They also got very lucky that the "amnesiac Bruce" plot hit when it did - with the early issues of "Grayson", there were still rumblings about how it was a mission that Bruce had sent him on, and that Dick wants to leave early on but Bruce talks him into sticking with.
Then Bruce was taken entirely off the table for the second half of the run, and Dicks running his own game.
It's twice now that Dick has vacated Nightwing and twice now he's been forced back into being Nightwing. It's high time the character moved on from his Post-Adolescene in between persona and figure out where he's going next. Both his stint as Batman and Grayson were better than his Nightwing tenures in the last 20 years. Should be a sign that Nightwing isn't the final resting place for this character.
Rules are for lesser men, Charlie - Grand Pa Joe ~ Willy Wonka & Chocolate Factory
I don’t think DC made Dick a second tier Batman. He was damn good, and was clearly shown to be superior in his relationships. But...
Traditional Batfans wound not accept a permanent change ....which, I believe, was Morrison’s original intention. The run was immensely helped by the character work with Dick and Damien. I would have gladly read a couple more years worth of Dick as Batman. That being said, Grayson was a wonderful opportunity for the character to truly shine...he could easily move in and out of the established DC universe, while still expanding his horizons. It was a very well executed book, also. I thought the sales were decent...I just assumed the mini reboot was the reason it was cancelled.
It could easily be revived, though, or have the concept integrated into Nightwing.
Dickbats wasn't second tier nightwing is. Because DC has turned nightwing into just another Robin and batgirl under batman. It's the role that nightwing plays. He's batman subordinate and substitute. It's not the nightwing name and costume that's the problem it's that the current role of nightwing is poor man's batman/ batman sidekick.
Last edited by WonderNight; 11-29-2020 at 11:04 PM.
I saw a list the other day of like, your Top Ten New 52 concepts. And while Scott Snyder's Batman somehow made # 1, and all the other Snyder Co. allied titles were totally in there, pretty characteristically (on record, I really liked Swamp Thing (both writers) and Animal Man but don't consider them New 52's "best" by any means) ... Grayson still made the what, Top 3 I think?
I think if was the # 1 best thing in the New 52. If King & Seeley had wrapped those last few issues themselves with Janin on art rather than it just being "take our notes and finish this up" it'd be a no-contest but even with the last couple issues shifting due to the transition it still holds up.
Retro315 no more. Anonymity is so 2005.
retrowarbird.blogspot.com
Grayson is still the most interesting title to come out of the New 52 era for me. I mean it's one of the few concepts that could continue to grow and be successful. It was different and fun for a loved character like Dick that has been around for so long. Justice League Dark is an excellent example of what the New 52 did best. It continues to evolve and entertain and it's becoming a staple of DC's fabric. IMO, Grayson could be that. Like Batman and Detective, or Superman and Action, Dick could have Nightwing and Grayson running at the same time.
It was a great book... but I don’t know if I would qualify it as a success of the New 52 ethos and playbook. It was more of a “lemonade from lemons” situation springing from Forever Evil wanting to use Dick as a jobber, and the BatBooks using that as an excuse to go back to exploring some of Morrison’s stuff that had started before the New 52.
I think if its success was stemming from the push for the New 52, the book would have continued. But since it was inherently a status quo shake up and progression for Dick, it was eventually retracted rather than finished.
Like action, adventure, rogues, and outlaws? Like anti-heroes, femme fatales, mysteries and thrillers?
I wrote a book with them. Outlaw’s Shadow: A Sherwood Noir. Robin Hood’s evil counterpart, Guy of Gisbourne, is the main character. Feel free to give it a look: https://read.amazon.com/kp/embed?asi...E2PKBNJFH76GQP
I really miss King/Seely's GRAYSON and Morrison's BATMAN AND ROBIN.
Whoever can find a way to amalgamate both those books has gold. Dick as 'Batman, also', with Damian as Robin, in international, thrill-seeking espionage and adventure. No need to replace Batman, they can just gear up in the aesthetics and have a different focus. Let's get real aesthetic though. Style and substance, but lots of style. A Batman book for the new century.
Last edited by Flash Gordon; 12-03-2020 at 09:20 PM.
All they'd have to do is take the best of both. Have dick as nightwing be a globetrotting action hero. Thrilling espionage adventures. Mission impossible weets indiana jones. Batman already has the city based vigilante, noir detective hero down. Nightwing needs to be something different than batman other than one is bruce and one isnt.
A HUGE problem for nightwing is the Dixon nostalgia so strong. Mainy because dc doesn't know what to do with nightwing or he should be other then batman clone or robin #1.