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  1. #421
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gripstir View Post
    Even I was impressed. I had no idea what I could even add. It was well thought out I could tell
    Thank you so much!

    I wanted to capture the essence of each character but not necessarily repeat the history or story exactly as in the comics, thereby allowing for variation and growth in new directions and with some growth perhaps happening earlier than in the comics.

    I think we have presented great ideas and are doing well with this story.
    Last edited by Phoenixx9; 10-22-2020 at 10:05 AM.

  2. #422
    Fantastic Member GMikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    Thank you so much!

    I wanted to capture the essence of each character but not necessarily repeat the history or story exactly as in the comics, thereby allowing for variation and growth in new directions and with some growth perhaps happening earlier than in the comics.

    I think we have presented great ideas and are doing well with this story.
    I'll catch up in a bit, but I'd like to ask this question... I feel I already know the answer, and I believe that, you've already shared much opinion on this particular topic. But... as I (and some others) haven't had the most luck with conversing with certain X-Fans, let me ask this question pointblank...

    What do you LIKE/LOVE about Jean Grey?

    What do you NOT like or love about how she's handled in canon?

    If you could change something with her character/plot, what would it be?

    What are ideas (on the quick) you feel would improve her and her with PF?

    And what's the MAJOR thing as a fan, you'd like to see done for her character?

    I don't think I've asked you this question, and its been difficult to get a GOOD response for this particular character. I think you have good thoughts and insights, and whatever you do offer, even if the full suggestions don't make it to Jean's narrative, but they WILL give good clarity of HOW to direct her character for the better, and give ppl a strong character that, even naysayers would actually wind up enjoying, and see as an eye opener

  3. #423
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMikey View Post
    I'll catch up in a bit, but I'd like to ask this question... I feel I already know the answer, and I believe that, you've already shared much opinion on this particular topic. But... as I (and some others) haven't had the most luck with conversing with certain X-Fans, let me ask this question pointblank...

    What do you LIKE/LOVE about Jean Grey?

    What do you NOT like or love about how she's handled in canon?

    If you could change something with her character/plot, what would it be?

    What are ideas (on the quick) you feel would improve her and her with PF?

    And what's the MAJOR thing as a fan, you'd like to see done for her character?

    I don't think I've asked you this question, and its been difficult to get a GOOD response for this particular character. I think you have good thoughts and insights, and whatever you do offer, even if the full suggestions don't make it to Jean's narrative, but they WILL give good clarity of HOW to direct her character for the better, and give ppl a strong character that, even naysayers would actually wind up enjoying, and see as an eye opener
    <<I know I will add to this tomorrow, but to respond and give you some immediate answers, I will start at the beginning.>>

    -I love her sense of right and wrong and wanting to help to do the right thing, to do good.
    -Even from day #1 when all we thought Jean could do was levitate a book or a chair, she got out there and ran and fought the evil with the best of them! She was courageous and fiesty! She put herself out there in the line of fire to help others
    -Jean is highly-disciplined (all X-Men are disciplined, following the professor and even tolerating demerits, calling him sir, etc) but Jean even more so because she respected---and followed--the Prof X orders to their fullest degree (not even telling anyone---Scott included--that the Prof had not died in original series)
    -Jean thought of others; even if tied up or held hostage, she often wondered how the others were faring
    -Jean was not afraid to push herself and to learn new techniques of her powers
    -Jean was thoughtful; when allowed by Prof X to have a new costume, she asked the same for the others and then went on to design not only hers, but theirs as well, as a sort of graduation present for them.

    <<I am skipping a lot here--to be added tomorrow. >>

    I love Jean as a character and how she relates to others and how others love her.

    I want the PF to ALWAYS be a part of Jean, as such a perfect union should never be broken. However, this would "only" be the Green Phoenix Version (much lower than WPC). And---this is important---the PF does not always come out for everything Jean does---that is to say---Jean does not use the PF for everything she does in life. If her car won't start, Jean TKs it to the repair center, flying beside it. But no PF is used, whether or not she is in Phoenix mode (costume, hair all long and blowing around, white eyes, lol). This would be Jean's power doing the work. Jean would only use the PF in dire circumstances and when that level of power is needed. Just like Gladiator does not always break planets apart with his powers, and holds back 95% of times, Jean would be able to do the same thing.

