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  1. #16
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    I thought his children were kept from him and he had not idea he had any until later?

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    I thought his children were kept from him and he had not idea he had any until later?
    He raided Talia. He abandoned Nyssa to die in the Holocaust. No clue about Dusan

  3. #18
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    Whats so hypocritical about Ra's having children? Raising a child to be an assassin to kill dozens or hundreds of others is much more beneficial to his cause than having no child. Simple math. This forum seems to lose the ability of reasoning.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 09-18-2020 at 12:39 AM.

  4. #19
    Fantastic Member Light of Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsukiakari1203 View Post
    He raided Talia. He abandoned Nyssa to die in the Holocaust. No clue about Dusan
    Dusan was casted away by Ra's because he was albino, then he offered himself to become Ra's vessel after Ra's plan to use Damian's body as his new vessel was stopped by Batman and Talia. So now Dusan is...dead?
    He has a daughter named Mara who was Damian's childhood rival, and she chooses to stay on Ra's side. So Ra's has backup vessel now if Dusan's body get expired and Damian is too hard to get caught.

    Oh yeah, it also can answer OP's question about why Ra's get himself kids. As backup vessels.
    Last edited by Light of Justice; 09-18-2020 at 02:27 AM.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cgh View Post
    It would be cool if they made a storyline around this, where his philosophy was presented seriously rather than "here's a madman who wants to kill everyone because trees". I'm not saying he should be made into a sympathetic character, but the fact that he has kids (Talia, Nyssa, a son whose name I don't remember, maybe others) means he's either a gigantic hypocrite or his philosophy is more complex than what's been given. Maybe it's not just about preserving nature's natural beauty.

    Whatever happened to Nyssa anyway? I remember she died somehow. Maybe she's back because of the New 52?
    His philosophy is inherently incapable of being presented seriously.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member Korath's Avatar
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    Because having children isn't the real problem. It's more the society they live with which is. That's why you see him targeting the US, the most wasteful nation on Earth, and not Indonesia or Pakistan, where the population actually doesn't have the same impact on Earth. That and the fact that comics are from the US also.

  7. #22
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    His philosophy is inherently incapable of being presented seriously.
    Yeah. it's easier to make a case for even Ivy over Ra's.

    Denny O'Neil wanted him to be more sympathetic than Bruce, and I have to wonder "how." Batman Beyond's assessment that he was just a pathetic old loser who was just afraid of death seems more on point.

  8. #23
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    His philosophy is inherently incapable of being presented seriously.
    I think his convictions are meant to be taken seriously more than his actual goal.
    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Yeah. it's easier to make a case for even Ivy over Ra's.

    Denny O'Neil wanted him to be more sympathetic than Bruce, and I have to wonder "how." Batman Beyond's assessment that he was just a pathetic old loser who was just afraid of death seems more on point.
    Well, he was by that point but I don't think that's quite accurate for a present-day Ra's.

  9. #24
    Fantastic Member OopsIdiditagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prepmaster View Post
    Whats so hypocritical about Ra's having children? Raising a child to be an assassin to kill dozens or hundreds of others is much more beneficial to his cause than having no child. Simple math. This forum seems to lose the ability of reasoning.

    Why would he need to raise kids when he already hires others to be his assassin? It's not like there's a 100% guarantee that the kids would follow everything he says.

    Where's the lack of reasoning? The whole point of anti-natalist + environmentalist philosophy is that having children is harmful to the environment and humanity but they should still try to improve the world with current resources.

    The rational thing for Ra to do would be using existing resources( hiring existing assassins) rather than putting more strain on the world's resources by having kids. If Ra wanted someone young to groom towards becoming his successor, a anti-natalist would argue he should adopt a child.
    OP characters make me itch

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by OopsIdiditagain View Post
    Why would he need to raise kids when he already hires others to be his assassin? It's not like there's a 100% guarantee that the kids would follow everything he says.

    Where's the lack of reasoning? The whole point of anti-natalist + environmentalist philosophy is that having children is harmful to the environment and humanity but they should still try to improve the world with current resources.

    The rational thing for Ra to do would be using existing resources( hiring existing assassins) rather than putting more strain on the world's resources by having kids. If Ra wanted someone young to groom towards becoming his successor, a anti-natalist would argue he should adopt a child.
    It's all about that Demon's Head bloodline .

  11. #26
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I think his convictions are meant to be taken seriously more than his actual goal.

    Well, he was by that point but I don't think that's quite accurate for a present-day Ra's.
    Hes already lived a long time by present day. Hes already an old man sustained by the Lazarus pits

    I dont see the time it takes for Bruce to go from 30s to 80s being that significant. Hes already at that point. Hes built up a cult of people whose names he doesnt know because had a power hungry maniac selfishly motivated by a fear of death

  12. #27
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Hes already lived a long time by present day. Hes already an old man sustained by the Lazarus pits

    I dont see the time it takes for Bruce to go from 30s to 80s being that significant. Hes already at that point. Hes built up a cult of people whose names he doesnt know because had a power hungry maniac selfishly motivated by a fear of death
    It's definitely true that the longer he lived and the longer he used the pit, the less mentaly stable and sound he became, but I don't think Ra's was afraid of death (at least originally) so much as he was obsessed with his mission so much that he couldn't let himself die until it had been fulfilled or he could count on someone to succeed him who could carry out the mission in his stead.

  13. #28
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    It's definitely true that the longer he lived and the longer he used the pit, the less mentaly stable and sound he became, but I don't think Ra's was afraid of death (at least originally) so much as he was obsessed with his mission so much that he couldn't let himself die until it had been fulfilled or he could count on someone to succeed him who could carry out the mission in his stead.
    I think that's the kind of stuff he tells himself and others and maybe buys into on some level, but I think it not being the actual reason is a valid interpretation.

    He's just like the rest of Batman's villains in that he's self deluded and had a very high opinion of himself.

  14. #29
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    The problem with portraying Ra's as an environmentalist villain is that he is not a pure environmentalist. His schemes are more of a population control elitist while environmentalism is a huge part of his philosophy but not the be all end all for him. He is sort of an elite that comes into conflict with other corporate elites. Each elite controls a certain population. To Ra's, a population is just pawns of other elites. He wants to destroy the order created by all other elites so that his order would be the one that the world has to accept.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 09-19-2020 at 10:25 PM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Yeah. it's easier to make a case for even Ivy over Ra's.

    Denny O'Neil wanted him to be more sympathetic than Bruce, and I have to wonder "how." Batman Beyond's assessment that he was just a pathetic old loser who was just afraid of death seems more on point.
    He did? Where did O'Neil say this?

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