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  1. #46
    Cosmic Sandwich Metal Sphere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psy-lock View Post
    Krakoa will definitely end with Hickman. Nothing lasts forever, so enjoy it while it lasts. It's much better to have a shorter story that ends on a high note rather than a long one inevitably devolving into trash.
    I wholeheartedly agree. I've been a fan of far too many comics, mangas, shows, etc... that went from strength to strength, only to them meander and hobble about for a long time before ending in an awful state. As stated earlier in the thread, Hickman has created an out for himself. He gets to tell his wild, high-concept story of a mutant nation of immortals thriving and mastering all corners of the marvel universe. It'll lead to stories that you wouldn't really be able to tell in the previous framework, so the entertainment factor is obvious. We get to see a mutant culture forming, one that largely disregards human morals, ethics and value systems, leading to interesting exchanges and friction with the rest of the MU. We get to see a WILD take on Moira, etc... But at the end, it'll all be put away. And there's nothing wrong with that.

    As folks have mentioned, bits and pieces of this will be adapted into the MCU. But the comics are going to snap back to the status quo, I just hope to god they drop the misery porn once things revert.

  2. #47
    Fantastic Member
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    It would make sense to use moira last death to reboot all Marvel Franchises by having her willing to commit her ultimate sacrifice before interfering in the x-continuity (Thus, the entire marvel timeline)

    An analogue of DC’s new 52 might be necessary to streamline Marvel comics universe from a marketing point of view, considering the current status of the books, when every single story has been told and retold and the only possible way of bringing fresh narratives to the readers are through profound mischaracterization/ reinvention of the heroes.

    Would I appreciate it?

    Sincerely I don’t know.

  3. #48
    Fantastic Member Foon4000's Avatar
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    Hickman started planning HOX/DOX way before the Disney/Fox deal was sealed. He seems way too invested for it to be a prelude to a mutant reboot.

    Marvel are more likely to launch a teen/YA line of TPBs that ties-in with the MCU than reboot the 616. Regular monthlies still make money, have a fan base and are cheap to produce. YA graphic novels are a huge and distinct market and Marvel are loosing out to Scholastic atm.

    If Eternals had come out on schedule, mutants would be MCU canon this November. Some mutants are going to be in Shang-Chi. Mutants are going to appear as individuals waaay before Professor X’s X-men.

  4. #49
    Astonishing Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killerbee911 View Post
    Going back to being a simply a school for mutants, Going back to just Xavier and Cyclops being completely in charge(this run has a little of that problem to be real), Trying to win humans trust by being superheroes, etc. But simply the X-men has too many good characters to go back to scope of school which is too small for the X-men concept now.

    Plus the X-men can't be "superheroes" in this universe, X-men are freedom fighters/rebels against the system that hates and fear them now. The X-men that people want will never work again because writers don't know how ease up on the misery porn. The X-men can't go back "Xavier's Dream" when it is shown that humans will always try to wipe them out. Minorities will always prioritize their self preservation over unity. It is just bad story telling hey our people dying but lets run around trying to make humans respect us by doing things "the right way."
    You can have a school and other things.

    The answer to the leadership problem isn’t an unelected, unanswerable council of mutantkind’s betters IMO.

    The issue of too many characters? Writers should just use the characters that already exist instead making yet another redundant character.

    I do agree about the misery plot though, but I think the answer is actually also pretty radical — integration and assimilation. The biggest issue with the minority angle is that in real life (timescales being different) minorities integrate and assimilate eventually — and beyond that, none of my neighbors or friends fear that I’ll lose control of my reality warping powers and destroy our neighborhood. In other words, the minority/hated/feared angle only goes so far because in-universe it isn’t unreasonable to be concerned that your perfectly good neighbor might suddenly develop powers that pose a danger to himself and others.
    Does it need doing?
    Yes.
    Then it will be done.

  5. #50
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    Resetting it via Moira’s death is insufficient drama for the X-Men. Odds are Ye Olde Faithful is being primed for the moment the MCU has no need of her

  6. #51
    Spectacular Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    My guesses:
    If Krakoa happens it won't be how they're introduced, particularly since "secret community full of superhumans" is literally what they're doing with the Eternals (and especially if they use Ms Marvel to reboot the Royal Family and Attilan).