    <More tomorrow>

  4. #424
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMikey View Post
    I'll catch up in a bit, but I'd like to ask this question... I feel I already know the answer, and I believe that, you've already shared much opinion on this particular topic. But... as I (and some others) haven't had the most luck with conversing with certain X-Fans, let me ask this question pointblank...

    What do you LIKE/LOVE about Jean Grey?

    What do you NOT like or love about how she's handled in canon?

    If you could change something with her character/plot, what would it be?

    What are ideas (on the quick) you feel would improve her and her with PF?

    And what's the MAJOR thing as a fan, you'd like to see done for her character?

    I don't think I've asked you this question, and its been difficult to get a GOOD response for this particular character. I think you have good thoughts and insights, and whatever you do offer, even if the full suggestions don't make it to Jean's narrative, but they WILL give good clarity of HOW to direct her character for the better, and give ppl a strong character that, even naysayers would actually wind up enjoying, and see as an eye opener
    I like her earnestness. She genuinely respects people around her but she never tried to outshine anyone. She’s kinda like the empathetic girl at school who if you were shy would at least try to make you smile. She’s like the outgoing type but still is determined to make the most of herself.

    I think I like when she evokes a sense of trust.

    Her and storm seem like the total package of beauty empathy power and fear.

    I like her in fish out of water stories. Like there was a story I read, it wasn’t well written imo but it was Storm Jean and Gambit go to Cairo for some reason. I think for visiting. Storm and Gambit were the theives who knew their way around while Jean seemed like the tourist. But when the fighting started she was the one barking orders telling Gambit If he couldn’t handle fighting without killing then let Storm and her fight.

    I’d also like to see some levity with Jean. There’s a video online about the TAS about how useless Jean was with her powers. I found it funny but I think seeing Jean being funny would be great.

    I think seeing her scientific mind and even her political side would be good to expand on she’s smart and also has emotional intelligence she knows how to say the right thing to comfort or motivate but she always knows how much stronger her powers can be and will use them if needed
    Last edited by Gripstir; 10-22-2020 at 06:05 PM.

  5. #425
    Fantastic Member GMikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    <<I know I will add to this tomorrow, but to respond and give you some immediate answers, I will start at the beginning.>>

    -I love her sense of right and wrong and wanting to help to do the right thing, to do good.
    -Even from day #1 when all we thought Jean could do was levitate a book or a chair, she got out there and ran and fought the evil with the best of them! She was courageous and fiesty! She put herself out there in the line of fire to help others
    -Jean is highly-disciplined (all X-Men are disciplined, following the professor and even tolerating demerits, calling him sir, etc) but Jean even more so because she respected---and followed--the Prof X orders to their fullest degree (not even telling anyone---Scott included--that the Prof had not died in original series)
    -Jean thought of others; even if tied up or held hostage, she often wondered how the others were faring
    -Jean was not afraid to push herself and to learn new techniques of her powers
    -Jean was thoughtful; when allowed by Prof X to have a new costume, she asked the same for the others and then went on to design not only hers, but theirs as well, as a sort of graduation present for them.

    <<I am skipping a lot here--to be added tomorrow. >>

    I love Jean as a character and how she relates to others and how others love her.

    I want the PF to ALWAYS be a part of Jean, as such a perfect union should never be broken. However, this would "only" be the Green Phoenix Version (much lower than WPC). And---this is important---the PF does not always come out for everything Jean does---that is to say---Jean does not use the PF for everything she does in life. If her car won't start, Jean TKs it to the repair center, flying beside it. But no PF is used, whether or not she is in Phoenix mode (costume, hair all long and blowing around, white eyes, lol). This would be Jean's power doing the work. Jean would only use the PF in dire circumstances and when that level of power is needed. Just like Gladiator does not always break planets apart with his powers, and holds back 95% of times, Jean would be able to do the same thing.

