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  1. #1
    Always Rakzo
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    Default The Flash #761 Discussion/Spoilers

    Joshua Williamson did it again!

    The writer continues to escalate his final arc and offering a lot of fanservice and necessary explanations. About the fanservice part, let's just say that the writer delivers all the Flash family appearances he has been teasing basically since the beginning of his run including classic members like Max Mercury and Jesse Quick but also even recently reintroduced Wally's kids, Jai and Irey.

    More importantly though, the writer reveals Thawne's powers extend to the influence he had over the Flash family and all to ruin Barry's life. This is a concept that has been seen since Geoff Johns' Flash Rebirth but this time is executed much more favorably to explain the inconsistencies in characterization over the years. Yes, Wally's actions in Heroes in Crisis are included here, character salvation.

    Howard Porter's artwork is amazing with a great sense of energy and depicts many important details about the characters and plot.

    Great read, hope the upcoming conclusion is satisfying.

  2. #2
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    There are still some questions needing answers next issue. Max, Jesse, and XS could be homeless. Jenni can't return to the Legion of Super-Heroes as they've been rebooted - twice! Jesse's company Quickstart will probably be gone, and will Max's daughter Helen even still exist? In Flash Forward, Jai said that "Mom had better not have thrown out my Gamestation" or something like that... did these characters return also snap back all of their loved ones and possessions?
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  3. #3
    Helping the Helpless Denirac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    There are still some questions needing answers next issue. Max, Jesse, and XS could be homeless. Jenni can't return to the Legion of Super-Heroes as they've been rebooted - twice! Jesse's company Quickstart will probably be gone, and will Max's daughter Helen even still exist? In Flash Forward, Jai said that "Mom had better not have thrown out my Gamestation" or something like that... did these characters return also snap back all of their loved ones and possessions?
    We've got one issue and Speed Metal to wrap all this up, Williamson said #762 leads to Speed Metal
    Wally West deserved better than Heroes in Crisis
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    DC: JUSTICE LEAGUE, JUSTICE LEAGUE DARK, JUSTICE LEAGUE ODYSSEY, ACTION COMICS, LEVIATHAN, LAST KNIGHT ON EARTH
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    BOOM STUDIOS: BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER, ANGEL

  4. #4
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    This issue had a lot of very cheesy moments.

    And I love cheese!
    ConnEr Kent flies. ConnOr Hawke has a bow. Batman's kid is named DamiAn.

    To do spoiler tags, use [ spoil ] at the start of the sentence and [ /spoil ] at the end, without the spaces. You're welcome!

  5. #5
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    I've loved this incredibly solid run of Flash.

    Didn't expect the Eobard Thawne retcon of like every dumb thing that's happened in recent history but I love it. Good continuity clean-up there. It doesn't make HIC a good story in the slightest but at least fixes the character assassination. And tying it back to the Flash War fight just prior and the missing West Kids due to Rebirth and all that syncs up pretty well in a way that sort of salvages the wasted potential of Thawne playing in the sandbox from Flashpoint right through Doomsday Clock and the various things that fed into Clock. In that regard, it also doesn't make Flash Forward a good book but syncing Wally with Darkseid War and Doomsday Clock also fits that bill.

    Speed Metal is probably the aspect of Death Metal I'm most actually interested in. I think the event is big dumb fun but as far as resonance and relevance, I think it's definitely Speed Metal that has me wanting answers and patches.

    What else to say? Big Flash Family Reunion blowout. Really, really good retcons. Good art. Almost everyone you could want to see. How in the heck does XS fit in with Bendis's Legion? Don't care. FP52E-2 Jay Garrick is there, too. It's obviously not just different timelines but full multiverse here, and that means the Johns Grown-Up Three Worlds Legion is still out there being awesome.
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  6. #6
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    Thawne being used as a get out of jail free card to justify all of Barry's mistakes feels so cheap. Its good for memes, but not storytelling. I guess I can live with him influencing Wally for the HiC debacle, but everything else feels excessive.

  7. #7
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by king81992 View Post
    Thawne being used as a get out of jail free card to justify all of Barry's mistakes feels so cheap. Its good for memes, but not storytelling. I guess I can live with him influencing Wally for the HiC debacle, but everything else feels excessive.
    To be honest, it arguably dates back to Barry being blamed for Flashpoint when it was set off by Barry trying to fix something Thawne did.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    There are still some questions needing answers next issue. Max, Jesse, and XS could be homeless. Jenni can't return to the Legion of Super-Heroes as they've been rebooted - twice! Jesse's company Quickstart will probably be gone, and will Max's daughter Helen even still exist? In Flash Forward, Jai said that "Mom had better not have thrown out my Gamestation" or something like that... did these characters return also snap back all of their loved ones and possessions?
    Jesse had a kid too - she was heavily pregnant in the last pre-N52 issue of JLA. She's essentially in the same position as Rebirth-Wally - her spouse may not remember her and her kid probably doesn't exist.

