DC Future State

[Fergus]

Is drawing Damian as visibly mixed considered giving a character strong ties? I don't remember reading anything about Damian's cultural heritage in China or North Africa. Aside from making a character look visibly mixed, making storyline based on their heritage also stops people from whitewashing them.

Like Priest did with Rose Wilson, he went so deep into her Hmong/Cambodian heritage that I can't imagine another writer completely ignoring that part of her character.

Drawing a character visibly mixed isn't the same as giving them strong ties to their roots which is why I did not make any such claims.

See my response to Korath or go read the TT annual where Damian is given strong ties to his Middle eastern heritage

[Fergus]

With Damian it's kinda weird to try and connect him to his Middle Eastern heritage because it doesn't seem that Ra's or the League of Assassins follow those traditions. Sure, we see panels of Ra's deep in meditation with candles burning or whatever, and it sorta evokes a "Asian/Eastern/something not Western" aesthetic, but far as I know Ra's and his followers don't follow any specific "real" heritage or cultural traditions, and instead have their own culture that's maybe grown out of whatever region Ra's originally came from but long ago became its own unique thing.

I'm not saying Damian shouldn't have any interest or connections to his heritage at all, but this kid didn't grow up surrounded by those things, he grew up in the culture of the League of Assassins and that seems to be a very different thing from what we'd recognize as the culture of....wherever Ra's is originally from?

TT Annual by Glass has Damian narrate how he doesn't feel at home anywhere in Gotham aside from a small Middle eastern Inn that houses refugees and specialises in traditional middle Eastern dishes.

It pulls out all the stops to have Damian associate and make it clear to the reader that he identifies as Middle Eastern. The language, the tradition, the food, the smells and the sounds. he embraces it all. It makes a point of Damian identifying as Middle eastern.

[Frontier]

When Damian was introduced wasn't he intentionally meant to look like a mini Bruce? Like Morrison wanted it to be clear he was almost like a visual clone of a young Bruce. So I don't think it really factored into their creation of him to make him look more Eastern or anything. Since they wanted his introduction to be more uncomfortable, but maybe I'm remembering it wrong. Been a long time since I read those early stories.

Yeah, I think there is a very good chance that Yara becomes the new Wonder Girl. The reception to her has been the most positive I think out of all the new characters, and it feels like she has a clear path given Damian's generation doesn't have a Wonder Girl character in it. It is funny how new female costumes can carry so much weight with the public. You don't see that with male characters much anymore where a big costume change can drive sales or even make a character relevant. Though in the last handful of years we've gotten Burnside Batgirl, Spider-Gwen, Gwenpool, Harley's new costumes, maybe Ms Marvel a bit, and even throw in Jessica Cruz in there maybe that fans latch onto.

Not to mention Punchline.

[Badou]

Not to mention Punchline.

Oh yeah, Punchline. I knew I was forgetting another recent one.

[Ascended]

TT Annual by Glass has Damian narrate how he doesn't feel at home anywhere in Gotham aside from a small Middle eastern Inn that houses refugees and specialises in traditional middle Eastern dishes.

It pulls out all the stops to have Damian associate and make it clear to the reader that he identifies as Middle Eastern. The language, the tradition, the food, the smells and the sounds. he embraces it all. It makes a point of Damian identifying as Middle eastern.

Interesting.

Well, good for Glass I guess. I've no issue with Damian identifying as middle eastern, but this sounds a little forced to me. I'm no expert on the League of Assassins but have they ever actually been shown to follow actual middle eastern tradition and culture? I'm pretty sure they haven't, and the fact that they're a collective of eco-terrorist killers goes against a lot of cultural teachings, from what I know of those regions.

The food and language, yeah that makes some sense as I'm sure Ra's carried all those sensibilities with him when building the LoA. The wider culture though? Sounds like DC trying a little too hard to show it's diversity at the cost of internal logic. If Damian grew up in the LoA and identifies with middle eastern culture, then DC is saying that middle eastern culture is accurately reflected by a murder cult.

[Frontier]

Has Dick being Romani come up recently? I don't think anyone other than Tim Seeley has mentioned it.

[skyvolt2000]

TT Annual by Glass has Damian narrate how he doesn't feel at home anywhere in Gotham aside from a small Middle eastern Inn that houses refugees and specialises in traditional middle Eastern dishes.