    <More tomorrow>
    Quote Originally Posted by Gripstir View Post
    I like her earnestness. She genuinely respects people around her but she never tried to outshine anyone. She’s kinda like the empathetic girl at school who if you were shy would at least try to make you smile. She’s like the outgoing type but still is determined to make the most of herself.

    I think I like when she evokes a sense of trust.

    Her and storm seem like the total package of beauty empathy power and fear.

    I like her in fish out of water stories. Like there was a story I read, it wasn’t well written imo but it was Storm Jean and Gambit go to Cairo for some reason. I think for visiting. Storm and Gambit were the theives who knew their way around while Jean seemed like the tourist. But when the fighting started she was the one barking orders telling Gambit If he couldn’t handle fighting without killing then let Storm and her fight.

    I’d also like to see some levity with Jean. There’s a video online about the TAS about how useless Jean was with her powers. I found it funny but I think seeing Jean being funny would be great.

    I think seeing her scientific mind and even her political side would be good to expand on she’s smart and also has emotional intelligence she knows how to say the right thing to comfort or motivate but she always knows how much stronger her powers can be and will use them if needed
    Ya'll are awesome, and though I skimmed through this (cuz I'm deep in the wee hours) I can tell this is great, and gives just that one more little edge and insight to our team. the chief writer, says she rly wants to do a good job with reshaping Jean Grey, and taking her out of Marvel's reel of monotony in terms of narrative.

    So, proper replies tomorrow as well ^_^

  6. #426
    Fantastic Member GMikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    <<I know I will add to this tomorrow, but to respond and give you some immediate answers, I will start at the beginning.>>

    -I love her sense of right and wrong and wanting to help to do the right thing, to do good.
    -Even from day #1 when all we thought Jean could do was levitate a book or a chair, she got out there and ran and fought the evil with the best of them! She was courageous and fiesty! She put herself out there in the line of fire to help others
    -Jean is highly-disciplined (all X-Men are disciplined, following the professor and even tolerating demerits, calling him sir, etc) but Jean even more so because she respected---and followed--the Prof X orders to their fullest degree (not even telling anyone---Scott included--that the Prof had not died in original series)
    -Jean thought of others; even if tied up or held hostage, she often wondered how the others were faring
    -Jean was not afraid to push herself and to learn new techniques of her powers
    -Jean was thoughtful; when allowed by Prof X to have a new costume, she asked the same for the others and then went on to design not only hers, but theirs as well, as a sort of graduation present for them.

    <<I am skipping a lot here--to be added tomorrow. >>

    I love Jean as a character and how she relates to others and how others love her.

    I want the PF to ALWAYS be a part of Jean, as such a perfect union should never be broken. However, this would "only" be the Green Phoenix Version (much lower than WPC). And---this is important---the PF does not always come out for everything Jean does---that is to say---Jean does not use the PF for everything she does in life. If her car won't start, Jean TKs it to the repair center, flying beside it. But no PF is used, whether or not she is in Phoenix mode (costume, hair all long and blowing around, white eyes, lol). This would be Jean's power doing the work. Jean would only use the PF in dire circumstances and when that level of power is needed. Just like Gladiator does not always break planets apart with his powers, and holds back 95% of times, Jean would be able to do the same thing.

    <More tomorrow>
    There's more to reply too, and I'll first start with these, then comeback to the previous comments, since this one is more... like a quick question that rly should be answered...

    Many points you made are in line I feel with what everyone is trying to accomplish. One of the things the chief writer stated, is to build Jean's character on its own merit, without the Phoenix Force, so that... her gaining the Phoenix is "earned" and its not the only thing driving her character. There's thought put into where they (our writers) feel canon writers "went wrong" as Jean's character developed over the years, after becoming Phoenix. One of the things that I'm most concerned about (despite not being a fan of [canon] Jean Grey) I DO, truly DO want to make sure her character is brought to its fullest in this mini-series. I'm very appreciative of you two (Phoenixx9 and Gripstir) for being the most helpful X-Fans on this particular subject. I want to talk to ppl that are open minded, and can help a greater vision.

