Wonder Woman Future State books announced

[Agent Z]

Yes it does, she's Queen of Venturia, her costume reflects Egyptian, Viking and Atlantean influences

Clea has nothing to do with Egypt or the Vikings and most of the Atlanteans we've seen in the DCU don't dress like her.

and for all we know it could be business attire there.

And for all we know it isn't. Since Venturia gets very little focus and development

You can be scary and taken seriously in clothing that shows off a lot of skin, look at MMA fighters for instance.

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Once again, context matters. MMA fighters don't deal with people with swords. Clea does and she puts herself at grave risk every time she faces Diana while dressed like that.

[Agent Z]

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This is not someone I'd want angry with me. You can focus on her metal bra if you want to, but you might miss her giant trident and the evil look in her eyes.

Take away the trident and there isn't anything remotely intimidating about her. If I wanted to be charitable, I'd say the reason she's wearing a metal bra is as a distraction because otherwise, she isn't very threatening at all.

[Koriand'r]

Clea has nothing to do with Egypt or the Vikings and most of the Atlanteans we've seen in the DCU don't dress like her.



And for all we know it isn't. Since Venturia gets very little focus and development



Once again, context matters. MMA fighters don't deal with people with swords. Clea does and she puts herself at grave risk every time she faces Diana while dressed like that.

Why would she be more at risk in her outfit than Diana is in hers? What about Red Sonja? She wears even less clothing and it's never been a problem for her either.

[Koriand'r]

Take away the trident and there isn't anything remotely intimidating about her. If I wanted to be charitable, I'd say the reason she's wearing a metal bra is as a distraction because otherwise, she isn't very threatening at all.

Hence why so many female comic book characters dress in revealing outfits, clearly it's a distraction that leads to an opponent getting their ass kicked. You can't underestimate people based on what they're wearing, you do so at your own peril.

[PopQuezy]

Hence why so many female comic book characters dress in revealing outfits, clearly it's a distraction that leads to an opponent getting their ass kicked. You can't underestimate people based on what they're wearing, you do so at your own peril.

But the conversation doesn't seem to be about underestimating people, but whether or not, the person can be taken seriously by the viewing public. Speaking for myself, I could never take Cheetah seriously in a lot of her depictions because of the way artists drew her with a mixture of sexy woman in cheetah makeup and Pantene model.

Similarly, the metal bra may make it difficult for the viewing audience to take Queen Clea seriously. To me, she looks more like a late 1980s Madonna competitor thatn a serious threat for a demi-goddess. There's a balance between personality, memorable iconography, and even sex appeal. That Queen Clea design, I would argue, does not reach that balance.

[Koriand'r]

But the conversation doesn't seem to be about underestimating people, but whether or not, the person can be taken seriously by the viewing public. Speaking for myself, I could never take Cheetah seriously in a lot of her depictions because of the way artists drew her with a mixture of sexy woman in cheetah makeup and Pantene model.

Similarly, the metal bra may make it difficult for the viewing audience to take Queen Clea seriously. To me, she looks more like a late 1980s Madonna competitor thatn a serious threat for a demi-goddess. There's a balance between personality, memorable iconography, and even sex appeal. That Queen Clea design, I would argue, does not reach that balance.

When I grew up you could be young, beautiful and jiggly yet still be taken seriously on a team of private investigators. Lynda Carter herself helped make Wonder Woman an icon even with her massive, heaving, bosom. You could be dripping in diamonds and wearing an evening dress while smoking a cigarette in a holder yet still be seen as an aggressive oil magnate that people were wary of. Or even be a petite old lady that ruled the California wine country with an iron hand that people feared due to her utter ruthlessness. Heroism nor villainy come in a certain package or with a dress code.

[Agent Z]

Hence why so many female comic book characters dress in revealing outfits, clearly it's a distraction that leads to an opponent getting their ass kicked. You can't underestimate people based on what they're wearing, you do so at your own peril.

That is most certainly not the reason most of them dress that way.

Why would she be more at risk in her outfit than Diana is in hers?

She isn't as strong, fast or durable as Diana for starters.

What about Red Sonja? She wears even less clothing and it's never been a problem for her either.

Sonja's outfit has received scrutiny as well.

