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  1. #151
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    I've been banging the drum for a Hal/John book for years now. These two characters have a long history with each other that's so ripe with potential. They're friends and brothers, but there's a tension between them that's always been there. And yet these two guys undeniably respect each other. John is the only GL that has consistently been shown as capable of beating Hal, who is rightfully considered the best of the best within the Corps. With all the questioning of authority that Hal Jordan is known for, the only leaders he's ever shown deference to were Superman and John, who began as the most anti-authority GL.

    Like I said, there's a lot of potential there. I'm shocked that DC hasn't tried to capitalize on it yet. Hopefully, the new editorial direction will rectify this.

    Currently, Jess, John, and Hal are DC's three most prominent and popular GLs. Rather than segregating them in different books, I'd like DC to stick them together and see how they bounce off each other.

  2. #152
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    John is almost a completely different character from when he was written by Englehart, but even then he had problems with Hal being a leech-deadbeat. He doesn't have an established or compelling one-on-one friendship with Hal. They either get along as individual co-workers getting a job done or as part of a group with Guy and Kyle. I don't see them hanging out one-on-one and believably getting along, like John does with Guy. Hal's closest human relationships are outside of the Corps, with Barry and Ollie. He has a volatile relationship with Guy, and an almost mentor or older brother relationship with Kyle.
    We've seen them getting along and hanging out one-on-one though, most notably at the end of the Sinestro Corps. War.

  3. #153
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    He literally said "you are my best friend" and "I love you".
    P00004 (35).jpg

  4. #154
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    We've seen them getting along and hanging out one-on-one though, most notably at the end of the Sinestro Corps. War.
    One panel isn't a friendship. They're co-workers, and more than one other human GL was in the apartment in that scene.

    All Geoff Johns did with John is make him lick Hal's boots, so I don't really put much stock into any John Stewart scenes he's written.

    Quote Originally Posted by HAN9000 View Post
    He literally said "you are my best friend" and "I love you".
    P00004 (35).jpg
    Again, that's not consistent with modern John Stewart, and even then he's calling Hal a deadbeat freeloader.

    The nice thing about the John-Guy dynamic is that John is usually the center of attention and the brains of the operation, with Guy providing comic relief. I don't see writers trying to replicate that dynamic with Hal. They'd rather have John simp for any other white hero just because they're white--looking at you Geoff Johns. That guy not only did that **** with John Stewart, he also did it with School Bus Cyborg. I think we have a pretty clear understanding of Geoff John's views of the world.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 11-23-2020 at 05:14 AM.

  5. #155
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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  6. #156
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    I like Bendis's idea of the Guardians being these sentient wisps of fire and flame--goes nicely with the Lantern theme.



    Their present day iteration should do this but be re-colored the appropriate green. Just more visually striking.

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    One panel isn't a friendship. They're co-workers, and more than one other human GL was in the apartment in that scene.

    All Geoff Johns did with John is make him lick Hal's boots, so I don't really put much stock into any John Stewart scenes he's written.



    Again, that's not consistent with modern John Stewart, and even then he's calling Hal a deadbeat freeloader.

    The nice thing about the John-Guy dynamic is that John is usually the center of attention and the brains of the operation, with Guy providing comic relief. I don't see writers trying to replicate that dynamic with Hal. They'd rather have John simp for any other white hero just because they're white--looking at you Geoff Johns. That guy not only did that **** with John Stewart, he also did it with School Bus Cyborg. I think we have a pretty clear understanding of Geoff John's views of the world.
    So basically you are trying to say, you don't recognize what writers in 80s/90s wrote because it's not consistent with modern John, and you also don't recognize the content written by the writer who established modern Green Lantern because you just don't like it. LOL. Yeah, I see no no contradiction at all.
    Also, Funny that you have problems with John not being the center of attention in a relationship but think it's nice to let Guy be the minor role.
    Last edited by HAN9000; 11-23-2020 at 06:47 AM.

  8. #158
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    One panel isn't a friendship. They're co-workers, and more than one other human GL was in the apartment in that scene.

    All Geoff Johns did with John is make him lick Hal's boots, so I don't really put much stock into any John Stewart scenes he's written.

    Again, that's not consistent with modern John Stewart, and even then he's calling Hal a deadbeat freeloader.