    Onto the points made:

    1. Something important from chief is to define Jean's strengths and weaknesses, and how both are entertwined. There is tremendous focus on Jean wanting to use and develop her powers to help others, and right whatever wrongs she encounters. Xavier is a huge inspiration to her, and she states how she hopes to be like him someday (and eventually she opens the "Jean Grey School of Higher Learning" much later in the series). So this is something we definitely get.

    2. Chief said she definitely wants Jean to be a strong character from her first introduction. Confronting "evil" is never a problem for her (for now). She's meant to contrast some of the other kids, (like Remy) and her foundation (mid class family, mother and father, good stable home) gave her the strength she needs to be who she is, but also inspire others.

    3. Jean (to a fault at times) I think is very straight about rules and do's and don'ts. It's one reason she's not fond of Thunderbird and Gambit, they will do things on their own accord at times. But, her disipline definitely is part of why this team respects her a lot too.

    4. Jean is highly thoughtful of everyone, and always wanna make sure everyone was doing well, even when there was no trouble. Sometimes, this was too a fault too.

    5. Jean pushing herself with her powers/techniques is definitely something we will get a lot of in this.

    Chief stated that Jean wouldn't always be Phoenix in this series. She feels that making Jean the Phoenix so much through out canon, as diminished its mystique and awe over the years. She rly only wanna save the Phoenix for special occasions, and crucial moments for the narrative. The Phoenix is also to be intrinsic to "The Cosmic Rival's" plot, and the pair would serve as a polarizing duality. This "cosmic level rivalry" would even bleed over into Jean's descendents (like Rachel Summers), and the X-Man's descendants (um... not allowed to say who lol). So... PF will have a very interesting role throughout Jean's narrative, akin to "The Cosmic Rival" and its X-Man's narrative. And just like... she's written CR's connection to its X-Man "host" to be of incredible depth, Jean Grey would always have this with PF

    Gripstir, you're up next!

  7. #427
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMikey View Post
    There's more to reply too, and I'll first start with these, then comeback to the previous comments, since this one is more... like a quick question that rly should be answered...

    Many points you made are in line I feel with what everyone is trying to accomplish. One of the things the chief writer stated, is to build Jean's character on its own merit, without the Phoenix Force, so that... her gaining the Phoenix is "earned" and its not the only thing driving her character. There's thought put into where they (our writers) feel canon writers "went wrong" as Jean's character developed over the years, after becoming Phoenix. One of the things that I'm most concerned about (despite not being a fan of [canon] Jean Grey) I DO, truly DO want to make sure her character is brought to its fullest in this mini-series. I'm very appreciative of you two (Phoenixx9 and Gripstir) for being the most helpful X-Fans on this particular subject. I want to talk to ppl that are open minded, and can help a greater vision.

    Onto the points made:

    1. Something important from chief is to define Jean's strengths and weaknesses, and how both are entertwined. There is tremendous focus on Jean wanting to use and develop her powers to help others, and right whatever wrongs she encounters. Xavier is a huge inspiration to her, and she states how she hopes to be like him someday (and eventually she opens the "Jean Grey School of Higher Learning" much later in the series). So this is something we definitely get.

    2. Chief said she definitely wants Jean to be a strong character from her first introduction. Confronting "evil" is never a problem for her (for now). She's meant to contrast some of the other kids, (like Remy) and her foundation (mid class family, mother and father, good stable home) gave her the strength she needs to be who she is, but also inspire others.

    3. Jean (to a fault at times) I think is very straight about rules and do's and don'ts. It's one reason she's not fond of Thunderbird and Gambit, they will do things on their own accord at times. But, her disipline definitely is part of why this team respects her a lot too.

    4. Jean is highly thoughtful of everyone, and always wanna make sure everyone was doing well, even when there was no trouble. Sometimes, this was too a fault too.