It pulls out all the stops to have Damian associate and make it clear to the reader that he identifies as Middle Eastern. The language, the tradition, the food, the smells and the sounds. he embraces it all. It makes a point of Damian identifying as Middle eastern.

What else? It has to be more than a TT annual that once again most folks have not read.

The wider culture though? Sounds like DC trying a little too hard to show it's diversity at the cost of internal logic. If Damian grew up in the LoA and identifies with middle eastern culture, then DC is saying that middle eastern culture is accurately reflected by a murder cult.

And to toss in a larger net-what does it say that DC is doing this with Damian and there is no push back to it. Yet WHAT did see over at Marvel when they did that with middle eastern/Muslim/asian characters?

Ms Marvel had her book set on fire and others things because someone said "How dare Marvel try to show those people as normal humans." Stuff that is still going on today even with someone doing a FAILED crowd campaign on saying "support my book so we can show the world we don't need the likes of Ms Marvel."

Yet here Dc is pandering a stereotype with Batman's kid.

[Aahz]

TT Annual by Glass has Damian narrate how he doesn't feel at home anywhere in Gotham aside from a small Middle eastern Inn that houses refugees and specialises in traditional middle Eastern dishes.

It pulls out all the stops to have Damian associate and make it clear to the reader that he identifies as Middle Eastern. The language, the tradition, the food, the smells and the sounds. he embraces it all. It makes a point of Damian identifying as Middle eastern.

Yeah, but that doesn't really match how and where Damian was raised, which was iirc on some remote island with teachers from all over the world.

Cassandra Cain is actually a similar case, since she also doesn't really has any connection to an Asian culture.

[Frontier]

This kind of reminds me of Halo from Young Justice: Outsiders still wearing a hijab even though she didn't identify as Muslim, since she was basically possessing the body of a dead Muslim girl.

[Konja7]

Yeah, but that doesn't really match how and where Damian was raised, which was iirc on some remote island with teachers from all over the world.

Cassandra Cain is actually a similar case, since she also doesn't really has any connection to an Asian culture.

Yeah. However, in Cass case, people don't forget she is a minority, because she looks Asian.

In Damian's case, he's often drawn as a white kid (since DC wants the mini-Bruce aspect). So, it is easier for readers to forget he is a minority too.

[OopsIdiditagain]

What else? It has to be more than a TT annual that once again most folks have not read.



And to toss in a larger net-what does it say that DC is doing this with Damian and there is no push back to it. Yet WHAT did see over at Marvel when they did that with middle eastern/Muslim/asian characters?

Ms Marvel had her book set on fire and others things because someone said "How dare Marvel try to show those people as normal humans." Stuff that is still going on today even with someone doing a FAILED crowd campaign on saying "support my book so we can show the world we don't need the likes of Ms Marvel."

Yet here Dc is pandering a stereotype with Batman's kid.

I'm confused? I thought Ms Marvel was praised for it's humane representation of Muslim Characters?

[OopsIdiditagain]

This kind of reminds me of Halo from Young Justice: Outsiders still wearing a hijab even though she didn't identify as Muslim, since she was basically possessing the body of a dead Muslim girl.

Halo was such a weird case. It's like they wanted the best of both worlds with her. "Let's make a character that looks Muslim and is a refugee but rejects that part of themselves completely and acts like it's an entirely different person".

[Frontier]

Halo was such a weird case. It's like they wanted the best of both worlds with her. "Let's make a character that looks Muslim and is a refugee but rejects that part of themselves completely and acts like it's an entirely different person".

And then she told Brion she might be non-binary, which never went anywhere. Like, I liked Violet on the show, but sometimes it felt like they were just trying to check off a lot of boxes without thinking it through...

[Holt]

Speaking of, has it been mentioned what, if anything, is being done with Simon Baz? I know the solicit for the Future State GL book mentions Guy and Jessica (in addition to John obviously being the star), but I don't remember Simon or Kyle being mentioned anywhere.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

Speaking of, has it been mentioned what, if anything, is being done with Simon Baz? I know the solicit for the Future State GL book mentions Guy and Jessica (in addition to John obviously being the star), but I don't remember Simon or Kyle being mentioned anywhere.

I thought Simon died in "Heroes in Crisis"?