Warner Bros/Joss Whedon/Ray Fisher Justice League

[Triniking1234]

All three of those characters have had stints on the Justice Leagues.

[Frontier]

I'm a long tome Cyborg fan but today, after seeing a group shot of cyborg with the rest in Zach's Justice League I think I see where people are coming from. They probably want to see clearly a Black Superhero standing tall beside Superman, Batman, WW etc.. Cyborg's cybernetics from head to toe obscurs his blackness and manhood. maybe long term comic fans just see Cyborg while others see someone that is less of a whole.

Cyborg's movie design was pretty bad.

[Will Evans]

I already said that on the previous page, but why can’t I have John Stewart, Vixen Black lightning on the justice league. Cyborg on this team was always random and has done anything positive for him

To get that Transformers/Iron Man aesthetic that was big and happening at the time.

Taken out of context, the original big 7 (including J’onn) and showing them in 2011. And they look less modern and not diverse compared to other superhero counterparts.

Cyborg kills two birds in one stone: diversity in white group and that technology aesthetic for modern day audiences. (That wasn’t there in the 1960s)




Putting Cyborg on Justice League was more for the Justice League’s benefit than anything for Cyborg himself.

[The Darknight Detective]

I already said that on the previous page, but why can’t I have John Stewart, Vixen Black lightning on the justice league. Cyborg on this team was always random and has done anything positive for him

A random pick would have been Black Racer or Ron Troupe (now that's really random!), not the most recognizable African-American superhero at DC.

[Johnny]

In terms of the whole "Quasimodo" thing, while I can't tell how exactly that particular discussion went about, the point of Quasimodo's character has never been that he's a "monster", it's that he's the exact opposite. He's a noble, caring and compassionate person. The actual "monsters" are those who judge him based on his appearance and treat him like he's less than human because of it. Perhaps they wanted to see more of those particular characteristics that Vic has obviously always had, not that they wanted Ray to play him like the freak who was disgusted by his own image.

[Coal Tiger]

A random pick would have been Black Racer or Ron Troupe (now that's really random!), not the most recognizable African-American superhero at DC.

They didn’t put John Stewart on the team.

[The Darknight Detective]

They didn’t put John Stewart on the team.

I know, that's why I said Cyborg instead. Now if this were 2002, then you would be correct.

[abetterday]

Warner bros should develop Cyborg into a humanised version in a solo project of some sort. They may be making a mistake with responding to Ray Fisher's posts now that we are in a George Floyd/BLM era. Kicking Cyborg/Fisher aside is being taken as a slight to some on Black Twitter and also the Snyder Cut Fans. Hamada is a person of color but he's an unknown. There's nothing about him on the internet. Most executives in Hollywood are unknown and anonymous for some reason. If Black Superman happen at all it's going to take atleast 5 years. Why not just do Justice League 2 featuring a more human Cyborg and then spin it off into a Cyborg film along with MOS2 with Henry Cavill. And then reboot with Coats' Superman. it's been about 3 years since the movie and it's clear that non-comic book readers want Cyborg to not be overwhelmed in appearance with his cybernetics. They want Cyborg to be a Black Chad Superhero first and not a robot or a cyborg.

[Johnny]

I know, that's why I said Cyborg instead. Now if this were 2002, then you would be correct.

I think the more likely reason is John was also unfortunate enough to be part of a franchise whose brand name was severely tarnished a few years prior to the DCEU. Many fans naturally like to claim that the one and only reason Cyborg was ever put in the Justice League was because of Hal, but Hal wasn't in that movie either and judging by Snyder's recent comments where he said he preferred John over Hal, I imagine if GL was indeed planned to appear in a potential sequel as it was originally speculated, it wouldn't have been Hal anyway. So the most logical scenario to me is that GL was simply deemed too toxic of a brand name by WB to be associated with the first ever JL movie.

[skyvolt2000]

Seems you haven't been reading my comments because I've been asking why when it's done to other characters, it's seen as tragic but it's racist for Cyborg/Victor and your only explanation is because of his skin colour.

I think the gripe is everyone else has been allowed to move on from those tragic incidents and never be defined or held hostage by it.

How Lanterns got killed when Hal went nuts? He is not held hostage by that storyline.

