Is JMS run actually THAT good?

[tib2d2]

Man I remember reading all the trades of JMS's run like 12 years ago and just remember really enjoying it. Now I'm second guessing my own taste, haha.

[WebSlingWonder]

Agreed.

At the end of the day, JMS' run is quite respected and influential. Many young writers like Chip Zdarsky among others said they got back to reading Spider-Man after dropping out during the Clone Saga on account of him. Donny Cates is another professed fan. As is Kevin Feige who is an overall JMS fan, citing his run on Thor, his Civil War tie-ins, and his Spider-Man run as reference points for his work. Stories like "Doomed Affairs" are now considered classics, with a recent Cosmic Ghost Rider story doing an extended homage to it.

You know one of my favorite bits that JMS did with Spider-Man and Mary Jane is his non-canon Silver Surfer Requiem, where each issue had Surfer meet a different hero and the second issue is with Spider-Man. The art is by Esad Ribic (of Gorr the God Butcher and SW'2015 fame) and it looks great.

I never read that Silver Surfer: Requiem: I didn't know JMS wrote that! Thanks!

[WebSlingWonder]

Man I remember reading all the trades of JMS's run like 12 years ago and just remember really enjoying it. Now I'm second guessing my own taste, haha.

No, no, no: don't let other people make you question your taste. Your reading experience will be different from others. Being open to opinions isn't a bad thing: it's when those opinions override your own that becomes a problem.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

If you gave me a bowl that was 4/5 spaghetti and meatballs...

So you agree that 4/5ths of JMS’ run is good. Thanks. That’s my view too

[WebSlingWonder]

So you agree that 4/5ths of JMS’ run is good. Thanks. That’s my view too

BOSS

[PCN24454]

Man I remember reading all the trades of JMS's run like 12 years ago and just remember really enjoying it. Now I'm second guessing my own taste, haha.

That's how I came to dislike it. It just wasn't as good as I thought it was. It was amazing how much of his run I felt like skipping over. It was just bland and uninteresting rather than outright bad.

[Spidey_62]

Coming Home is one of my favorite Spidey stories, I think it's the excellent grasp on Peter, putting him into a smart role teaching at his old high school, making him question his beliefs and come out on the other end stronger, the relentless fight between Spidey and Morlun... it's great. Plus the follow-up with Aunt May. I think that whole first year was a really different type of approach to the character that worked because it stripped things down to the bare basics, taking all of what Peter's gone through before and presenting him as a dude who's learned from all that and is just trying his best to move forward, and it tried new ideas like having new villains with a bit of a magical element. The work in Jenkins title at the same time pretty much also offered a similar perspective with Peter but had more of the classic villains showing up where Doc Ock was the only classic villain that showed up for years in JMS's run. Kinda funny actually how the b-title had more of the heavy hitting classic villain stories like Death in The Family at the time.

I think the run isn't as strong past #500 but it still sticks the landing by the time JRJR departs. Sins Past and onward I just do not care for at all, like a flip switches and it doesn't click for me. There's good moments in a lot of the stories from that point on still, but the stories just weren't going in good directions with the heavier editorial oversight. I hate The Other, the Avengers story is alright, don't care for the Civil War tie ins or Back in Black either. Crashed and burned by OMD, what a travesty there needless to say.

[JTHM]

Personally, and I know its a somewhat unpopular opinion, but I've always liked the spiritual and mystic elements that JMS introduced in his run. A character as old as Spider-Man is always bound to step on the same threads, no pun intent, but also bound to eventually experiment in different areas and I think that stepping into more mystic territory outside of his comfort zone of low Sci-fi was interesting, I liked the Spider-Totem stuff and I don't feel it was meant to replace his normal, mundane origin but rather both co-exist. And I don't know, Shathra and Morlun were cool back then.

Aside from that, I liked his take on an adult Peter. Yes, I can understand the complains about how it wasn't continuity friendly. But I am a new reader, I was still crawling (or maybe not even alive) When the change happened, so I obviously wasn't following the book and I just read JMS in the vacuum that it is, and in that context I enjoyed his take. Peter felt mature and like a proper adult and, for me, that version should be the basics when you want to write an older Spider-Man. MJ and Aunt May were never my favorite characters, but I enjoyed them in this run nonetheless and they never felt bothersome, even if the dynamic of the trio felt a bit small to me.

Overall, I think it has great moments and concepts that speak to a lot of people, which is why is such a debated and popular run even to this day. I wouldn't say its my all time favorite, but I certainly enjoyed it and, again, I feel that JMS' takes on an older Spider-Man and his cast should be quintessential when someone is trying to write him that way.

[DT Winslow]

I’ve never enjoyed JMS. I’ve not really liked anything he’s written. Spider-Man is no exception.

The 9/11 issue might be one of the worst and most tone deaf things I’ve read in comics.

