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  1. #16
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpaqueGiraffe17 View Post
    different elements were introduced when different characters were the main guy sure, but giving those characters ownership or dibs over those elements over the others, has never been a rule before, I don't think they should start now.
    I think of it as less of a rule and more of a character courtesy .

  2. #17

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    I love the core Rogues, and I like the idea of them as professional criminals and thrill-seekers rather than supervillains. They're bad guys, sure, but not such bad guys compared to Batman's psychotic villains or guys like Thawne and Zoom. They plan and execute scores because they're good at it and it's fun for them, but they don't like collateral damage -- they avoid hurting civilians and would just as soon not mess with guards, cops, or superheroes if they stay out of their way. They have no interest in taking over the world or murdering everyone in it like lots of other supervillains, and I see the Rogues as being among the first to team up with the Justice League against an invasion from another planet, an alternate Earth, Hell, etc. "You can't have this world! This is where we keep all our stuff!" That kind of attitude.

    The Flash and Legends of Tomorrow show cemented Captain Cold as one of my favorite DC characters, hero or villain, thanks in large part to Wentworth Miller's performance. I love the redemption arcs that he and Heat Wave got on Legends. What I'd really love to see is a comic about the core Rogues reforming and offering their service as for-profit superheroes. Weather Wizard could literally save the world by creating rain in drought conditions or combating out-of-control fires. Mirror Master could organize teleporting through reflective surfaces as a way to cut down on pollution from fossil fuel emissions, market the ability to send hard light duplicates out into the world to simplify people's lives, you name it. The guy has the most diverse and underappreciated set of powers in comics next to J'onn J'onzz. Captain Cold and Heat Wave could certainly lead rescue teams into extreme heat or extreme cold environments, Cold and Weather Wizard could work with firefighters, etc. They could even market their services as a security firm for banks, labs, prisons, and other facilities that need the highest-quality security systems that can't be cracked.

    I loved that Pied Piper and Trickster both reformed thanks in part to Barry and Wally's positive influences, and I didn't stick around with the New 52 Flash series despite loving Manapul's art, mostly because I didn't love his changes to the Rogues, making them metahumans and more dangerous villains. But I read Forever Evil and liked Cold helping the heroes and joining the Justice League in the end, although I'm sure that didn't last long. I think if the Rogues could still get thrills and get paid, they would probably consider using their skills and equipment to do some good, to avoid getting beaten up and thrown in jail all the time, and would come to enjoy being treated like heroes.
    Last edited by Big Bad Voodoo Lou; 09-22-2020 at 11:42 AM.
    Author of the law review article "The Lawyer as Superhero: How Marvel Comics' Daredevil Depicts the American Court System and Legal Practice," Capital University Law Review, Vol. 47, No. 2 (2019).
    Download it for free at https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers....act_id=3389544

  3. #18
    Extraordinary Member Lightning Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Bad Voodoo Lou View Post
    I love the core Rogues, and I like the idea of them as professional criminals and thrill-seekers rather than supervillains. They're bad guys, sure, but not such bad guys compared to Batman's psychotic villains or guys like Thawne and Zoom. They plan and execute scores because they're good at it and it's fun for them, but they don't like collateral damage -- they avoid hurting civilians and would just as soon not mess with guards, cops, or superheroes if they stay out of their way. They have no interest in taking over the world or murdering everyone in it like lots of other supervillains, and I see the Rogues as being among the first to team up with the Justice League against an invasion from another planet, an alternate Earth, Hell, etc. "You can't have this world! This is where we keep all our stuff!" That kind of attitude.

    The Flash and Legends of Tomorrow show cemented Captain Cold as one of my favorite DC characters, hero or villain, thanks in large part to Wentworth Miller's performance. I love the redemption arcs that he and Heat Wave got on Legends. What I'd really love to see is a comic about the core Rogues reforming and offering their service as for-profit superheroes. Weather Wizard could literally save the world by creating rain in drought conditions or combating out-of-control fires. Mirror Master could organize teleporting through reflective surfaces as a way to cut down on pollution from fossil fuel emissions, market the ability to send hard light duplicates out into the world to simplify people's lives, you name it. The guy has the most diverse and underappreciated set of powers in comics next to J'onn J'onzz. Captain Cold and Heat Wave could certainly lead rescue teams into extreme heat or extreme cold environments, Cold and Weather Wizard could work with firefighters, etc. They could even market their services as a security firm for banks, labs, prisons, and other facilities that need the highest-quality security systems that can't be cracked.

    I loved that Pied Piper and Trickster both reformed thanks in part to Barry and Wally's positive influences, and I didn't stick around with the New 52 Flash series despite loving Manapul's art, mostly because I didn't love his changes to the Rogues, making them metahumans and more dangerous villains. But I read Forever Evil and liked Cold helping the heroes and joining the Justice League in the end, although I'm sure that didn't last long. I think if the Rogues could still get thrills and get paid, they would probably consider using their skills and equipment to do some good, to avoid getting beaten up and thrown in jail all the time, and would come to enjoy being treated like heroes.
    I prefer the core Rogues to remain anti-villains, but I really like your idea of for-profit heroing. It seems like something they'd do. And with them, there's always a catch, always some toll to pay. I would crack up reading them rescuing people from a fire, only to take their jewelry as payment. Or Mirror Master generating Plunder-like doubles every time someone travels through so that he could use them for criminal purposes. Kind of reminds me of what Alex Ross had the Secret Society doing at the start of "Justice", all sorts of charitable works.

    That said, in a movie, I think a reformed Jesse and Hartley going after their old buddies could be really good. I've always thought that with a Rogues movie, you could start right at the beginning, but it also works if you start with them already formed at some later date, making vague allusions to their past that resurface in meaningful ways throughout the movie.

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