhero film. Major kudos for Boone for that, even if I think he’s a total idiot for his remarks on the white-washing controversy. Boone did a good thing in that respect. The gay romance was just about the only memorable thing in the movie, imo.

Edit: Oh wait, didn’t the Negasonic Teenage character kiss her Japanese girlfriend in DP2?

[AnakinFlair]

I thought New Mutants was pretty “meh” but I will say that I love that it’s the first superhero movie to have a LGBTQ couple as the central love story. That’s a great thing to see. Someone correct me if I wrong, but I think it may even feature the first gay kiss in a superhero film. Major kudos for Boone for that, even if I think he’s a total idiot for his remarks on the white-washing controversy. Boone did a good thing in that respect. The gay romance was just about the only memorable thing in the movie, imo.

Edit: Oh wait, didn’t the Negasonic Teenage character have kiss her Japanese girlfriend in DP2?

Probably. I think the closest we've come to LGBTQ representation in superhero movies of the last decade (if ever) was the subtext of a relationship between Carol Danvers and Maria Rambeau in Captain Marvel. Even relationships between Amazons in Wonder Woman were not focused on.

But I can't think of anything else off the top of my head.

[Steel Inquisitor]

This is why I never listen to critics. At the end of the day, a review is subjective, and depends entirely on the tastes of the individual reviewer- which may not be the same as my tastes. So I'll just see the movie and make up my own damn mind.

What's vital is finding critics who like the same things you do, that's why they're useful. I've got several who I count on for this and do the job right.

[WebLurker]

Probably. I think the closest we've come to LGBTQ representation in superhero movies of the last decade (if ever) was the subtext of a relationship between Carol Danvers and Maria Rambeau in Captain Marvel. Even relationships between Amazons in Wonder Woman were not focused on.

But I can't think of anything else off the top of my head.

Thought the Marvel/Maria stuff left too much unsaid (several points where it seemed like if they had been in a relationship, that would've come up and it kinda makes the ending seem more then a little sadder if Carol is basically abandoning her partner and their kid after years of already being separated). On the other hand, I'd be onboard if they were depicted as couple down the road. (The YA prequel tie-in actually had them saying "I love you," albeit the context implying a sisterly love).

So far as LGBTQ+ in theatrical superhero movies, going off the top of my head:

Birds of Prey (2020): During Harley Quinn's animated monologue about her past, a woman is shown among depictions of her failed relationships, establishing her DCEU incarnation to be bisexual (although it's a blink and you'll miss it bit and the bulk of the movie is about her broken relationship with the Joker and surrogate family bond with Cassandra). Renee Montoya's ex-girlfriend plays a role in the movie, although we only see them as exes. Some people interpreted Zsasz has having a crush on Black Mask (he's shown to be unhappy with Mask spending time with Black Canary, for one), but I have no idea if that was the intent or not (he's just called a "BFF" onscreen).

Avengers: Endgame (2019): Man in Cap's support group is gay (talks about going on a date with another man), but we're only told about it and the scene is incidental to the whole film.

Deadpool 2/Once Upon a Deadpool (2018): Lesbian couple in the supporting cast (never saw it, so no clue how it played out).

Power Rangers (2017): The Yellow Ranger is a LGBTQ character (unspecified what she is, but the Powers That Be confirmed that she's not straight). It comes up when the Rangers start trying to open up to each other (specifically that she thinks her family won't accept her for being different), but she'd never shown having a relationship or being interested in anyone as a significant other.

Beyond that, I'm drawing blanks.

[Midvillian1322]

I find it funny people think Rotton Tomatoes have a Disney bias against Warner Bros. movies when WB partially owns it.