*The above is my opinion and my opinion only*

Purple Monkey Dishwasher

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Personally, and I know its a somewhat unpopular opinion, but I've always liked the spiritual and mystic elements that JMS introduced in his run. A character as old as Spider-Man is always bound to step on the same threads, no pun intent, but also bound to eventually experiment in different areas and I think that stepping into more mystic territory outside of his comfort zone of low Sci-fi was interesting, I liked the Spider-Totem stuff and I don't feel it was meant to replace his normal, mundane origin but rather both co-exist. And I don't know, Shathra and Morlun were cool back then.

Preach.

Aside from that, I liked his take on an adult Peter. Yes, I can understand the complains about how it wasn't continuity friendly.

It absolutely was continuity friendly and JMS' Peter is totally in-keeping with the character written by Lee-Ditko, Romita, Conway, Stern, Defalco, Michelinie, and also Mantlo, PAD, DeMatteis and Jenkins in Spectacular.

When the change happened, so I obviously wasn't following the book and I just read JMS in the vacuum that it is, and in that context I enjoyed his take.

Well that's what JMS was hired for. Wipe the slate clean of the stuff that clogged ASM until then and provide a new jumping in point for readers.

[PCN24454]

I’ve never enjoyed JMS. I’ve not really liked anything he’s written. Spider-Man is no exception.

The 9/11 issue might be one of the worst and most tone deaf things I’ve read in comics.

*The above is my opinion and my opinion only*

Purple Monkey Dishwasher

From a story perspective, it’s incredibly jarring and pretty much ignores the massive cliffhanger of the previous book.

Unfortunately, JMS and a lot of Marvel writers live and worked in/near New York. The attacks hit way closer to home than any other the writers were prepared to deal with.

It’s likely the reason why they had to make this sort of story, even if it’s out-of-place. It was their way of coping with the tragedy.

That’s what I tell myself whenever I feel like complaining about it.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

From a story perspective, it’s incredibly jarring and pretty much ignores the massive cliffhanger of the previous book.

Unfortunately, JMS and a lot of Marvel writers live and worked in/near New York. The attacks hit way closer to home than any other the writers were prepared to deal with.

It’s likely the reason why they had to make this sort of story, even if it’s out-of-place. It was their way of coping with the tragedy.

That’s what I tell myself whenever I feel like complaining about it.

The 9/11 issue opens with a card saying to the effect that "we interrupt our normal scheduled program". It's made clear that this is non-canonical, break-the-fourth-wall stuff.

That issue was super meaningful to many people at that time. Kids across America got a hold of that comic. As did many people on the ground and around that area to process what they are going with.

John Romita Jr. and the editor of the comic talks about that here. Apparently JMS just wrote the words to this, and didn't do a panel by panel breakdown. As such, as the editor and Romita Jr. make clear, JMS wasn't responsible for the panel with Marvel villains grieving.

[Agent Z]

I never liked his run at all.

JMS never seemed to click right with the characters. There personalities seemed to shift when he took over and he wrote MJ and Peter like they've suddenly had an extra ten years of marriage. Then he completely changed Aunt May's entire personality.

He avoided the classic rogues and often seemed to use lesser ripoffs of them. He also ditched almost the entire supporting cast. Spider-man has a great supporting cast and a great set of rogues. It would be almost criminal not to use them even IF you replaced them with something else interesting, which he did not.

Then we have Morlun. At best, Morlun was Morbius except THE MOST POWERFUL THING EVER!!!!! Minus anything that made Morbius interesting and lacking in any kind of personality.

The Spider-Totem stuff went compeltley against the themes of the book and dragged it down.

I'm not even going to get into Sins past and One More Day, (although I will say the idea behind One More Day wasn't a bad one, but the book itself was written poorly.)

Sins Past and One Mored Day are entirely on Quaseda.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Sins Past and One Mored Day are entirely on Quaseda.

OMD certainly, but Sins' Past is all JMS.

Quesada's involvement with that was vetoing the concept of Gwen being mother to Peter's children and he suggested Norman instead. But it was still JMS' call to take that and run with it, rather than simply spiking his story as it was becoming unworkable. Quesada is also responsible for not giving JMS a hard no to this concept as Shooter gave Mantlo in a similar situation. Quesada as EIC is a unique case of someone causing a mess by intervening beyond his job's confines and not intervening when he should be doing his job.

But ultimately, final responsibility rests with JMS and he himself has admitted that numerous times.

The Other was a story crossover that Marvel pitched and an ask to bring Morlun back which JMS didn't want to revisit at the time. But he still agreed to it, and since he didn't write every issue of that, you can't hold him completely responsible but you can to some extent. The concept of giving Spider-Man organic webbing which happened in Paul Jenkins' story, that was all Quesada, and not JMS.

So I blame Quesada for OMD and partial blame for The Other.

[Alan2099]

The story ideas may not be JMS, but the execution was all his, so he's in no way blameless.