  9. #9
    Astonishing Member HandofPrometheus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    There are still some questions needing answers next issue. Max, Jesse, and XS could be homeless. Jenni can't return to the Legion of Super-Heroes as they've been rebooted - twice! Jesse's company Quickstart will probably be gone, and will Max's daughter Helen even still exist? In Flash Forward, Jai said that "Mom had better not have thrown out my Gamestation" or something like that... did these characters return also snap back all of their loved ones and possessions?
    The LoS just can't be tied to just one timeline anymore. There just has to be multiple Earth versions for them because at this point they don't make sense anymore.

  10. #10
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    If Jesse was pregnant, then she was probably Speed Forced before it was born, causing it to be erased.

    As for XS, she would've been Speed Forced too, hence how she avoided TWO Legion reboots. She doesn't fit with Bendis's Legion at all and is likely now stuck in the 21st century. Doomsday Clock's ending confirmed that they get overwritten and it isn't an AU. The version of Saturn Girl involved in that story faded away, because of changes to the timeline that led to Bendis's Legion.
    Last edited by Digifiend; 09-08-2020 at 05:27 PM.
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  11. #11
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    While I'm glad they were able to use Thawne's time shenanigans to explain away ever bad creative decision from the past several years, I'm not sure I want to see anyone to use Reverse Flash again like this. This has got to be a one-time "Get Out of Jail Free" card that the Flash franchise gets to use to handwave away digging themselves into a creative hole.

    I don't begrudge them for doing it. The Spider-Man books pulled the same stunt with Norman Osborn after they repeatedly shot themselves in the foot creatively. It's a tried and true superhero cop-out.

    But it's still a cop-out.

    The next creative team has to figure out a way of writing Barry, Iris, Wally, Jay, Bart, Wallace and the rest of the Flash Family without needing to bring in Eobard Thawne to save them from bad writing. That would rob the stories of any dramatic weight. Whoever is going to be charting the course of the Flash books needs to hunker down and do the work of figuring out who Barry is that isn't simply Wally, but if he were a scientist, and they also need to decide on what role Wally is going to have moving forward now that the Heroes in Crisis had largely been explained away.

    That said, I could not be happier that The Flash finally has a clean slate, free of the nonsense that's built up after years of creative and editorial mismanagement, to begin a new direction that will hopefully bring all of its fans together, rather than pointlessly pit them against each other.

  12. #12
    Astonishing Member Jekyll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    While I'm glad they were able to use Thawne's time shenanigans to explain away ever bad creative decision from the past several years, I'm not sure I want to see anyone to use Reverse Flash again like this. This has got to be a one-time "Get Out of Jail Free" card that the Flash franchise gets to use to handwave away digging themselves into a creative hole.

    I don't begrudge them for doing it. The Spider-Man books pulled the same stunt with Norman Osborn after they repeatedly shot themselves in the foot creatively. It's a tried and true superhero cop-out.

    But it's still a cop-out.

    The next creative team has to figure out a way of writing Barry, Iris, Wally, Jay, Bart, Wallace and the rest of the Flash Family without needing to bring in Eobard Thawne to save them from bad writing. That would rob the stories of any dramatic weight. Whoever is going to be charting the course of the Flash books needs to hunker down and do the work of figuring out who Barry is that isn't simply Wally, but if he were a scientist, and they also need to decide on what role Wally is going to have moving forward now that the Heroes in Crisis had largely been explained away.

    That said, I could not be happier that The Flash finally has a clean slate, free of the nonsense that's built up after years of creative and editorial mismanagement, to begin a new direction that will hopefully bring all of its fans together, rather than pointlessly pit them against each other.
    Absolutely agree and couldn’t have said it better. Also, Norman heard you say his name and is now popping up in the current issue of ASM
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    If Jesse was pregnant, then she was probably Speed Forced before it was born, causing it to be erased.
    She had the baby in Convergence: Justice League (it was a boy. Called Johnny after his grandfather.)

  14. #14
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    to begin a new direction that will hopefully bring all of its fans together
    Oh, for that they're gonna need A WHOLE LOT MORE retconning.
    ConnEr Kent flies. ConnOr Hawke has a bow. Batman's kid is named DamiAn.

    To do spoiler tags, use [ spoil ] at the start of the sentence and [ /spoil ] at the end, without the spaces. You're welcome!

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member Robotman's Avatar
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    So basically in a meta way, Reverse-Flash is the greatest hero in the whole Flash Family. He saved them all from bad writing and editorial decisions.

    This has been a fun arc. Lots of big ridiculous actual and time shenanigans. What a good Flash story should be. Loved seeing all the different Flashes from across the multiverse.

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