    5. Jean pushing herself with her powers/techniques is definitely something we will get a lot of in this.

    Chief stated that Jean wouldn't always be Phoenix in this series. She feels that making Jean the Phoenix so much through out canon, as diminished its mystique and awe over the years. She rly only wanna save the Phoenix for special occasions, and crucial moments for the narrative. The Phoenix is also to be intrinsic to "The Cosmic Rival's" plot, and the pair would serve as a polarizing duality. This "cosmic level rivalry" would even bleed over into Jean's descendents (like Rachel Summers), and the X-Man's descendants (um... not allowed to say who lol). So... PF will have a very interesting role throughout Jean's narrative, akin to "The Cosmic Rival" and its X-Man's narrative. And just like... she's written CR's connection to its X-Man "host" to be of incredible depth, Jean Grey would always have this with PF

    Gripstir, you're up next!
    I kinda felt like the reason Jean was with the Phoenix was simply because the story was she was unremarkable. She was powerful but never realized that power. The Phoenix is sort of being a metaphor for her inner power. I never really felt like Jean was like the main character. I always felt like she was a character who was more like glue.

    I think one thing I see Jean as that I don't think everyone else agrees with is that I don't think she is totally benevolent and caring of others. In fact I find her the most boring when she makes all her decisions based on being totally benevolent. I think she is empathetic but moreso I think she is trying to embody a hero and use her powers. Her powers give her an identity as she is otherwise unremarkable and she thinks Xavier and the Xmen give her an identity. She is a mutant. And she has defined herself as such and she wants to be the best mutant she can be...however who she is is often more reflective of others. Like she respects Xavier so a lot of her "benevolence" is her trying to copy her hero Xavier. I think she has latched onto the idea that she as a mutant and a advocate for mutants must act a certain way based on what those around her tell her is the right course of action. I think she loves Scott because it's the traditional marriage love. But Wolverine (and idk if it was decided on gambit at all) represents that rawness that comes from avoiding societal pressure. Jean in a lot of ways is a product of her suburban environment and believes in doing the "societally nice" thing.

    But the cool thing is when she breaks out of the conditioning at times and really considers what does she want for her own life and the world. I think in a lot of ways the reason she has been tied to the Phoenix is that the Phoenix represents Jean unleashed without the shackles of society. Be a badass be a selfish person be the strongest mutant. And that's why Phoenix has stuck With her because it's kinda a metaphor for her.

  8. #428
    Fantastic Member GMikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gripstir View Post
    I kinda felt like the reason Jean was with the Phoenix was simply because the story was she was unremarkable. She was powerful but never realized that power. The Phoenix is sort of being a metaphor for her inner power. I never really felt like Jean was like the main character. I always felt like she was a character who was more like glue.

    I think one thing I see Jean as that I don't think everyone else agrees with is that I don't think she is totally benevolent and caring of others. In fact I find her the most boring when she makes all her decisions based on being totally benevolent. I think she is empathetic but moreso I think she is trying to embody a hero and use her powers. Her powers give her an identity as she is otherwise unremarkable and she thinks Xavier and the Xmen give her an identity. She is a mutant. And she has defined herself as such and she wants to be the best mutant she can be...however who she is is often more reflective of others. Like she respects Xavier so a lot of her "benevolence" is her trying to copy her hero Xavier. I think she has latched onto the idea that she as a mutant and a advocate for mutants must act a certain way based on what those around her tell her is the right course of action. I think she loves Scott because it's the traditional marriage love. But Wolverine (and idk if it was decided on gambit at all) represents that rawness that comes from avoiding societal pressure. Jean in a lot of ways is a product of her suburban environment and believes in doing the "societally nice" thing.

    But the cool thing is when she breaks out of the conditioning at times and really considers what does she want for her own life and the world. I think in a lot of ways the reason she has been tied to the Phoenix is that the Phoenix represents Jean unleashed without the shackles of society. Be a badass be a selfish person be the strongest mutant. And that's why Phoenix has stuck With her because it's kinda a metaphor for her.
    I'm not gonna lie, there are others to make the same point as you.

    The chief writer in particular has stated that this is why she RLY wants to reshape Jean Grey, and give her a "proper" development. With the benevolence factor, Jean is shown to have a side that is kind, caring, always thoughtful. Her first psionic bond was with Scott, while he was held captive. She felt his pain, and tried to comfort the child she yet met. But that's one side of her; the other involves relishing in the praise of being an Omega level telepath. As X speaks highly of her, telling her that she has near unlimited potential, and with training, she could do whatever, it goes to her head, which comes out from time to time. She takes issues with those she cannot psionically penetrate, with Remy being her greatest obstacle.