    The nice thing about the John-Guy dynamic is that John is usually the center of attention and the brains of the operation, with Guy providing comic relief. I don't see writers trying to replicate that dynamic with Hal. They'd rather have John simp for any other white hero just because they're white--looking at you Geoff Johns. That guy not only did that **** with John Stewart, he also did it with School Bus Cyborg. I think we have a pretty clear understanding of Geoff John's views of the world.
    John and Hal were very clearly friends during the GLC days. And John standing up for Hal or being a good friend to Hal isn't "licking his boots", or being a "simp" especially since it's Hal's title. There's always a certain deference to the lead of a title, the same way John beat Hal in "Mosaic." You can bitch about John not getting the spotlight or having his own title, but the resentment is clear - John is #1 or he's being "mistreated" or "miswritten" and you only accept scenes where he's awesome and satisfies your wish fulfillment. (although Guy fans should accept him being the "comic relief" sidekick to John??) I suppose you don't accept that John was ever in a wheelchair or that Hal healed him because that doens't fit your worldview.

    This thread is supposed to be about appreciating the GLC - they're one happy corps, despite the splintered fandom, so maybe ditch the sour grapes and take an example from the solidarity of the Corps.
    Last edited by j9ac9k; 11-23-2020 at 07:19 AM.

  9. #159
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j9ac9k View Post
    John and Hal were very clearly friends during the GLC days. And John standing up for Hal or being a good friend to Hal isn't "licking his boots", or being a "simp" especially since it's Hal's title. There's always a certain deference to the lead of a title, the same way John beat Hal in "Mosaic." You can bitch about John not getting the spotlight or having his own title, but the resentment is clear - John is #1 or he's being "mistreated" or "miswritten" and you only accept scenes where he's awesome and satisfies your wish fulfillment. (although Guy fans should accept him being the "comic relief" sidekick to John??) I suppose you don't accept that John was ever in a wheelchair or that Hal healed him because that doens't fit your worldview.

    This thread is supposed to be about appreciating the GLC - they're one happy corps, despite the splintered fandom, so maybe ditch the sour grapes and take an example from the solidarity of the Corps.
    I have no solidarity with: (1) racially biased writers who make black characters secondary wallpaper solely because of their skin color; or (2) racially biased depictions of characters of color. What a crime.

    Some writers can call Hal "the greatest," whatever that means, and some writers call John the "best lantern ever." I prefer the latter opinion. No big deal, and no need to contend over it on this thread.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 11-23-2020 at 09:17 AM.

  10. #160
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAN9000 View Post
    So basically you are trying to say, you don't recognize what writers in 80s/90s wrote because it's not consistent with modern John, and you also don't recognize the content written by the writer who established modern Green Lantern because you just don't like it. LOL. Yeah, I see no no contradiction at all.
    Also, Funny that you have problems with John not being the center of attention in a relationship but think it's nice to let Guy be the minor role.
    There is no such thing as a 50/50 dynamic in one individual plotline. In a pair, there's a hero and a foil/lancer. I don't want John to be a foil to someone else, since the black best friend trope is a tired AF second class position for black characters. It's not a contradiction to say I want John to be in the hero position. If other people want to fight over it, fine, but that's my opinion, yo.

    Do you really think modern John came from Geoff Johns or was solely written by Geoff Johns? What about the DCAU crew who actually updated him and gave him prominence? What about Venditti and Jensen who didn't write him a moping little ***** to Hal Jordan to prop up silver age nostalgia? Get outta here.



    No one is complaining with group shots of Hal at the center, so please leave the other lanterns alone when they are at the center.

    Corps Solidarity:

    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 11-23-2020 at 09:15 AM.

  11. #161
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    this is the Book of Oa, not the book of John v Hal. please take that noise elsewhere before this conversation (inevitably) gets out of hand and mods have to get involved.
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  12. #162
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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  13. #163
    Mighty Member Ra-El's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    this is the Book of Oa, not the book of John v Hal. please take that noise elsewhere before this conversation (inevitably) gets out of hand and mods have to get involved.
    Seconded. We have appreciation threads for that.

  14. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    I like Bendis's idea of the Guardians being these sentient wisps of fire and flame--goes nicely with the Lantern theme.



    Their present day iteration should do this but be re-colored the appropriate green. Just more visually striking.
    I can see these Guardians going evil and trying to wipe out all sentient GL like the old normal Guardians ended up doing .

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    LOL, writers shilling characters.
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

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