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  1. #16
    Mighty Member Bat-Meal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    If Kate's sister is evil right now, go ahead and reform her because I hate evil siblings as a general rule. But since I'm not following, I don't care that much.
    Not a villain at the moment, Kate is her carer now - since even places that aren't Arkham Asylum, in this universe, can't keep their patients safe from abduction/escape. So the sisters live together, and apparently Beth isn't causing problems at this time, and is on medication.

    Beth/Alice was the following under each writer:

    Rucka = Villain
    J.H. Willaims III = Damsel
    Andreyko = Anti-hero
    Bennet = Damsel

    Which leads us to where the character is currently Kate's ward, but we did see Alice in a non-cannon story a little while ago where she made IMO a great villain.

  2. #17
    Incredible Member OopsIdiditagain's Avatar
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    Catwoman - femme fatale who while not completely villainous doesn't reform
    OP characters make me itch

  3. #18
    Incredible Member regg215's Avatar
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    1.I would love to see Catwoman completely reform and become a legit superhero. She will always keep her edge but I think it would be cool to see.
    2. Man-Bat- Really prefer langstrom as a tragic figure, appreciate when dc has him attempting to redeem himself
    3. I think that seeing Mr. Freeze Redeemed would be a good idea for some reason

    4- Joker, Ivy, Harley, Riddler, Penguin and Ra's should always be evil and not be reformed, they are uninteresting to me as anything but villains, tragic figures but villains
    5. Clayface and Killer Croc as misunderstood figures who are treated like monsters and react to that, they should have their good moments but always stay as dangerous characters
    "You know, there are some words I've known since I was a schoolboy: "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably.. The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged"- CAPT. Picard

  4. #19
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    To me, the two Batman characters that should move on from their status quo or be reformed are Cat Flipflopping woman & Mr. My Wife Freeze.

  5. #20

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    I like Ventriliquest the way BTAS handled it. It'd be nice to give the doctors at arkham asylum some kind of victory as far as medicating and reforming their patients. If only in a broken watch still gotta be right sometime.

  6. #21
    Mighty Member Bat-Meal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpaqueGiraffe17 View Post
    It'd be nice to give the doctors at arkham asylum some kind of victory as far as medicating and reforming their patients. If only in a broken watch still gotta be right sometime.
    Oh, that's a good idea. It'd certainly be a nice change.

  7. #22
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    I want Ventriloquist and Alice to get help and become non-criminals. Man-Bat should be Batfam again. I love Detective Riddler and Secret Six Bane. I prefer Ivy to be an anti-villain.
    "Everything doesn't have to be about fear. There's room in our line of work for hope, too"- Stephanie Brown, Batgirl Vol 3 #5

    "Quit? Like hell I will"- Bette Kane, Beast Boy #3

  8. #23
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    Mr.Freeze deserves a real shot at redemption.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by regg215 View Post
    4- Joker, Ivy, Harley, Riddler, Penguin and Ra's should always be evil and not be reformed, they are uninteresting to me as anything but villains, tragic figures but villains
    I disagree with the notion that character like Ivy is only interesting as villain. She is interesting because she is a sadistic killer but not comepletely wrong in all the crimes she commits. Her most memorable stories are where she was given more depth (like having soft spot for certain types of humans, a sense of enviromental justice against coporate men). The conflict between her and Batman is more interesting and an idealogical one when Ivy is not potrayed as a plant crazy villain that needs to be put down but rather an enviromentalist that goes at extreme length to protect plant-life and expand her plant tetorrity while Batman is a law enforcer that doesnt want innocents to die. Ivy is more interesting not when she commits morally unjutifiable acts but morally questionable / justifiable evil acts.

    Nevertheless i still like her as a villain against Batman. There are tons of potential good stories for her as a villain against Batman since she is a good contrast to Batman. But to think that her character doesnt have enough depth to be developed into her own character and must stay as a villain against Batman for eternity, i dont see that to be true.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 11-10-2020 at 12:02 PM.

  10. #25
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    Reformed:

    Two-Face, Talia, Nyssa, Catwoman, Mr. Freeze, Clayface.

    Unreformed:

    Joker, Ra's al Ghul, Bane, Zsazs

    Unsure:

    Riddler

  11. #26
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    This thread makes me realize that the one thing that makes Harley seen as irredemable is how much she was devoted to the guy she loved while the one thing that makes Catwoman annoying is how many times she flip flops. If Catwoman is devoted to the guy she loves as much as how Harley was devoted to Joker, Selina would have completely reformed a long time ago. The relationship between Harley & Joker was actually an interesting contrast to the relationship between Bat & Cat.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 11-05-2020 at 02:55 AM.

  12. #27
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    The only way to really reform a Bat-foe is to replace her/him with a Bat-foe…like how Punchline replaced Harley Quin.

    If you want to reform Catwoman, then replace her with Alley Cat (an actual foe of Catwoman).
    If you want to reform Poison Ivy, then replace her Honey Suckle (an actual junior Super Foe) …and rename her Queen Ivy.
    If you want to reform Riddler, replace him with Enigma (an actual villainess) or Riddler’s Daughter.

    When an author wants to use X villain in the story, the editor can tell them that Y villain is the substitute.

    In Beware the Batman, Magpie substituted for Catwoman and Anarky substituted for Joker.

    The Bats have 100s of underused villains and villainesses…use them.

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