    Jean also doesn't always use her powers for the right things; she'll manipulate things psionically to get her way, and we do see repercussions for these actions. Also important, Jean sometimes is a know-it-all, due to her psionic abilities, and isn't always right. One more important factor in terms of her flaws, she's not as compassionate as she believes she is. She doesn't realize how judgmental she can be, and not see the full picture. She came from a good home with both parents, and her upbringing sheltered her from how others' environments affect their behavior (Spyke's and Hope's story is an example). This is another reason she take issues with Remy; she doesn't see the full picture of his character, and her dislike for him, sadly bleeds over others.

    U made an excellent point about Jean's character being too influenced by other characters. With this new development, our writers I feel are giving Jean a good foundation for being a character of her own. Her strengths are handled a little different, so we can see her as someone of her own, her flaws help define her personal desires, sense of self-righteousness, and grants her moments of self reflection that, makes her more relatable, and shows growth.

    Chief says to her, the biggest problem with Jean Grey IS the Phoenix, and that the Phoenix is the only thing that defines Jean Grey as anything special. So for this series, she prefers to establish Jean as her own hero, we'd see her powers developing and her pushing her own boundaries, and advancing as she does. The idea, is to allow Jean to be a strong hero, BEFORE the Phoenix. The Phoenix metaphor of Jean Grey becoming her own person and realizing her power... I don't think is at all the direction the writers are going with Phoenix Force. I think the Phoenix Force is an entity that would have a narrative of its own, but Jean Grey becomes pivital to that plot, as the Phoenix becomes pivital to a plot she's involved herself in. They bounce off each other in away that allows them to grow into becoming one.

    The part u say "Be a badass, be selfish, be the strongest mutant/hero" there's some of this that actually kinda plays into Jean's reimagined story. Chief says she rly kinda wanna remove the drama between Jean and Phoenix, have Jean more embrace the Phoenix as something a part of her, rather than a lot of what comics have done, with them struggling with each other. Let's see her be a full badass, she says. The only major plight and struggle, is between Jean Grey/Phoenix vs. "X-Man/The Cosmic Rival". This plight reveals things on both sides that represents development, growth and revelation.

    PF and Jean also serve as vehicles into the more expanded plot of "The Phoenix Trilogy", to which everyone wants something that is simply different, an epic cosmic saga, and while "fixing" Jean's plot of being Phoenix, also introduce something new, and explore that in incremental depth.

    The short points you made here are very much in line with what writers want to accomplish, and I love how you brought up the factor of her "benevolence" being more a product of poor writing, than actually a part of her character. I think that's a point for writers, so they CAN give her more shaping with her pros and cons, so she'd be defined as her own, rather than... those around her

  9. #429
    Fantastic Member GMikey's Avatar
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    I'm currently in chat about these darn power grids. Hopefully we can soon get back to the story development!

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    Quote Originally Posted by GMikey View Post
    I'm not gonna lie, there are others to make the same point as you.

    The chief writer in particular has stated that this is why she RLY wants to reshape Jean Grey, and give her a "proper" development. With the benevolence factor, Jean is shown to have a side that is kind, caring, always thoughtful. Her first psionic bond was with Scott, while he was held captive. She felt his pain, and tried to comfort the child she yet met. But that's one side of her; the other involves relishing in the praise of being an Omega level telepath. As X speaks highly of her, telling her that she has near unlimited potential, and with training, she could do whatever, it goes to her head, which comes out from time to time. She takes issues with those she cannot psionically penetrate, with Remy being her greatest obstacle.

    Jean also doesn't always use her powers for the right things; she'll manipulate things psionically to get her way, and we do see repercussions for these actions. Also important, Jean sometimes is a know-it-all, due to her psionic abilities, and isn't always right. One more important factor in terms of her flaws, she's not as compassionate as she believes she is. She doesn't realize how judgmental she can be, and not see the full picture. She came from a good home with both parents, and her upbringing sheltered her from how others' environments affect their behavior (Spyke's and Hope's story is an example). This is another reason she take issues with Remy; she doesn't see the full picture of his character, and her dislike for him, sadly bleeds over others.

