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  1. #46
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    So this exact thing happened many years ago. Back before the internet, so I can only really give first hand knowledge and what I remember.

    The Crow came out starring Brandon Lee.
    Brandon Lee passed.
    They recast for Crow 2 and the movie bombed.

    Now I didn't see either movie, I wasn't a fan of the comic, but I did ask one of the fans about Crow 2 and whether it would have done better if Brandon had been able to do it. Which his answer was, "yes it would have been better, they should have simply not bothered with the sequel."
    I don't know that "The Crow" is the best parallel. FYI, Lee died before shooting was even finished.(he was killed onset with maybe only a few days left to film) They almost didn't bother to finish it, but ultimately did it to honor Lee's performance, so that people would actually get to see it. (there might have been studio pressure, but I have no info on that) But that's really neither here nor there...

    The two biggest differences is:
    1) The character's story was done. Of course there could have been a contrived reason to bring him back, but even in the comic, it was a complete story of one man avenging the death of himself and his fiancee. It would've been hard to think of anything else that would have been as personal.
    2) The second film had a different director. Alex Proyas is one of those directors with a signature style and vision so any second film with a different person at the helm wouldn't have been the same either way.
    Last edited by j9ac9k; 09-19-2020 at 09:12 AM.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitou D. Kid View Post
    Recasting makes the most sense. The character is simply too big and too important for the culture. The Crow didn't have that going for it, and honestly neither did Heath Ledger's Joker. Black Panther as a character makes everyday people feel empowered in a way those performances don't, as great and as iconic as they may be.

    Black Panther was also just starting out. The context is also different from not recasting Iron Man after a 10+ year story finale.
    Yeah, agreed. A part of me wishes that they could leave it as a stand alone, as a tribute, but there are more stories to tell and we don't have enough African American superheroes as is.

  3. #48
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    I think the role should be recast, to send a message and to ensure the future of the entire MCU franchise.

    But if Marvel doesn't have the courage for that (and I'm not sure I would criticise them for that), the the most obvious choice to me to take on the mantle is M'Baku. He has the greatest in-story motivation and likely the most moving story potential.

  4. #49
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    I don't know that "The Crow" is the best parallel. FYI, Lee died before shooting was even finished.(he was killed onset with maybe only a few days left to film) They almost didn't bother to finish it, but ultimately did it to honor Lee's performance, so that people would actually get to see it. (there might have been studio pressure, but I have no info on that) But that's really neither here nor there...

    The two biggest differences is:
    1) The character's story was done. Of course there could have been a contrived reason to bring him back, but even in the comic, it was a complete story of one man avenging the death of himself and his fiancee. It would've been hard to think of anything else that would have been as personal.
    2) The second film had a different director. Alex Proyas is one of those directors with a signature style and vision so any second film with a different person at the helm wouldn't have been the same either way.
    Brandon Lee was not in the Crow 2.
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115986/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_4

    So not sure where you got your information that he was.
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  5. #50
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoneySpider View Post
    I think you've brought up a very good point. Yes, in the comics T'Challa eventually reclaimed his title of Black Panther and reclaimed his title of King of Wakanda, so it will look weird if Shuri becomes the permanent ruler of Wakanda in the MCU. Every time T'Challa loses his kingdom for whatever reason, he eventually regains it.

    And as for that fan's comment on The Crow 2...personally I just feel as though that was just his opinion, and it's just one opinion, and other people might have felt their were other reasons why the movie failed. Maybe a lot of of people who saw that movie didn't like the plot or something. I would love to know why everyone else involved in the production of that movie, and those who saw the movie, thought it failed. (I also wonder how many people actually liked that movie).
    And yes, I do agree, that was one person's opinion and in no way reflects everyone.
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    Brandon Lee was not in the Crow 2.
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115986/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_4

    So not sure where you got your information that he was.
    Not sure where you got the idea he said Lee was. I think you misread something.

  7. #52
    Astonishing Member Joker's Avatar
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    I think addressing it the same way in movie as it happened in real life might be the best route. He died. Wakanda knew he was ill, no one else did. Everyone outside of the Wakandan inner circle is caught just as off guard by the news as we were.

    Black Panther as a mantle lives on, his legacy, his inspiration.

    It also allows you to wrap that issue up in movie, while acknowledging what really happened, and in movie paying the same respect as in real life.
    Hey gang! Looking to sell of some of my TPB/HC collection. PM me if interested.
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  8. #53
    The Kid 80sbaby's Avatar
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    Addressing it like it happened will only depress your audience. The remainder of the film is going to suffer for it. We know Chadwick passed and don't need to be reminded of it. Recast the character and move forward.

  9. #54
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    I don't know that "The Crow" is the best parallel. FYI, Lee died before shooting was even finished.(he was killed onset with maybe only a few days left to film) They almost didn't bother to finish it, but ultimately did it to honor Lee's performance, so that people would actually get to see it. (there might have been studio pressure, but I have no info on that) But that's really neither here nor there...

    The two biggest differences is:
    1) The character's story was done. Of course there could have been a contrived reason to bring him back, but even in the comic, it was a complete story of one man avenging the death of himself and his fiancee. It would've been hard to think of anything else that would have been as personal.
    2) The second film had a different director. Alex Proyas is one of those directors with a signature style and vision so any second film with a different person at the helm wouldn't have been the same either way.
    A few people are questioning your post. Since I was talking about Lee not being in the second movie and you clearly state n the bold part, "Lee died before filming was complete." That means you believe Lee was in the second movie.
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  10. #55
    The Kid 80sbaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    A few people are questioning your post. Since I was talking about Lee not being in the second movie and you clearly state n the bold part, "Lee died before filming was complete." That means you believe Lee was in the second movie.
    I think it's pretty obvious they were speaking about the first film. Hence them saying "The Crow" isn't the best parallel and not "The Crow 2."

  11. #56
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 80sbaby View Post
    I think it's pretty obvious they were speaking about the first film. Hence them saying "The Crow" isn't the best parallel and not "The Crow 2."
    But since we are discussing changing actors between the first and the second movie because of death, I don't understand what discussion point was trying to be made.
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  12. #57
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    A few people are questioning your post. Since I was talking about Lee not being in the second movie and you clearly state n the bold part, "Lee died before filming was complete." That means you believe Lee was in the second movie.
    80sbaby is correct. I was referring to the fact that he died during the first movie. I only mentioned it to address your chain of events: "The Crow came out starring Brandon Lee. Brandon Lee passed. They recast for Crow 2 and the movie bombed." That's all. Sorry for any confusion.

    The rest of my post was about my reasons for why The Crow isn't quite the same as BP.

  13. #58
    Mighty Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    80sbaby is correct. I was referring to the fact that he died during the first movie. I only mentioned it to address your chain of events: "The Crow came out starring Brandon Lee. Brandon Lee passed. They recast for Crow 2 and the movie bombed." That's all. Sorry for any confusion.

    The rest of my post was about my reasons for why The Crow isn't quite the same as BP.
    Thanks for clarifying, that makes sense. That part I didn't know.
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  14. #59
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    They didn't recast for Crow 2.

    Crow 2 had a different actor playing a different character. Brandon was never involved with it to begin with.

  15. #60
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    A recast could work. If they're doing that, I'd recommend introducing the new actor in a separate film first before they go with Black Panther 2. I could understand why they'd want to go with this way, given that the work for the sequel has been based on the idea that T'Challa would be the lead, and narratively they dug themselves into a hole with T'Challa having the last of the panther herb.

    The cast was deep and rich enough that they could also go forward without T'Challa. Although the loss might dominate the story.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

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