Warner Bros/Joss Whedon/Ray Fisher Justice League

[Lightning Rider]

I was talking about Superman having a black grandfather. The hair thing is silly, but it's not something to be fired over, IMO.

The grandfather thing makes sense. And I'm not saying Johns should be fired, and I don't even think Ray is either.

[Johnny]

So is the worst thing Geoff did something that happened with the krypton show? Why did fisher keep acting like it was something more?

I thought the part about Johns "threatening" him would've been the most damning thing, since Fisher has already talked about that before anyway, but even the article makes it sound like it's open to interpretation. Personally, I doubt that Johns was showing any legitimate concern about "not wanting Ray to make a bad name for himself in the business", but the fact that the comment doesn't instantly sound like an actual threat makes it seem far less damning than I expected it to be.

[Lightning Rider]

So is the worst thing Geoff did something that happened with the krypton show? Why did fisher keep acting like it was something more?

That's the most explicitly racial thing. Ray's principal complaints are that Johns

1. Told Ray to play the character like Quasimodo
2. Said in conversation with others that an "angry black man" can't be at the center of the movie
3. Told Ray that his agent contacting the studio head was improper and that he should be careful, which Ray perceived as a threat

[DragonPiece]

My own personal opinion. I do think it’s clear joss whedon does deserve a lot of blame and a lot worse should have happened to his career based on thins beyond just justice league. Also, Geoff johns clearly got a bit too comfortable with his exec powers, I don’t think any of that is him being racist though. It’s for the best he’s only working as a writer now. Still don’t think Hamada actually did anything wrong

[HsssH]

I mean, if a guy that you don't get along with says that you should be careful about your complaining then how else are you supposed to take it? It doesn't mean that Geoff wanted to threaten him, but from Ray's perspective it looks like a normal assumption.

[king of hybrids]

https://mobile.twitter.com/ray8fishe...74602448056326

It would appear Johns defence of “continuity” has triggered Fisher’s trap card

[HsssH]

I'm against race bending in general, but yeah, you can't claim "continuity" for one character, while changing others.

[kurenai24]

Whedon continues to look bad, more doesn't need to be said.

It always looked like Ray Fisher was saying John's was passive/enabled the situation with Whedon instead of actually being the middle man/mediator/overseer or whatever his title was, so it never looked that bad for him, what does look bad tho is his reps saying that he's Lebanese-American, or that he loved/wrote Cyborg, that he married a black woman, and now an asian one, and that he has a mixed-race son, so obviously he can't be anything he's being accused of, even though Ray never hinted at what they're implying, outside of the above, Ray was also saying that John's was overstepping and that's it, but the way twitter is reacting to his Johns reps statement lol.

Hamada, this is a tough one, Hamada didn't necessarily do anything (wrong), but he didn't do anything (right) which is also the problem, this is all happening and nothing was done, he obviously heard about the hostile workplace and yet he didn't attempt to reach out to the actors, apologize on behalf of the company, nada, just wanted to put it behind him. Hamada seems very passive or at the very least, he's in his position to care and focus only on the bottom line.

[HsssH]

Hamada probably thought that everyone will forget about it two weeks later.

[king of hybrids]

And all things considered, what did DC have to lose going with the things Johns rejected

You don’t put a show on SyFy with an expectation of a long life to begin with, it had stopped being an MOS prequel some time before and it was doomed from the moment the pilot started recording. It would have been better to be radical and fail then be a CW knockoff and fail

Berlanti’s adaptations (DC and otherwise) get stick, but no one can deny he’s at least willing to give the appearance of pushing the envelope, even of only superficially

[Frontier]

I didn't assume it was meant to be strict "continuity" in the sense of MoS, at least directly. Just more from an overall franchise visual standpoint.

"The Zods being black on Krypton, the Zods typically being bad guys and all this new info from the article really makes you wonder" - The Zods were kind of messed up on the show, but Zod himself was really the only villainous one of the family on the show.

And all things considered, what did DC have to lose going with the things Johns rejected

You don’t put a show on SyFy with an expectation of a long life to begin with, it had stopped being an MOS prequel some time before and it was doomed from the moment the pilot started recording. It would have been better to be radical and fail then be a CW knockoff and fail

Berlanti’s adaptations (DC and otherwise) get stick, but no one can deny he’s at least willing to give the appearance of pushing the envelope, even of only superficially

Well, it got two seasons, so I wouldn't say it was doomed since it did get renewed.

[The Darknight Detective]

The grandfather thing makes sense. And I'm not saying Johns should be fired, and I don't even think Ray is either.

Cool. Then we are in complete agreement.

[Hypo]

You need to link the article when talking about stuff like that: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/fe...for-leadership

So my main understanding is Fisher and Johns just had a difference of opinion on Cyborg's characterization and how he should be depicted.

Basically the NTT versus the TT cartoon portrayal.

Eh, I think each individual thing in isolation can be reasonably deemed a creative difference, taken all together though and it becomes a death by a thousand papercuts where Johns comes off looking ignorant. We even got an elevated form of the "I have a black friend" defense in there.

And both Hamada and Johns were concerned about Fisher's future career in Hollywood knowing how they treat even the most vindicated of whistleblowers.

Lol ok.

[Goldrake]

So what is this big sin of Johns?

Because he advised Ray to talk with Whedon when he is in a good mood? It happens to millions each day when someone tells them that the boss is not in a good mood? So is my boss secretary an enabler when she tells me not to talk to the boss when he is pissed?

That he wanted the catch phrase Booyah? with all respects to Ray he doesn't know a thing about these characters black or white!

That he was perceived that he was threatening him? I expected to read the words "You will never work again in Hollywood" instead it sounded more like an advise not to get a bad reputation.

Honestly it sounds more like personal assumptions with no basis at all. Different views on issues on which Johns is an authority while Ray probably never even knew who Cyborg was before he was casted for the role.

[The Darknight Detective]

I'm against race bending in general, but yeah, you can't claim "continuity" for one character, while changing others.

Except some characters are iconic and/or popular enough to create a media meltdown regarding a change, while others wouldn't register any type of uproar whatsoever.