    They definitely won't adapt Hickman's run until Hickman's run is over, which, given Feiges implications that the X-Men aren't coming till Phase 6/after the current "five year plan" that still gives room for any sudden huge twist with Krakoa to not get in the way of anything.

    And even if they did start with Krakoa, it'll probably be made much less complicated to "sentient island the mutants live on".

    But let's be real, the first time we see the X-Men will likely be some version of AvX, and will skew more towards the more classic X-Men stuff than anything recent. The MCU is big on having characters from different franchises/worlds collide, so the big selling point to differentiate this version of the X-Men from the Fox versions will be "they can interact/be friends with the MCU characters now!" which is the exact opposite of Krakoas main premise.

  7. #52
    Astonishing Member Omega Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    My guesses:
    If Krakoa happens it won't be how they're introduced, particularly since "secret community full of superhumans" is literally what they're doing with the Eternals (and especially if they use Ms Marvel to reboot the Royal Family and Attilan).

    They definitely won't adapt Hickman's run until Hickman's run is over, which, given Feiges implications that the X-Men aren't coming till Phase 6/after the current "five year plan" that still gives room for any sudden huge twist with Krakoa to not get in the way of anything.

    And even if they did start with Krakoa, it'll probably be made much less complicated to "sentient island the mutants live on".

    But let's be real, the first time we see the X-Men will likely be some version of AvX, and will skew more towards the more classic X-Men stuff than anything recent. The MCU is big on having characters from different franchises/worlds collide, so the big selling point to differentiate this version of the X-Men from the Fox versions will be "they can interact/be friends with the MCU characters now!" which is the exact opposite of Krakoas main premise.
    Nah, there's no way they'll start with something like AvX. They won't introduce the X-men as villains or antagonists since they're the future of the MCU, and even The Guardians of the Galaxy were allowed room to develop before meeting the Avengers.

    Also, something that makes Krakoa different than Wakanda or the Eternals is that it's just a base- mutants are everywhere, and could be anyone. For the average human, is the Red Scare again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kitty&Piotr<3 View Post
    We already know what the comics will look like when the MCU X-Men drops. We will get a mostly nostalgic repeat of the Jim Lee aesthetic with super-classic characterization. Look at the Disney Plus icons.

    Like...get used to it. It's a forgone conclusion.
    Yeah...no. 90's looks are completely outdated now. And Feige is smart, this is a guy that managed to make GotG a hit a few years after an acclaimed, but low-selling run.

    And you can bet that they'll do as much as they can to differentiate themselves from the Fox movies, to run from the taint of the New Mutants and Dark Phoenix and from Brian Singer.

  8. #53
    Spectacular Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omega Alpha View Post
    Nah, there's no way they'll start with something like AvX. They won't introduce the X-men as villains or antagonists since they're the future of the MCU, and even The Guardians of the Galaxy were allowed room to develop before meeting the Avengers.

    Also, something that makes Krakoa different than Wakanda or the Eternals is that it's just a base- mutants are everywhere, and could be anyone. For the average human, is the Red Scare again.
    I mean they introduced Spideys as being on team Iron Man during Civil War. I don't think they'll be villains, but I definitely think the first time they show up theyll immediately come into conflict with the Avengers.

    To the second point: that's also true of the Inhumans, who we know for a fact are coming first in the MCU. It also sounds like Marvels planning Secret Invasion, which would also handle those same elements.

    As for the comics and whether or not Krakoa stays around after Hickman: I think Krakoa the physical being/location/country will exist, but the leadership/society will not be the same. I also think the resurrection stuff will be modified somewhat, if only to prevent lesser writers from deciding the best way to build up hype for a new baddie in an event is to throw famous mutants at them as cannon fodder to make him look good since they can kill them without them staying dead.

