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  1. #31
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    I've forgotten a lot about the Silmarillion since I've last read it. Fëanor, the First Age Battlemech is probably enough to get me back into it.
    For a guy so critical to all of the crap that happened in the First Age, he sure gets taken out early. ^_^
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  2. #32
    Legendary God of Pirates Nik Hasta's Avatar
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    Okay, with that handy write up from Sharp, I feel like I have more of an idea of where the leading lights of the Gank Squad are.

    Putting the fear aura aside because, honestly, I don't think it's possible for us to definitively say who is going to be able to resist it or not for the most part.

    Scoobies (2) and Assassins (1) are down.

    (3) Team Wuxia is hard one to gauge, I honestly think the fact that the Gank Squad are fully armoured is the biggest problem. Nameless, Flying Snow, Sky, Broken Sword, Dragon, Li Mu Bai and potentially Yuanjia are all really quick to various degrees and mostly have solid chi game, magic swords or just ballistically powerful stats to fall back on.

    Jin could also have a fun archery duel on his hands. His accuracy feats are bananas.



    To note, the four dudes he hit there were all not injured, he specifically pinned their clothes to fake them being killed from that range through that many trees. Dude is a really good archer. Similarly Mei has some pretty bonkers trick shots with her daggers.

    (4) I think the Baki dudes are... capable of taking it just about but they are going get severely maimed in the process. I'm not seeing any feats of speed from Gank Squad that puts them in the same bracket as Baki, Retsu, Doppo, Musashi or Katsumi for example. Definitely not the top tiers in that list. Armour is an issue, especially magic armour. Also, these Gank Squad kids seem very durable so it's going to take a while.

    (5) The Hashira are... well, by and large they are more consistently fast than the Baki team so the issue of speed is even more pronounced. Also, they all are armed with swords and, they are specifically skilled at "cutting real good," Tanjiro, a dude who is an ant to the Hashira at the start, is capable of cleaving a boulder the size of minivan in half as part of his training and he ends up against demons who are so durable his sword breaks against their neck. It's specifically noted that it's not a question of the sword, it's to do with Tanjiro's skill at cutting which, at the time, wasn't high enough.

    Giyuu, a member of the Hashira, then shows up and instant blitzes the dude's head off with ease.

    They also have a number of weird or exotic powers that essentially boil down into "sword beams," movement techniques, explosive projectile type stuff and the like. I really should do a respect thread for the Hashira at some point. At the very least, I should do a speed breakdown on them.

    (6) If the Hi Shin's morale breaks, which it will, that leaves, Shin, Kyoukai and maybe a smattering the more experienced members of the unit like Denyuu and Ryuusen, up against a bunch of obviously much more supernatural people. Shin and Kyoukai are absolute demons in a fight, but they aren't winning this.

    (7) MCU feels like it might lack speed to be honest. Magic axe should maybe work on Thor? I don't know, I don't see them having an easy time here.

    (8) Strawhats were, as you note, a bit of a punt. Certainly a bridge to far. Even only scaled to Alabasta, Luffy is still hammering dudes through the bedrock under a large town and flipping over multiple buildings while poisoned and greviously injured. Zoro is cutting through stone and metal and also throwing entire stone buildings around and Sanji has been kicking the heck out of giant monsters with ease for a while now. All this feels a bit out o the Gank Squad paygrade.
    Last edited by Nik Hasta; 09-28-2020 at 07:23 AM.

  3. #33
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    I'm pretty cool with your breakdown. The only one I'm iffy on is the MCU. Thor, Hulk (thunderclap to deal with speed, and yes, he does have that based on the movies), Iron Man are in a range I'm not sure the Gank Squad can deal with, even with Ringil, Anguirel, and the Deathiron. If nothing else, both Thor and Iron Man can take to the air and rain down destruction, and there's little the First Agers can do to stop them - Beleg is the only one with a serious range attack, and arrows aren't going to do a whole lot to these two.

    Finrod's magic is somewhat nebulous in its application in this situation. Dude wasn't blowing stuff up or anything of the sort.

    Otherwise, yeah, sounds about right.
    Why are we here?

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    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik
    "Why throw punches when you can be making everyone around you sterile mutant corpses?" - Pendaran, regarding Dr. Fate

  4. #34
    Legendary God of Pirates Nik Hasta's Avatar
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    Maybe my memory of first Avengers movie is hazy. I feel like Tony is going to get rocked if he engages with hand-to-hand with someone like Fingolfin, his early armours just weren't that wildly strong and I'm dubious on how effective repulsors are going to be on dudes who have protections that allow them to fight mutilple Balrogs for a long period of time.

    Steve, Clint and Natasha might as well not be here.