Reed Richards is not defined by what his little space trip did to Ben, Sue and Johnny. He embraced it and moved on. Ben has moved on from being what he is.

Beast Boy is not throwing fits about being green-he has embraced it.

Babs Gordon got shot and put in a wheelchair. She not left to be defined by Joker's antics. She became Oracle and the rest is history.

Jason Todd is no longer defined by Joker's crowbar and that 1-800 number. Red Hood put an end to that.

Hulk is not defined as that savage green monster.

Meanwhile Cyborg is still doing man versus machine stories. The folks like David Walker who wanted to movie from kept hitting brick walls.

Tragic characters can still be empowering and inspiring.

I think the question is where is that for Cyborg-in comics. Since the cartoon and Doom Patrol have done what you said. It looks bad the golden boy at DC couldn't do it but 2 guys who would NEVER get the Justice League book could/tried.

Get what right making their African American character second fiddle to choose white protagonist for 10 years and 20 films?

At least they got to BE in those movies. We did not have to wait till Justice League to see black heroes at Marvel.

Sure their breaking the mold now but let’s not pretend they didn’t have their own issues

Nobody said they didn't have issues. It just seems they have taken it more seriously than DC.

Where is that black lead DC movie at? That was successful (if we include Steel & Catwoman)? Marvel has Blade, Panther & Miles. Blade is looking at his 4th movie.

Still waiting on DC (and no Static does not count since he is NOT owned by DC).

War Machine, Falcon & Monica might have been second fiddle but Marvel tossed out trades starring them for the public.

[SecretWarrior]

Seems you haven't been reading my comments because I've been asking why when it's done to other characters, it's seen as tragic but it's racist for Cyborg/Victor and your only explanation is because of his skin colour.

No, I said it was fine when he's on a team of oddities (Titans, Doom Patrol) because he's one of the gang/on their level, but it's insulting to people to have him be the only oddity on a team of perfect people, since it reeks of being scared of Black people and trying to neuter them. For a lot of people, the Justice League (and the founders in particular) is their only view into the DCU. It's the paragon team. He's not a Black paragon and can never be, because of creators and fans who think like you, never allowing the character to be a wish-fulfillment insert. If there's already a Black paragon on the team, then fine, but there's not on either the New52 founding team or in live action--just this mutilated Black body, while everyone else gets to be attractive, even if they are from space or were burned by lightning and chemicals.

At this point, it's clear that you're being deliberately dense, and it's not funny or amsuing how you advocate for second-class representation of Black people. I know all I need to about you as a person.

[SecretWarrior]

Justice League 40 cover:



VS the second-class treatment of their Black characters:

Seems like they're promoting white male supremacy to me.

[Triniking1234]

No, I said it was fine when he's on a team of oddities (Titans, Doom Patrol) because he's one of the gang/on their level, but it's insulting to people to have him be the only oddity on a team of perfect people, since it reeks of being scared of Black people and trying to neuter them. For a lot of people, the Justice League (and the founders in particular) is their only view into the DCU. It's the paragon team. He's not a Black paragon and can never be, because of creators and fans who think like you, never allowing the character to be a wish-fulfillment insert. If there's already a Black paragon on the team, then fine, but there's not on either the New52 founding team or in live action--just this mutilated Black body, while everyone else gets to be attractive, even if they are from space or were burned by lightning and chemicals.

At this point, it's clear that you're being deliberately dense, and it's not funny or amsuing how you advocate for second-class representation of Black people. I know all I need to about you as a person.

As I mentioned before, there are other characters are in the same situation, heroes with grotesque bodies in groups good looking people but you keep saying it's only problematic in Cyborg's case as if it was done in bad faith and not just the nature of superhero comics. All this talk about he can't be a Black paragon because he doesn't like a "wish fulfillment character" seems like nonsense since he's a favourite to people here who grew up with him through Superfriends reruns and the Teen Titans cartoons.

But go ahead and discredit him if you want in order to push your nonsensical propaganda.

[The Darknight Detective]

Guys, let's keep it civil here. Not a request, either.

[Iconic]

Guys, let's keep it civil here. Not a request, either.

Do mods ever check a person that’s being “purposely problematic” with their takes and makes people not want to post here?