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  1. #46
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCape View Post
    I could swear that he punched Esidisi at the of the fight combined with the Hamon release. But it has been a while.
    Checked out here, and this is the closest thing to a punch he did in that battle:



    (From Battle Tendency's volume 3)

    Even then, he was just blocking Esidici's hand.

  2. #47
    Spectacular Member JTHM's Avatar
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    Didn't know Peter Parker was part of the Joestar bloodline

  3. #48
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JTHM View Post
    Didn't know Peter Parker was part of the Joestar bloodline
    Imagine the potential of Spidey combining webs with the Ripple man

  4. #49
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I guess one thing Spider-Man has with JoJo is Peter having to outthink or outmaneuever whoever he's fighting when he can't just straight up overpower them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    It's still a problem if it's needed to watch an adaptation to know what's happening in the manga, if both anime and manga have the fight with the same beats, but the anime changed the camera angles to make it easier to understand, but the manga keeps changing it and it's all over the place, making it look very confusing, then the manga still failed at properly showing the fight.

    Anime is anime, manga is manga, while one medium can adapt the other, you should never need one to understand the other.
    And, honestly, I've never really had to rely on an anime or had that much difficulty following manga fights (aside from, I guess, Tokyo Ghoul). It's kind of within the medium of manga to change the camera angle to capture the best impact moment or angle of the fight but I've never really minded it that much.
    You don't have to show everything, whenever Spidey jumped around in old comics, we didn't see him jumping from one point to another, but the effect made it clear that he did.

    Fights are better when it's clear what's going on, just look at any fight from Dragon Ball's manga, Goku got punched away? Another panel will show him recovering from it, and the next one will have him blocking or dodging the next attack, which makes it easier to see the flow of the fight, a bad version of this would skip him recovering and be already in a position to block, or dodge, or worse, attacking back, even though in the previous panel he was flying away.

    Of course, not every detail has to be shown, if one character is attacking, it's not needed to always show him punching, pulling the arm back and punching with the other, and skipping some of those does make the fight have faster pacing, but for the flow of a battle to be good, what's going on in the fight has to be understandable, and some details shouldn't be skipped, specially since mangas like to have such long battles.

    The way I talk about it makes it sound like it's easy, but it really isn't, which is why so many struggle to make the battles work, even when they honestly try.

    I used Dragon Ball as an example, but I'm not saying any battle is expected to be in that level, 'cause frankly, most won't, even if they're great, 'cause Toriyama was fucking excellent at battle flow, just mentioned him as an example of how it can work properly.
    I'm not disagreeing with your points, just your generalization of fights in manga (from my perspective).

  5. #50
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I guess one thing Spider-Man has with JoJo is Peter having to outthink or outmaneuever whoever he's fighting when he can't just straight up overpower them.
    With the difference that Spidey makes way more sense than shit Jojo has, like "If you look into the rainbow you'll turn into a snail!"

    And, honestly, I've never really had to rely on an anime or had that much difficulty following manga fights (aside from, I guess, Tokyo Ghoul). It's kind of within the medium of manga to change the camera angle to capture the best impact moment or angle of the fight but I've never really minded it that much.
    I don't mind the camera angle changes, I only mentioned that as an example in case a manga uses it in a way that the battle looks incomprehensible.

    I'm not disagreeing with your points, just your generalization of fights in manga (from my perspective).
    I've had a time where I for some reason read some random shonen manga, besides the stories being forgettable, the battles weren't impressive looking, not that this means the more popular ones are like that (Though they may be, Dragon Ball Super manga's fights aren't impressive looking at all for the most part), much less most of 'em, but my experience with those I read had the battles being so forgettable I grew numb to it after a while lol.

    Anyways, to get back in topic, my favorite battle in Spidey-related shit is the Symbiote Spidey vs Sinister Six from Spectacular, while there's no quipping and all, the symbiote fights properly like Spidey, using his agility, speed, and making the Sinister Six hit each other, which is a good way to show how he can beat them when they're a team, but also show why they can be threatening solo (Like how Shocker's gauntlet effectively neutralizes Sandman, and Rhino being knocked down by Electro's power), so fun.