    Thor and Hulk are the key boys here.

    Perhaps Fingolfin could effect some kind of fastball special?

  5. #35
    She/Her Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    For a guy so critical to all of the crap that happened in the First Age, he sure gets taken out early. ^_^
    Eru Ilúvatar had him killed because he was dishing facts.
    Yeah, but if you... man, we're getting into weird analogy territory, like if you disintegrated Superman's arms he wouldn't be able to go "fool! Little did you know that my arms and I are one and can be remade from me!" and will his arms back into being from pure nothingness. - Pendaran

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  6. #36
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Hasta View Post
    Maybe my memory of first Avengers movie is hazy. I feel like Tony is going to get rocked if he engages with hand-to-hand with someone like Fingolfin, his early armours just weren't that wildly strong and I'm dubious on how effective repulsors are going to be on dudes who have protections that allow them to fight mutilple Balrogs for a long period of time.

    Steve, Clint and Natasha might as well not be here.

    Thor and Hulk are the key boys here.

    Perhaps Fingolfin could effect some kind of fastball special?
    A hilarious thought, Fingolfin flinging an Anguirel-armed Húrin at Thor....

    My feeling is that Thor and Tony take to the air (if need be, Hulk thunderclaps and that, based on the stuff he pulled off and his own first movie, is going to be enough to stall the Gank Squad).

    Thor then hits Tony with lightning.

    Tony and Thor proceed to blast the crap out of the Gank Squad with pin-point lightning-charged repulsors and massive area-affecting waves of lightning.

    Tony will never run out of charge thanks to Thor, who...seems to never run out of charge, himself. Beleg is going to get waxed pretty fast by this kind of stuff (not being on the level of the top-tier guys, and being rather less-armored to boot), so whatever arrows he's plinking at Thor are going to stop. Maybe Hulk gets his head cut off or something (Húrin mistakes him for a troll and attacks with Beleg's Anguirel, or Fingolfin chops him up), maybe he just monsters around this battlefield hitting lesser Eldar with each other.

    I'm not thinking the First Agers have any real answer to all of that, as much as I wish they did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    Eru Ilúvatar had him killed because he was dishing facts.
    Eru didn't need to kill him; dude died of his own impatience and insanity.
    Why are we here?

    "Superboy Prime (the yelling guy if he needs clarification)..." - Postmania
    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik
    "Why throw punches when you can be making everyone around you sterile mutant corpses?" - Pendaran, regarding Dr. Fate

  7. #37
    Rumbles Limbo Champion big_adventure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Hasta View Post
    Maybe my memory of first Avengers movie is hazy. I feel like Tony is going to get rocked if he engages with hand-to-hand with someone like Fingolfin, his early armours just weren't that wildly strong and I'm dubious on how effective repulsors are going to be on dudes who have protections that allow them to fight mutilple Balrogs for a long period of time.

    Steve, Clint and Natasha might as well not be here.

    Thor and Hulk are the key boys here.

    Perhaps Fingolfin could effect some kind of fastball special?
    The issue the first-agers have is that they have no real way to deal with the AoE's Thor can dish. They can't fly, they can't teleport or anything like that. Bloodlusted, Thor takes off and proceeds to AoE their asses to death. Or he calls up a storm, pulls them into the air, and lightnings them to shreds. It might take a while for a few of them, but he's got all day or all year or all century to get this done. This is before considering thunderclaps and such from Hulk.

    A fastball special would just be target practice to a guy who repeatedly and consistently swats energy blasts with swings from his hammer. He isn't throwing anyone at 500 kmh or anything.
    "But... But I want to be a big karate cyborg... ;_;" - Nik Hasta
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  8. #38
    She/Her Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    Eru didn't need to kill him; dude died of his own impatience and insanity.
    "I MUST AIR MY GRIEVANCES!" Fëanor bellowed, wreathed in the fire of his belligerent spirit, as he kicked down the door to Eru's bedchamber.
    Yeah, but if you... man, we're getting into weird analogy territory, like if you disintegrated Superman's arms he wouldn't be able to go "fool! Little did you know that my arms and I are one and can be remade from me!" and will his arms back into being from pure nothingness. - Pendaran

    Arx Inosaan

  9. #39
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    "I MUST AIR MY GRIEVANCES!" Fëanor bellowed, wreathed in the fire of his belligerent spirit, as he kicked down the door to Eru's bedchamber.
    [Ilúvatar] Get out.

    [Námo] *drags a screaming Fëanor back to his halls* C'mon, you're making me look bad. Keep this up and I'll have Tulkas sit on you.
    Why are we here?

