Rating and thoughts on "The Ultimates" (2002) by Mark Millar

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I liked it back in the day. I thought it had one of the most interesting takes on Cap's Man Out Of Time aspect that no other take not even the movies replicated. Same with Thor as a God no one believed in. I remember a gag where Freddie Prinze Jr wanted to play Bruce Banner in a biopic. The Liberators were an interesting idea and having this Iranian teenager become Cap's darker foil was a great touch.

I'm not a huge Steve Rogers fan because i tend to find him and Clark Kent as comfort food characters. But this was a take on Cap i wished i got to read more off.

I wouldn't mind another shot at an Ultimate Universe relaunch but you're gonna need a better USP. I don't think "a modern take free of continuity" is gonna hold most people's interest.

[Huntsman Spider]

I totally agree, I feel like now with the popularity of the "aw shucks MCU" we are going to get a lot of navel gazing stories similar to "The Boys" and it is going to be insufferable.

I enjoy altruistic heroism I don't need to see flawed heroes - we already have those in real life.

Some would argue that there's (almost) no such thing as heroes in real life, just "who's on our side, and who's not," and that, again, is constantly subject to change and debate based on who's in charge and what the circumstances, norms, and/or mores of the day (or hour) are. That said, it's an incredibly bleak view to take of life, even if it is more "realistic," and like you say, thanks to the predominance of the MCU, we'll likely get a lot more deconstructionist takes on superheroes as a reaction to that predominance. In and of itself, it's not a bad thing; it's often good to think more critically about ideas and concepts and tropes that we otherwise just accept as facts of life or rules of the genre, but after a certain point, I think there has to be room for hope, for idealism, for belief in some semblance of higher principle or purpose, or what is the purpose?

[PCN24454]

I find it funny how everyone talks about the MCU heroes as being “capes”.

It arguably shows just how low the standards for being a “cape” is nowadays.

[Huntsman Spider]

I find it funny how everyone talks about the MCU heroes as being “capes”.

It arguably shows just low the standards for being a “cape” is nowadays.

Hmm, that's an interesting point there. I mean, there's a growing genre of superhero deconstruction called "capepunk," which looks at superheroes from the perspective of those who are considered outsiders in some form or other, the outcasts of and/or the disaffected within a superhuman society, which is how the "punk" aspect of capepunk comes into play.

[PCN24454]

Hmm, that's an interesting point there. I mean, there's a growing genre of superhero deconstruction called "capepunk," which looks at superheroes from the perspective of those who are considered outsiders in some form or other, the outcasts of and/or the disaffected within a superhuman society, which is how the "punk" aspect of capepunk comes into play.

If a deconstruction happens enough times, it stops being a deconstruction and becomes a trope in and of itself.

It’s basically just a sub-genre of superhero fiction now.

[Huntsman Spider]

If a deconstruction happens enough times, it stops being a deconstruction and becomes a trope in and of itself.

It’s basically just a sub-genre of superhero fiction now.

That's a good way of putting it.