Or because movies have the same score that somehow reviewers thought they were of the same quality.. A movie like Antman is hard to hate. Its a fun heist flick with alot of comedy. Of course its scores are gonna be good when its a simple pass or fail. While something like Joker is gonna be absolutely loved and praised by some people, while other are gonna be turned off by the movie. Even the average Marvel movies are hard to hate. So they get better scores cause less people hated it. That doesn't mean the people who liked Joker and liked Antman thought they were of the same quality. Its just an average of a pass or fail system. Marvel movies are well liked all across the spectrum. Common sense tells you they are gonna do well on something like RTs where its either pass or fail. There's no bias, any movies that appeal to a wide spectrum of people are gonna do well.

[Killerbee911]

Or because movies have the same score that somehow reviewers thought they were of the same quality.. A movie like Antman is hard to hate. Its a fun heist flick with alot of comedy. Of course its scores are gonna be good when its a simple pass or fail. While something like Joker is gonna be absolutely loved and praised by some people, while other are gonna be turned off by the movie. Even the average Marvel movies are hard to hate. So they get better scores cause less people hated it. That doesn't mean the people who liked Joker and liked Antman thought they were of the same quality. Its just an average of a pass or fail system. Marvel movies are well liked all across the spectrum. Common sense tells you they are gonna do well on something like RTs where its either pass or fail. There's no bias, any movies that appeal to a wide spectrum of people are gonna do well.

I hilarious pulled the metacritic scores in another thread, which assign all the reviews a numerical grade and has middle/average rating on its scale

Metacritic Scores

Black Panther 88
Dark Knight 84
Spiderman 2 83
Superman II 83
Superman 80
Iron Man 79
Endgame 78
Logan 77
Wonder Woman 76
CA Civil War 75
DoFP 75
Spiderman 73
Spider Homecoming 73
Winter Solider 70
Avengers 69
Far from Home 69
Infinity Wars 68
X2 68

Joker 59

Fan4stic 27
Catwoman 27

Without the Rotten Tomato "bias" MCU films still did well. Even if you don't agree with order completely it is pretty clear critics don't care who is making the movie as long it is good it will score high. Except maybe a really controversial film where people are clearly split on it

[Castle]

I hilarious pulled the metacritic scores in another thread, which assign all the reviews a numerical grade and has middle/average rating on its scale



Without the Rotten Tomato "bias" MCU films still did well. Even if you don't agree with order completely it is pretty clear critics don't care who is making the movie as long it is good it will score high. Except maybe a really controversial film where people are clearly split on it

All the metacritic scores are part of rotten tomatoes.

Its a lot more hilarious Superman returns is a far from great movie but still has a better metacritic score than Winter Solider, objectively broken down as the best MCU movie that even I support to the best.

Although both metacritc and Rotten Tomatoes fades into obscurity when the actual criticism.

Had new mutants been part of the MCU, from MCU rt score and metacritc. it would be a 83% RT 67% Metacritic

Or because movies have the same score that somehow reviewers thought they were of the same quality.. A movie like Antman is hard to hate. Its a fun heist flick with alot of comedy. Of course its scores are gonna be good when its a simple pass or fail. While something like Joker is gonna be absolutely loved and praised by some people, while other are gonna be turned off by the movie. Even the average Marvel movies are hard to hate. So they get better scores cause less people hated it. That doesn't mean the people who liked Joker and liked Antman thought they were of the same quality. Its just an average of a pass or fail system. Marvel movies are well liked all across the spectrum. Common sense tells you they are gonna do well on something like RTs where its either pass or fail. There's no bias, any movies that appeal to a wide spectrum of people are gonna do well.

A well liked fun movie is not the same as quality. Quality is one of those things that is more head driven than heart driven. quality is basically more from a pure artful film view point. I like many well liked fun movies and I hate some depressing movies but if that depressing movies did do well in the story, themes, depth, cinematography, unforgettable performances by the actors, it does not take a genius to which was had more quality.

Ant-Man 1 and 2 is the best example, has a higher RT score but it is not Deadpool or Joker that you will find of many recent best comic book film discussion. RT and metacritic are used when a person cannot convincingly explain the quality of a movie Reason we cannot name 10 directors or producers use RT and meta critic when they discuss their favourite movies.

[Castle]

Duplicated post.