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    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik
    "Why throw punches when you can be making everyone around you sterile mutant corpses?" - Pendaran, regarding Dr. Fate

  10. #40
    She/Her Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    Question.

    Would Eärendil and his Forehead Laser/Mural Van swing- or at least make more even- any of the fights the Gank Squad lose? I know I'm not the OP but it's got me curious.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    [Ilúvatar] Get out.

    [Námo] *drags a screaming Fëanor back to his halls* C'mon, you're making me look bad. Keep this up and I'll have Tulkas sit on you.
    I believe I've got a new head canon.
    Yeah, but if you... man, we're getting into weird analogy territory, like if you disintegrated Superman's arms he wouldn't be able to go "fool! Little did you know that my arms and I are one and can be remade from me!" and will his arms back into being from pure nothingness. - Pendaran

    Arx Inosaan

  11. #41
    She/Her Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh's Avatar
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    More specifically, in LoTRverse the term "babysitting" came as a result of Námo needing Tulkas to sit on Fëanor to keep him from constantly causing problems.
    Yeah, but if you... man, we're getting into weird analogy territory, like if you disintegrated Superman's arms he wouldn't be able to go "fool! Little did you know that my arms and I are one and can be remade from me!" and will his arms back into being from pure nothingness. - Pendaran

    Arx Inosaan

  12. #42
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    Question.

    Would Eärendil and his Forehead Laser/Mural Van swing- or at least make more even- any of the fights the Gank Squad lose? I know I'm not the OP but it's got me curious.
    So, okay - we can look at this the amusing way or try to work it out.

    The amusing way?

    Of course Eärendil annihilates his entire opposition whilst simultaneously tanking everything they throw at him! How could you think otherwise?

    sdf-1-main-gun.jpg

    Substitute a really glittering Eldar for the SDF-1 and we're all good.

    The more serious way?

    Okay, so Eärendil is noted as being part of a group that kicked Ancalagon's gigantic rear. He's the dude in charge of the group that won that fight, said group including the Eagles of Manwë. And he was a participant, not some armchair general. Two possibilities leap to mind (other than the Silmaril Main Reflex Cannon):

    1. Eärendil himself is mighty enough and kitted out with enough powerful Valinorean gear that he did a not insubstantial fraction of the damage that killed a dragon whose death throes tore up three mountains bigger than Everest;
    2. Eärendil's flying ship was powerful enough and kitted out with enough Valinorean weapon systems that he did a not insubstantial fraction blah blah blah yougettheidea.

    Either one seems fairly plausible to me.

    If it's #1, or it's #2 and the situation warrants him having Vingilot, then...ugh, I think even One Piece is going to have some trouble, though their speed should be of assistance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh View Post
    More specifically, in LoTRverse the term "babysitting" came as a result of Námo needing Tulkas to sit on Fëanor to keep him from constantly causing problems.
    Perfectly reasonable.
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 09-28-2020 at 09:10 AM.
    Why are we here?

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    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik
    "Why throw punches when you can be making everyone around you sterile mutant corpses?" - Pendaran, regarding Dr. Fate

  13. #43
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    It's worth noting on speed that Feanor charged his way across significant land mass distance in pursuit of his enemies and there's not especially any mention of a horse (that would itself have needed to be some kind of silly magic horse) that I can recall. (before one notes "well realistically there would have to have been", recall that his half brother is the guy repeatedly leaping around serial mid fight explosions and otherwise pounding on the gates of Angband so hard they hear it in its depths and all that nonsense. The immediate ruling family of the Noldor were on some bemusing crack, I'm saying)

    I'm not saying he has vast superspeed or anything of any significant measure, but certainly it wouldn't be out of place to put him over/on something like that outrunning traffic while on foot that Cap, T'challa and Bucky were doing in Civil War, as far as measuring it against performances.
    Last edited by Pendaran; 09-28-2020 at 02:56 PM.

  14. #44
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Finrod's magic is somewhat nebulous in its application in this situation. Dude wasn't blowing stuff up or anything of the sort.
    Losing to a song of power seems to result in incapacitation, as far as it goes from what can be concluded off it. Considering what losing that fight did to him.

    He still has to, you know, sing that stuff, which puts it of somewhat limited utility in various of these fights.

    I would say what you can conclude off of Sauron and Finrod going at each other with such things: Losing or not contesting effs you up and takes you out. Finrod's magic was enough to let him legitimately contest Sauron in a duel of that sort of magic as far as benchmarking a "who am powerful enough for it to register on". It was a one person focused thing.

  15. #45
    Extraordinary Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Two possibilities leap to mind (other than the Silmaril Main Reflex Cannon)
    If Earendil shooting magic lasers out of his forehead at Ancalagon is wrong, I don't want to be right.

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