Heroism nor villainy come in a certain package or with a dress code.

And yet for the longest time, it seems like superhero comics, felt that revealing outfits were almost exclusively for women.

It is only until recently that superhero comics have started to make your stance a reality when it comes to character designs.

[Koriand'r]

That is most certainly not the reason most of them dress that way.



She isn't as strong, fast or durable as Diana for starters.



Sonja's outfit has received scrutiny as well.



And yet for the longest time, it seems like superhero comics, felt that revealing outfits were almost exclusively for women.

It is only until recently that superhero comics have started to make your stance a reality when it comes to character designs.

These are comic books, everyone has an impossibly built physique and great hair. It's fantasy, it's not real, they're drawn pictures, no one is being mistreated because an outfit is too revealing. The world is a big, scary place full of bad things like killer viruses and the stupid people that ignore the killer virus. If someone wants to escape to somewhere fun and exciting where good guys fight bad in colorful costumes it shouldn't be ruined by naysayers foisting their *often dubious* real world morality onto fictional characters.

[Agent Z]

These are comic books, everyone has an impossibly built physique and great hair.

That part is not what is being discussed here.

It's fantasy, it's not real, they're drawn pictures, no one is being mistreated because an outfit is too revealing. The world is a big, scary place full of bad things like killer viruses and the stupid people that ignore the killer virus.

Are you seriously arguing we shouldn't complain about comics because of bad things happening in real life? Because if so, we'd have eliminated at least half the discussions on this site.

If someone wants to escape to somewhere fun and exciting where good guys fight bad in colorful costumes it shouldn't be ruined by naysayers foisting their *often dubious* real world morality onto fictional characters.

What to skimpy outfits have to do with escapism? Shazam is escapism and I don't see anyone running around in a thing there.

[Koriand'r]

That part is not what is being discussed here.




Are you seriously arguing we shouldn't complain about comics because of bad things happening in real life? Because if so, we'd have eliminated at least half the discussions on this site.



What to skimpy outfits have to do with escapism? Shazam is escapism and I don't see anyone running around in a thing there.

Metal bras are fun and always have been!

[Konja7]

What to skimpy outfits have to do with escapism? Shazam is escapism and I don't see anyone running around in a thing there.

It is true skimpy outfits aren't exactly for escapism. However, these exist for the same reason that escapism exists. As part of (male) readers enjoyment.

[Gaius]

It's a shame this is pretty accurate, because I love Clea and Zara's designs in the Golden Age.

Jimenez or Perez could draw them faithfully without getting gratuitous with it, but we can't be confident most other artists would.

Reminds me of how I’ve seen some say they prefer the movie/Rebirth WW suit because it’s harder to sexualize than the classic swimsuit but I’m pretty sure most comic artists could make a Catholic nun like look a pinup girl so not sure how true that is.

[Artemisfanboy]

Generally, most arguments against cheesecake/fanservice come off as coming from a place of negative attitudes towards sexual liberation and general sex negativity. Which is also the feeling I'm getting here as well. I don't feel there's anything inherently wrong with fanservice or cheesecake and there shouldn't be any need to be ashamed of or to apologize for it.

But if we really want to get into rationalizing Clea's choice of dress, Clea doesn't have much of bibliography. Just her Golden Age story, her appearance with Golden Age villainy Inc, and the Jimenez run. In both her Golden Age Story and the Jimenez run she's Queen, of Ventura in the Golden Age and in Jimenez run she's taken over Skataris. So you could see the bikini and skirt as her lounging around her throne room outfit. Maybe she'd were something else if she was actually planning to lead her army into battle her self. Then again she might be the type of ruler to prefer to sit in her throne room.

If we were to talk about designing some new outfits for her to possibly wear while in a more active combat role, I might take some inspiration from Mera's outfits ato tie her in with Aquaman's Atlantis, which is a logical idea.

[Dipter]

Conan the Barbarian sword fights people in nothing but a loin cloth and boots, but nobody ever complains about practicality with him. There’s certainly a double standard, which can be blamed on our puritanical society for making the female body so taboo in the first place.

[Psy-lock]

Practicality shouldn't even be a serious topic when it comes to superhero/supervillain costumes. None of them are practical: