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  1. #1
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Default High & Low: Where do they rank?

    So, on my vacation I watched some of the High & Low movies (partly to practice my Japanese - fail, it's waaaay too colloquial - and partly for fun). Given the kind of insane crap the characters go through, I'm curious to run some of them through a gauntlet and see where they land (roughly).

    For the purpose of this thread, we're going to look at three of the characters in comparison to Everyone Else™:

    1. Kohaku, former leader of Mugen;
    2. Masaki Amamiya;
    3. Hiroto Amamiya.

    I'm choosing these three because they seem to be roughly at the top of the pecking order in High&Low, and all three are billed as being roughly equal in ability.

    High & Low is spare of feats, but I'll do a rundown of what I've seen thus far, working up the presentation/feat ladder.

    *Some Vague Spoilers Ahead*

    1. The ordinary members of the gangs - ie, no-name people - regularly get in fights with each other using stuff like metal baseball bats, 2 x 4's, telescoping batons, and the like. They fight for extended periods, beating each other up with these things, bottles, their fists, etc.

    2. The higher level characters (name-level) basically one-punch these guys. Or pick them up and throw them around. As an example, a couple of name-level characters from the White Rascals (Kaito and Kizzy) beat up 10-12 members of Doubt, all of the Doubt guys armed with pipes and bats (High & Low season 2, episode five, below). It's easy for them. DTC (Dan, Tetsu, and Chiharu) often take on 6:1 odds and manage fine. This happens all. The. Time.

    3. The higher level characters take hits from metal baseball bats and such from the 'normal' gang members and basically keep on trucking. Some of them just ignore the hits, only taking a dramatic pause to look really angry. This happens too many times to count. Even bad hits - Chiharu taking multiple shots from metal bats, Chiharu being one of the smallest guys around, THEN taking a metal pipe in the jaw in slow motion, with flying blood and so forth...and he comes back and beats all crap out of more guys (High & Low, Season one, detailed below).

    4. The higher level characters fight for extended - like, REALLY extended - periods against each other, beating each other bloody with and without weapons, throwing each other through plate glass windows, smashing up the scenery with each other, hitting each other WITH the scenery, weapons, fists, kicks, etc. These fights drag on for minutes on end. Characters get mangled, absolutely ruined, and get up to fight more. One of the best examples of this is Ranmaru versus Rocky, High & Low: End of Sky, detailed below.

    5. Gang leaders are CLEARLY stronger than the name-level characters. People like Cobra, Rocky, Smokey, Murayama all basically beat hell out of name-level characters, or toy with them. The name-levels are good enough to fight back, but there's clearly a jump from them to the Gang Leaders.

    Now we get into the three characters listed above.

    6. The Amamiya brothers literally take on a hundred or so of the above 'normal' gang members and beat all shit out of them without really getting hurt. They hit these guys and send them flying 10' through the air, beat them up in groups at the same time, never get hit, that kind of thing.

    7. The Amamiya brothers take on name-level characters, sometimes more than one at a time, and pretty much whip their rears. The other guys make a fight of it, but the outcome isn't in doubt unless it's someone billed as an absolute top-tier fighter. Even then? They lose (thus far, I've not yet seen the final movie). The Amamiya brothers take on Gang Leaders + name-level characters at the same time, and beat them down.

    8. Kohaku is the only regular guy considered to be the equal of the Amamiya brothers (Ice, a sort of new character, takes one of them on, still waiting to see the rematch as the fight is called due to a situational thing). He runs evenly fighting with Masaki Amamiya, whereas Cobra (gang-leader), Tsukumo (gang-leader level, easily), and Yamato (a very strong name-level character) basically get beat down.

    9. The Amamiyas go up against dudes with firearms, and basically wade through crowds of them (like, twenty guys with guns out), aim-dodging (yep, explicitly shown), using the shooters as shields from each other, controlling the shooting such that the shooters shoot each other, disarming them in groups (casually), etc. It's really not a big deal for them, so long as they don't start at a long distance.

    10. Just as a small nod to their damage soak, someone billed as being slightly better than them basically stands in front of about a dozen guys armed with pistols and smgs, gets shot full of holes while shooting back with his pistol, and kills the lot of the goons before collapsing.

    11. Tsukumo (call him Gang-Leader, maybe Gang-Leader+) is a guy who gets into car crashes while hanging out the window of a car (and no belt on, obviously). He walks it off (not 'limps', just takes a moment to catch his breath). He then kicks the front side of the car so that the car spins about Edit: 30 degrees (it's a small four-door, as I recall) and knocks over a bunch of people. He does this after spending a loooong time in a coma and still not being 100%. The Amamiya brothers are above him when he's at his best. Kohaku effortlessly dominates him in a fight, taking his best shots while overpowering him with strength (at a time when he's kicking cars to spin them and knock people over).

    12. Kohaku, in fact, takes on Tsukumo, Cobra (one of the gang leaders), and Yamato (billed as physically one of the strongest characters, who tosses people around like toys) at the same time. Even against three top-tiers of the series, he basically wins a rough fight (no spoilers as to how it actually turns out). During this fight he outmuscles them all at the same time, tosses them around one-handed, kicks them so that they slide 10' along the ground, that sort of thing. With that in mind, when Kohaku and Tsukumo, Cobra, and Yamato fight against the Amamiyas, the foursome is LOSING the fight, whereas when Kohaku fights against one of the Amamiyas, alone, it's basically a draw (the math actually works out: Kohaku + Trio < Two Amamiyas).

    13. Fun feat: Kohaku and Masaki Amamiya are in a van that goes over the side of a bridge. AFTER it goes over the side, the two of them run up the near-vertical floor of the van as it's falling (Masaki starts in the driver's seat), jump, and both manage to catch the edge of the bridge.

    13. Kohaku takes hits from a guy who punches through metal pipes and cracks concrete walls. And just looks angry and keeps fighting.

    Sample feats, with more listed in the posts below.

    Hiroto Amamiya, in a dust-up with a half-dozen gang members, beats the crap out of them while chatting on the phone with his brother. At one point he punches one of them - remember, he's not actually trying hard - in the face such that the other guy spins 270 degrees in the air and lands flat on the ground.

    Cobra, potentially the central character who is nonetheless NOT on the same level as the Amamiya brothers or Kohaku (proven in fights with them), gets captured by the Yakuza. They string his wrists up and leave him like that on his knees. They then take turns swinging for home runs on his ribs with 3' long metal pipes, occasionally taking a detour to whack him on the head in a similar fashion. This continues over an extended stretch of time (it's not 3-4 hits, they go on like this for a few minutes). It really messes him up, but he doesn't end up with broken ribs or anything of the sort, and is seemingly okay to fight a day or two later.

    Kohaku, Tsukumo, and the Amamiya brothers end up in a deserted factory with endless waves of Yakuza armed with short swords trying to kill them. They split up into two groups and fight their way out, with swarms of men attacking them with swords. None of them get cut through this mess as they beat large numbers of people unconscious. At one point, Kohaku picks up a large wooden pallet and forces back a group of about six people, using it as a ram. Masaki then running-jumps over his head, kicking through the pallet such that it basically explodes; it and all of the half-dozen people it is holding off are sent flying.

    A mixed group of gang people are fighting against the Yakuza. Kohaku notes that one of the Rude Boys - Takeshi - needs to get from point A to B, but has about five Yakuza in his face. He picks up a downed fighter by the belt, and throws them underhanded at the group. The person hits the ground, skids about 20' (!!!) and bowls over the Yakuza members. Kohaku then makes a stirrup of his hands, shouting at Takeshi to come. Takeshi, a parkour demon, comes running over, puts his foot in Kohaku's hands, and jumps as Kohaku throws him. It sends him flipping and spinning over 20' up in the air (and quite a bit lengthwise).

    Genji - superhuman Yakuza character - falls 30-40' to concrete and just gets back up again like it's nothing. He falls off of speeding cars and hops to his feet. He tanks hits from Kohaku just fine. He cuts stuff he shouldn't cut with his Katana (stabbing it straight through ~1/4" steel, for example, or slicing through heavy chains that are just hanging there). He slams people into concrete walls and creates small craters, punches through iron pipes without effort, etc. The Amamiya brothers take him on and, in a well-choreographed display of teamwork, use a lot of baiting and blind-side attacking to work him over (wolfpack techniques). It still doesn't really put him down (despite their showcased hitting power), and he starts landing hits with his Katana. Masaki comes up with the idea of wrapping chains around his shin and arm for protection as well as greater impact, Hiroto follows suit, and they promptly beat this guy down despite his amazing durability.
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 11-10-2020 at 10:58 AM.

  2. #2
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Default High and Low: Red Rain

    Can't edit any more, due to post length. This is turning into a bit of a respect thread, almost - I should tidy it up. With that in mind, feats from High and Low: Red Rain in this post.

    *Warning: Contains Spoilers*

    Hiroto and Masaki head into the den of a bunch of guys who have stolen something from them. Obviously there's going to be a fight, and there is - Hiroto and Masaki against about fifteen dudes armed with metal pipes. Needless to say, this is an extremely slow Tuesday for the Amamiya brothers and they handle it with the gravitas it deserves - the beating is laid down with an utterly insousciant air, Masaki at one point taking out two knife-armed dudes while lounging on a bar stool (yes, lounging). He looks over to where Hiroto is out-muscling a couple of guys, and gives him a 'aren't you finished yet?' look. Hiroto finds this exasperating, grabs one of the guys, starts running toward Misaki dragging the guy behind him (the guy is also running...more staggering, really), and then hurls the guy at Misaki one-handed. The guy is lofted into the air, flies at the startled Misaki (who dodges), over the bar, and smashes into the back of the bar headfirst, still over five feet off the ground (clearly not so much on his way down yet). Entire flight distance: probably around 10', and the guy looked to be about halfway through his trip. Also, like everything else in the fight, done 100% effortlessly.

    Masaki gives Hiroto a "Hoi!" and Hiroto basically giggles (Hiroto is super-serious, and this is as close as he comes to giggling).

    It's interesting that when people pull knives on the regular name-level guys, it's considered to be of note. Doesn't stop the name-level character from beating all hell out of those people if they're a nobody, but they're treated with more care. Masaki and Hiroto treat knife-armed assailants with the same indifference as they do everyone else, and often simply yoink the knife before tossing the attacker down the stairs or whatever. Large groups of blade-armed people make them nervous, mind (like huge crowds of yakuza armed with short swords), though their older brother still seems to find such things a mild workout, if that.

    Watching Misaki almost pee himself laughing when Aiki puts a pink seat on Hiroto's motorcycle is certainly a high point.

    Guns - five guys surprise Hiroto and Masaki, surrounding them and pointing pistols at them at close range, pistols all fully cocked. Hiroto and Masaki strip the pistols away from them in an instant while beating them up, and not a single person gets a shot off (Masaki takes three, Hiroto two). The scene is shot with parts speeded up and parts slowed down, and the yakuza members are basically blitzed. What's shown is that the Amamiya brothers are simply too fast for them. Again, it's a nothing for them to do this, and a few moments later they do the same to a couple of other guys, using a yakuza guy as a shield to get close enough then just moving in, disarming, and beating down the gunmen without a single shot fired.

    More guns - Hiroto and Masaki crash through windows into a foyer, landing on either side of a group of Yakuza armed with a variety of firearms (mostly pistols, but at least a couple of AR-15 style automatic rifles). The Yakuza are somewhat spread out, some are on a staircase, and there are twenty of them pointing their weapons at the double doors through which the Amamiyas were expected to enter. There's a dramatic, slo-mo pause. Then the Amamiyas are all over them, grabbing hands and redirecting gunfire, using the men as shields from each other even as they beat them down, even explicitly aim-dodging some close-range shots (deking out of the line of fire just as the guy shoots). The scene is done in speed-ups and slo-mos, with some fast cuts, and the whole idea is that the Amamiyas are blitzing these guys and using their own guns to kill them. Accurately, sometimes shooting at people out of their line of sight (the Amamiyas, while not using firearms, have shown familiarity with them before, disassembling pistols with a couple of casual movements - it's safe to say they know firearms, despite disliking them). Hiroto finishes the guys still alive after the initial flurry of killing by controlling an automatic rifle and gunning down a bunch of them while Masaki picks off a few others.

    Edit: Guy1 has clips of these later in the thread.

    Sure, it's not perfectly choreographed, but it's not bad, and a decent display of how one might show this kind of thing.
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 11-02-2020 at 09:24 AM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  3. #3
    Rumbles Moderator Guy1's Avatar
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    Note To Self: Check these movies out.
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  4. #4
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy1 View Post
    Note To Self: Check these movies out.
    Start with ‘The Road to High and Low’, which is essentially a VERY condensed look at the series. Then The Movie, then the following movies. Red Rain comes between movies 1 and 2, as I recall. ‘The Worst’ follows all of them.

    DTC is a funny, no-fighting movie featuring some of the characters.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  5. #5
    Rumbles Moderator Guy1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    Start with ‘The Road to High and Low’, which is essentially a VERY condensed look at the series. Then The Movie, then the following movies. Red Rain comes between movies 1 and 2, as I recall. ‘The Worst’ follows all of them.

    DTC is a funny, no-fighting movie featuring some of the characters.
    I have been wondering about the proper order, thank you.

    As of right now, I'm watching a playthrough of Little Hope, because Halloween, but High And Low has been on my list for awhile to be sure!

    It had my curiosity. Now it has my attention.
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    Extraordinary Member Iron_Twister's Avatar
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    ...Yay, High & Low gets some talk here.

    But yeah, the series is...Kinda crazy.

    Reminds me how Murayama, one of the SWORD leaders, gets strucked 100 times in an endurance test for leadership, and then proceeds to single handily beat up everyone after that.

    ...I mean he's no monster like Kohaku or the Amamiya brothers but yeah, the top fighters in the series are ridiculously tough (when you get Yamato literally bending metal pipes with his punches and kicks).

  7. #7
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron_Twister View Post
    ...Yay, High & Low gets some talk here.

    But yeah, the series is...Kinda crazy.
    It's basically a live-action gang-fighting manga. ^_^ Characters are blatantly superhuman.

    Reminds me how Murayama, one of the SWORD leaders, gets strucked 100 times in an endurance test for leadership, and then proceeds to single handily beat up everyone after that.

    ...I mean he's no monster like Kohaku or the Amamiya brothers but yeah, the top fighters in the series are ridiculously tough (when you get Yamato literally bending metal pipes with his punches and kicks).
    Yeah. Murayama is one of the top, non-monster characters in the series (also happens to be the somewhat amusing 'wild man', and his 'Cha-cha' moment in End of Sky is awesome). Rocky, Murayama, and Cobra - three leaders of SWORD - for my money are the top guys of the second tier (I would include Hyuga, but he really doesn't do a lot).

    Murayama allows 100 'normal' gang guys to punch him in the face. Then he goes on to beat all heck out a ton of people after that (he also has sundry other feats of beating all hell out of people).

    Cobra beats Murayama in a fight, though it's close. This on top of Cobra's many, many other feats, some of which are noted above. Plus, I love Cobra's fighting style - see a lot of judo mixed into the hitting.

    Rocky...cripes, I'm hard-pressed to think of someone who takes more damage than Rocky and still wins his fight (End of Sky). He gets beat up by guys with bats, gets choked, thrown through plate glass, has his hand stabbed through with a broken bottle...at one point, Ranmaru clubs him in the head with a 2' long wrench while two other guys hold him. Rocky still comes back and wrecks Ranmaru's shit (I swear, End of Sky has the best mob fight of the series, and that's saying something).

    Plus, the intro scene in Road to High&Low for the Rascals with Rocky is just awesome. ^_^ Favourite character, for me.

    And none of these three are on the same level as Kohaku or the Amamiya brothers (I'm not even getting into the eldest Amamiya brother).

    It's important to point out that, as you say, Yamato (second string, just under Cobra), who is known for strength rather than skill, punches iron pipes and bends them. He punches Kohaku in the face, full-bore. Kohaku finds this annoying and proceeds to over-power Yamato, Cobra, and Tsukumo at the same time (Tsukumo being a guy who Captain America's a car to knock over people around said car).

    I'm rewatching everything and maaaaan, seeing so much more.
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 10-30-2020 at 07:14 PM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

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    Rumbles Moderator Guy1's Avatar
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    Alrighty! I've got popcorn and I...borrowed some of Stark's booze (Blame Wade!). Time to watch Road!

    Thanks for the recommendation Sharp!
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    Rumbles Moderator Guy1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharpandpointies View Post
    Can't edit any more, due to post length. This is turning into a bit of a respect thread, almost - I should tidy it up. With that in mind, feats from High and Low: Red Rain in this post.

    Hiroto and Masaki head into the den of a bunch of guys who have stolen something from them. Obviously there's going to be a fight, and there is - Hiroto and Masaki against about fifteen dudes armed with metal pipes. Needless to say, this is an extremely slow Tuesday for the Amamiya brothers and they handle it with the gravitas it deserves - the beating is laid down with an utterly insousciant air, Masaki at one point taking out two knife-armed dudes while lounging on a bar stool (yes, lounging). He looks over to where Hiroto is out-muscling a couple of guys, and gives him a 'aren't you finished yet?' look. Hiroto finds this exasperating, grabs one of the guys, starts running toward Misaki dragging the guy behind him (the guy is also running...more staggering, really), and then hurls the guy at Misaki one-handed. The guy is lofted into the air, flies at the startled Misaki (who dodges), over the bar, and smashes into the back of the bar headfirst, still over five feet off the ground (clearly not so much on his way down yet). Entire flight distance: probably around 10', and the guy looked to be about halfway through his trip. Also, like everything else in the fight, done 100% effortlessly.

    Masaki gives Hiroto a "Hoi!" and Hiroto basically giggles (Hiroto is super-serious, and this is as close as he comes to giggling).

    It's interesting that when people pull knives on the regular name-level guys, it's considered to be of note. Doesn't stop the name-level character from beating all hell out of those people if they're a nobody, but they're treated with more care. Masaki and Hiroto treat knife-armed assailants with the same indifference as they do everyone else, and often simply yoink the knife before tossing the attacker down the stairs or whatever. Large groups of blade-armed people make them nervous, mind (like huge crowds of yakuza armed with short swords), though their older brother still seems to find such things a mild workout, if that.

    Watching Misaki almost pee himself laughing when Aiki puts a pink seat on Hiroto's motorcycle is certainly a high point.
    So how would these guys compare to, say, Ip Man?
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  10. #10
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Enjoy! Road is okay, it sets the story. It's the series, condensed (wish I had the series, myself).

    The movies is where the really good stuff starts, though 'Road' has some great series scenes in it (White Rascals intro springs to mind, along with Rocky to Smoky 'I'm here to kill you' scene at the drug factory).

    Also, awesome soundtrack in general. ^_^
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 10-30-2020 at 07:17 PM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  11. #11
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy1 View Post
    So how would these guys compare to, say, Ip Man?
    Honestly, they should at least be equal to him. Kohaku is easily tougher and stronger than Ip Man, if not as skilled, and the Amamiya brothers are in the same range of power/skill as Ip Man. They're not as fancy, but their casual domination of skilled superhuman fighters and the ridiculous speed/strength/toughness feats they have should at least put them in the same range. They also have that 'the two of them beat all crap out of 100+ people who are above normal, real-world humans' feat to boot.

    Red Rain really makes a point about the Amamiyas and their freakish ability, and End of Sky and Final Mission show off some insane feats for the top characters (Kohkau and the Amamiyas).
    Last edited by Sharpandpointies; 10-30-2020 at 07:16 PM.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

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    Extraordinary Member Iron_Twister's Avatar
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    Well, seeing how it is part of the backstory. Here's basically the Amamiya bros taking on Mugen.



    Basically, the Mugen mooks are floored, the other main members (Cobra, Yamato, and Tsukumo) didn't make much of a dent, and Kohaku is the only one who is honestly a monster enough to go toe to toe rather easily.

    ...Yeah, the bros and Kohaku are honestly the top in a cast of really tough SOBs.

    I honestly feel a little bad that Smokey (who beat Yamato fairly easily) ultimately doesn't do much compared to the other SWORD leaders for mostly justified reasons once you learn more about why.

  13. #13
    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron_Twister View Post
    Well, seeing how it is part of the backstory. Here's basically the Amamiya bros taking on Mugen.



    Basically, the Mugen mooks are floored, the other main members (Cobra, Yamato, and Tsukumo) didn't make much of a dent, and Kohaku is the only one who is honestly a monster enough to go toe to toe rather easily.

    ...Yeah, the bros and Kohaku are honestly the top in a cast of really tough SOBs.

    I honestly feel a little bad that Smokey (who beat Yamato fairly easily) ultimately doesn't do much compared to the other SWORD leaders for mostly justified reasons once you learn more about why.
    Given how easily Smokey toys with Yamato (who in fairness likely wasn’t up for a fight), he should be at least on the same level as Muruyama.
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

  14. #14
    Extraordinary Member Iron_Twister's Avatar
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    A Murayama scene...Cause why not?



    But right, we got guys blocking metal pipes swung at them with their bare hands with none of them being worse for wear.

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    The Weeping Mod Sharpandpointies's Avatar
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    Nice! One of my two favourite Murayama scenes (the other one being his scene with Hyuga right before this one)!

    Why does Oya High arrive EVERYWHERE by driving their truck through everything? . I swear, movie after movie....
    Why Are We Here?, by Pendaran

    "...the Myths Transformed version of the legendarium, in which the Moon is Melkor's attempt to make his own Arda with blackjack and hookers." - Estrecca

    "...dropping an orca whale made of fire on your enemies is a pretty strong opening move." - Nik Hasta

    "[Kent] Nelson was nearly invariably presented as the guy who, barring the Spectre, made everyone else generally gasp and go "Doctor Fate don't shiv, he balls nasty.", even Superman." - Pendaran

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