    U made an excellent point about Jean's character being too influenced by other characters. With this new development, our writers I feel are giving Jean a good foundation for being a character of her own. Her strengths are handled a little different, so we can see her as someone of her own, her flaws help define her personal desires, sense of self-righteousness, and grants her moments of self reflection that, makes her more relatable, and shows growth.

    Chief says to her, the biggest problem with Jean Grey IS the Phoenix, and that the Phoenix is the only thing that defines Jean Grey as anything special. So for this series, she prefers to establish Jean as her own hero, we'd see her powers developing and her pushing her own boundaries, and advancing as she does. The idea, is to allow Jean to be a strong hero, BEFORE the Phoenix. The Phoenix metaphor of Jean Grey becoming her own person and realizing her power... I don't think is at all the direction the writers are going with Phoenix Force. I think the Phoenix Force is an entity that would have a narrative of its own, but Jean Grey becomes pivital to that plot, as the Phoenix becomes pivital to a plot she's involved herself in. They bounce off each other in away that allows them to grow into becoming one.

    The part u say "Be a badass, be selfish, be the strongest mutant/hero" there's some of this that actually kinda plays into Jean's reimagined story. Chief says she rly kinda wanna remove the drama between Jean and Phoenix, have Jean more embrace the Phoenix as something a part of her, rather than a lot of what comics have done, with them struggling with each other. Let's see her be a full badass, she says. The only major plight and struggle, is between Jean Grey/Phoenix vs. "X-Man/The Cosmic Rival". This plight reveals things on both sides that represents development, growth and revelation.

    PF and Jean also serve as vehicles into the more expanded plot of "The Phoenix Trilogy", to which everyone wants something that is simply different, an epic cosmic saga, and while "fixing" Jean's plot of being Phoenix, also introduce something new, and explore that in incremental depth.

    The short points you made here are very much in line with what writers want to accomplish, and I love how you brought up the factor of her "benevolence" being more a product of poor writing, than actually a part of her character. I think that's a point for writers, so they CAN give her more shaping with her pros and cons, so she'd be defined as her own, rather than... those around her
    Well I remember taking a class talking about economic classes and the morality within those classes. The class you describe sounds like lower or upper middle class. And one thing I remember learning that really stuck with me is within those classes people love to be complimented. They will often do good deeds when people will see them doing it. The example they gave in class was people will adopt endangered animals like tigers and stuff and the organization will send you a photo or a letter or something. These are meant as things you can hang in your house and show to people how you adopted something and brag about it. I say repeatedly the reason you are seeing everyone trying to promote charity or promote these good causes now is because social media lets you support those causes while others can see you doing it. (Also fun fact upper class people hate it when you compliment their possessions for some reason. I think it had to do with they know how good it is they don't need you to tell them it's good)

    So someone like Jean who grew up in like a middle class family would have that trait. It's not to say she isn't good but she isn't just about saving every mutant or being empathetic to everyone. It's part of the identity she has of wanting to be seen as a good person. I think the true entertainment value of heroes is they fight for people like themselves to be visible. People who fight indiscriminately come off as kinda dull i.e. superman

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    Quote Originally Posted by GMikey View Post
    I'm currently in chat about these darn power grids. Hopefully we can soon get back to the story development!
    Yeah I had a long day today. How hope it all went well

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gripstir View Post
    Yeah I had a long day today. How hope it all went well
    Ask Phoenixx9... I haven't had time to share the extent of the power grids thing, but I'll say in short, the chief writer said she's cancelling EVERYONE'S ideas out, and gonna start fresh.

    GOOD news though, she liked you and Phoenix's design best, and will take ur designs and create a base for everyone to simply start over fresh with.

    yessh um, I will post about that today. I also had a long day yestday, rly all week -_-

    I'll be popping up here rly soon with more stuff!

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