  6. #51
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    With the difference that Spidey makes way more sense than shit Jojo has, like "If you look into the rainbow you'll turn into a snail!"
    Well, "Bizarre" is in the title .
    I've had a time where I for some reason read some random shonen manga, besides the stories being forgettable, the battles weren't impressive looking, not that this means the more popular ones are like that (Though they may be, Dragon Ball Super manga's fights aren't impressive looking at all for the most part), much less most of 'em, but my experience with those I read had the battles being so forgettable I grew numb to it after a while lol.
    I have a lot of favorite fights from the Shonen manga I've read over the years, so maybe it was just a case that I just happened to stumble into the good ones .
    Anyways, to get back in topic, my favorite battle in Spidey-related shit is the Symbiote Spidey vs Sinister Six from Spectacular, while there's no quipping and all, the symbiote fights properly like Spidey, using his agility, speed, and making the Sinister Six hit each other, which is a good way to show how he can beat them when they're a team, but also show why they can be threatening solo (Like how Shocker's gauntlet effectively neutralizes Sandman, and Rhino being knocked down by Electro's power), so fun.
    Yeah, I think for a lot of people the Black Suit vs the Sinister Six is the most memorable fight in Spectacular.

  7. #52
    Incredible Member RD155's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    With the difference that Spidey makes way more sense than shit Jojo has, like "If you look into the rainbow you'll turn into a snail!"



    I don't mind the camera angle changes, I only mentioned that as an example in case a manga uses it in a way that the battle looks incomprehensible.



    I've had a time where I for some reason read some random shonen manga, besides the stories being forgettable, the battles weren't impressive looking, not that this means the more popular ones are like that (Though they may be, Dragon Ball Super manga's fights aren't impressive looking at all for the most part), much less most of 'em, but my experience with those I read had the battles being so forgettable I grew numb to it after a while lol.

    Anyways, to get back in topic, my favorite battle in Spidey-related shit is the Symbiote Spidey vs Sinister Six from Spectacular, while there's no quipping and all, the symbiote fights properly like Spidey, using his agility, speed, and making the Sinister Six hit each other, which is a good way to show how he can beat them when they're a team, but also show why they can be threatening solo (Like how Shocker's gauntlet effectively neutralizes Sandman, and Rhino being knocked down by Electro's power), so fun.
    That fight in Spectacular was the highlight for a series with plenty of highs. Now that’s an example of some prime time Spidey action that takes all his abilities and so on into account. The first Mysterio episode was also pretty well done especially the Spider sense aspect for their final battle in the ep.

    Nothing tops that Sinister six battle though.

    Back to the comics though and this is probably just me being a bias Bagley fanboy but.....his run during the 90’s on ASM and then onto USM had too many amazing fights to list. Bagley just had such a natural feel for penciling those actions sequences and Spidey was constantly in this aesthetic agile poses that only he’s capable of.

    One fight that sticks out to me was the Spidey vs Venom in the carnival during the whole “parents return from the dead” era. Just a hardcore aggressive fight that starts off with them actually teaming up and then when that’s over trying to tear each other’s heads off and then culminating with them teaming up again to save Eddies ex .....Just amazing flashy and dynamic artwork from Bagley. I clearly remember one particular brutal image of Venom essentially just slamming Spideys head through the concrete floor. The fear and desperation that Spidey was experiencing when he starts to essentially realize that there’s no “escape” just flew off the pages. Theres a particular line that sets up the atmosphere even more when Spidey says and I’m paraphrasing to an extent “God I would give anything if Venom would just leave me alone....”. I remembered reading it and just becoming so involved with the moment because of how “scared” Spider-Man was. There’s nothing quite like a venerable hero up against the odds, admitting his scared and still trying to push forward.