    Edit: I also think a big reason they won't start with Krakoa is because, frankly, since the X-Men films spent so much time using the same villains (remaking Last Stand, etc) that there's still a lot they didn't do that the MCU could do before Krakoa. If they want to change things up that wouldn't require cutting out the school, it'd just be changing up who's on the team. Marvel Studios does like Hickman a lot (the fake production company for their Fantastic Four project is even Solve Everything LLC) but their adaptations of his stuff is always pretty loose. Krakoa may very well happen but I think it'll be very different (in particular probably the poly/orgy stuff since the MCU in general shies away from sex stuff)
    Last edited by gonnagiveittoya; 09-25-2020 at 02:19 PM.

  9. #54
    Astonishing Member Omega Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    I mean they introduced Spideys as being on team Iron Man during Civil War. I don't think they'll be villains, but I definitely think the first time they show up theyll immediately come into conflict with the Avengers.

    To the second point: that's also true of the Inhumans, who we know for a fact are coming first in the MCU. It also sounds like Marvels planning Secret Invasion, which would also handle those same elements.

    As for the comics and whether or not Krakoa stays around after Hickman: I think Krakoa the physical being/location/country will exist, but the leadership/society will not be the same. I also think the resurrection stuff will be modified somewhat, if only to prevent lesser writers from deciding the best way to build up hype for a new baddie in an event is to throw famous mutants at them as cannon fodder to make him look good since they can kill them without them staying dead.

    Edit: I also think a big reason they won't start with Krakoa is because, frankly, since the X-Men films spent so much time using the same villains (remaking Last Stand, etc) that there's still a lot they didn't do that the MCU could do before Krakoa. If they want to change things up that wouldn't require cutting out the school, it'd just be changing up who's on the team. Marvel Studios does like Hickman a lot (the fake production company for their Fantastic Four project is even Solve Everything LLC) but their adaptations of his stuff is always pretty loose. Krakoa may very well happen but I think it'll be very different (in particular probably the poly/orgy stuff since the MCU in general shies away from sex stuff)
    Different case- Spider-Man was one character, that had been already been explored in multiple movies, and they didn't have to explain who he is (so much they skipped the origin story); plus, he was one character in the middle of two teams made of sympathetic heroes fighting each other.

    What you're suggesting is have the X-men team appear first as antagonists to the Avengers, who likely won't have another movie for a long time now. That makes no sense.

    Also, the Inhumans were already introduced in the series, it failed, and they aren't doing it again.

  10. #55
    Spectacular Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    They don't need to be in an Avengers movie to come into conflict with the Avengers. And Ms Marvel has been confirmed for over a year now, so they definitely are rebootinf Inhumans again.

  11. #56
    Astonishing Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    They don't need to be in an Avengers movie to come into conflict with the Avengers. And Ms Marvel has been confirmed for over a year now, so they definitely are rebootinf Inhumans again.
    I agree with you; if anything, the Avengers will be the antagonists because they can afford to be.
    Does it need doing?
    Yes.
    Then it will be done.

  12. #57
    Astonishing Member Omega Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    They don't need to be in an Avengers movie to come into conflict with the Avengers. And Ms Marvel has been confirmed for over a year now, so they definitely are rebootinf Inhumans again.
    No, they're just doing Ms. Marvel, who knows what they'll use. Heck, they can even make her a mutant for all we know. The Inhumans was Perlmutter's baby, and Feige wanted nothing to do with it.

  13. #58
    Mighty Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hizashi View Post
    I agree with you; if anything, the Avengers will be the antagonists because they can afford to be.
    Could be an Ant-man type situation, where they accidentally invade/got sent to an Avengers base or interrupt an Avengers mission and get mistaken for an enemy.

  14. #59
    Spectacular Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    I don't see why they would get rid of the Inhuman part of her origin. Not using the Royal Family doesn't mean not using Kamala or the Inhumans as a species.

  15. #60
    Astonishing Member cranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    I don't see why they would get rid of the Inhuman part of her origin. Not using the Royal Family doesn't mean not using Kamala or the Inhumans as a species.
    Yeah, they have Kree and Celestial and soon Eternals. Does not take much effort to establish an MCU version of Inhuman.

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