    Damn I really miss that old school Bagley. His art over the years has dipped and it seems like he’s almost forgotten at times how to draw 616 Spidey because he seems to resemble the USM version way too much in terms of size. Whatever the case when Bagley was on his game back during his ASM/USM days no one captured that dynamic/Graceful/Agile imagery of Spider-Man quite like he did.
    Last edited by RD155; 10-28-2020 at 05:30 PM.

  8. #53
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Well, "Bizarre" is in the title .
    I guess the series that has a vampire Jack the Ripper bursting out of a horse all the way back in part 1 should give a hint that acid trips were expected .

    I have a lot of favorite fights from the Shonen manga I've read over the years, so maybe it was just a case that I just happened to stumble into the good ones .
    Your luck is certainly the opposite of mine when it comes to this then lol.

    Yeah, I think for a lot of people the Black Suit vs the Sinister Six is the most memorable fight in Spectacular.
    Quote Originally Posted by RD155 View Post
    That fight in Spectacular was the highlight for a series with plenty of highs. Now that’s an example of some prime time Spidey action that takes all his abilities and so on into account. The first Mysterio episode was also pretty well done especially the Spider sense aspect for their final battle in the ep.

    Nothing tops that Sinister six battle though.
    Yeah, even though season 2 had better animation, that Sinister Six battle is just too good, which is not to say that season 2 had bad fights, just that topping that one would be hella hard lol.

    Back to the comics though and this is probably just me being a bias Bagley fanboy but.....his run during the 90’s on ASM and then onto USM had too many amazing fights to list. Bagley just had such a natural feel for penciling those actions sequences and Spidey was constantly in this aesthetic agile poses that only he’s capable of.

    One fight that sticks out to me was the Spidey vs Venom in the carnival during the whole “parents return from the dead” era. Just a hardcore aggressive fight that starts off with them actually teaming up and then when that’s over trying to tear each other’s heads off and then culminating with them teaming up again to save Eddies ex .....Just amazing flashy and dynamic artwork from Bagley. I clearly remember one particular brutal image of Venom essentially just slamming Spideys head through the concrete floor. The fear and desperation that Spidey was experiencing when he starts to essentially realize that there’s no “escape” just flew off the pages. Theres a particular line that sets up the atmosphere even more when Spidey says and I’m paraphrasing to an extent “God I would give anything if Venom would just leave me alone....”. I remembered reading it and just becoming so involved with the moment because of how “scared” Spider-Man was. There’s nothing quite like a venerable hero up against the odds, admitting his scared and still trying to push forward.

    Damn I really miss that old school Bagley. His art over the years has dipped and it seems like he’s almost forgotten at times how to draw 616 Spidey because he seems to resemble the USM version way too much in terms of size. Whatever the case when Bagley was on his game back during his ASM/USM days no one captured that dynamic/Graceful/Agile imagery of Spider-Man quite like he did.
    Hey, if you remember the issue that happened, lemme know, sounds like good shit.
    Last edited by Lukmendes; 10-28-2020 at 08:14 PM.

  9. #54
    Incredible Member RD155's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukmendes View Post
    I guess the series that has a vampire Jack the Ripper bursting out of a horse all the way back in part 1 should give a hint that acid trips were expected .



    Your luck is certainly the opposite of mine when it comes to this then lol.





    Yeah, even though season 2 had better animation, that Sinister Six battle is just too good, which is not to say that season 2 had bad fights, just that topping that one would be hella hard lol.



    Hey, if you remember the issue that happened, lemme know, sounds like good shit.
    It’s a two parter during that run with Peters parents.

    ASM 374-375. Both issues have kick ass Spider-Man vs Venom fights. Bagley was almost at the peak of his powers artistically at that point.

  10. #55
    Astonishing Member Lukmendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RD155 View Post
    It’s a two parter during that run with Peters parents.

    ASM 374-375. Both issues have kick ass Spider-Man vs Venom fights. Bagley was almost at the peak of his powers artistically at that point.
    Thanks man.

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