Marvel without Superheroes

[jackolover]

I would like to see the Silver Age again, but without the heroes getting their powers. Mole Man, Skrulls, Dr Doom, no Namor, no Hulk, Pym never took up ant formula, Don Blake stayed in New York, Stark just serviced SHIELD. What if Peter Parker stayed a cynical schoolboy? How would the world have dealt with the villains? All the authorities were there to deal with it. The CIA, the UN, the military. Sure, you could have the Marvel characters involved, but not as powered up people, just ordinary citizens. Was there ever something done like this before? Maybe an alternative reality?

The thing that distinguished the Silver Age superpowered heroic stories from the Atlas Age was the continuity. You could forget the story after reading an Atlas Age story, but the superheroes kept cropping up month after month. That kind of MU Atlas Age from 1961 onwards with continuity would be interesting to me. How do you deal with Skrulls, or Stone men, or a Mole Man? I think the world would be a different place.

Ignoring the idea that Superheroes were a symbol of the 1960’s change, where the well-spring of enthusiasm and expression of ideas are represented as heroes, what would that world look like?

[JudicatorPrime]

I would like to see the Silver Age again, but without the heroes getting their powers. Mole Man, Skrulls, Dr Doom, no Namor, no Hulk, Pym never took up ant formula, Don Blake stayed in New York, Stark just serviced SHIELD. What if Peter Parker stayed a cynical schoolboy? How would the world have dealt with the villains? All the authorities were there to deal with it. The CIA, the UN, the military. Sure, you could have the Marvel characters involved, but not as powered up people, just ordinary citizens. Was there ever something done like this before? Maybe an alternative reality?

The thing that distinguished the Silver Age superpowered heroic stories from the Atlas Age was the continuity. You could forget the story after reading an Atlas Age story, but the superheroes kept cropping up month after month. That kind of MU Atlas Age from 1961 onwards with continuity would be interesting to me. How do you deal with Skrulls, or Stone men, or a Mole Man? I think the world would be a different place.

Ignoring the idea that Superheroes were a symbol of the 1960’s change, where the well-spring of enthusiasm and expression of ideas are represented as heroes, what would that world look like?

It would have to be an alternate Earth type thing, because 616 has had super-powered types since the dawn of civilization. Maybe they didn't call them superheroes per se, but the war between good and evil has always had a healthy complement of superhumanly powerful heroic figures.

[Grapeweasel]

Powerless_tpb.jpg

You mean like this?

[scribbleMind]

I think it would just be a pulp/noir version of what we already have. I think vigilantes would have to step up, whether they have powers or not, because superheroes or not it's still the marvel universe. That said, it's hard for me to imagine a modern day pulp world, because it just doesn't happen often. The last example I read was the last Shadow run and the Shadow x Batman crossover, and in both of those books the Shadow was more powerful than ever, backed by almost lovecraftian forces, so even in those examples it was too close to superheroism to set a precedence. I think it would result in more people like Punisher, more organizations like Shield, and more death. In the pulps heroes kill all the time, because it's easier. Not killing is a convenience. If Daredevil is fighting Zemo he can afford to let him live. If Zemo broke into my house, I won't have the slightest chance in a confrontation if I'm not trying to kill.

[jackolover]

Powerless_tpb.jpg

You mean like this?

I am aware of “Powerless”, but there were no supervillains in that series with powers. What I am supposing is something like the Atlas Age regular humans dealing with super villains and alien threats without super heroes. It would be a bit one sided, but the heroes would have to be more inventive if they had to deal with the “bad man” by being smarter. It might be more like “Old Man Logan” world perhaps.

[jackolover]

I think it would just be a pulp/noir version of what we already have. I think vigilantes would have to step up, whether they have powers or not, because superheroes or not it's still the marvel universe. That said, it's hard for me to imagine a modern day pulp world, because it just doesn't happen often. The last example I read was the last Shadow run and the Shadow x Batman crossover, and in both of those books the Shadow was more powerful than ever, backed by almost lovecraftian forces, so even in those examples it was too close to superheroism to set a precedence. I think it would result in more people like Punisher, more organizations like Shield, and more death. In the pulps heroes kill all the time, because it's easier. Not killing is a convenience. If Daredevil is fighting Zemo he can afford to let him live. If Zemo broke into my house, I won't have the slightest chance in a confrontation if I'm not trying to kill.

You could include supernatural objects now and then, but I’d keep it as powerless as possible just to get the difficulty of dealing with supervillains. They could solve the problem by hiring a super villain as an overall protector. Better the devil you know... sort of thing.

[DrNewGod]

SHIELD becomes a NATO agency and gets run ragged defending North America and Western Europe. Wakanda annexes all Africa to resource their defense against ETs. Dr. Doom winds up owning Eastern Europe and a goodly chunk of NW Asia. Mandarin and Yellow Claw pretty much immolate East Asia in their turf war. South America and Oceania are all in play.

SHIELD and Wakanda are uneasy allies, mainly because they both dread Doom. Then, suddenly, Attuma comes bursting out of the Pacific making a play for Oceania and East Asia.

It's a mess.

[jackolover]

SHIELD becomes a NATO agency and gets run ragged defending North America and Western Europe. Wakanda annexes all Africa to resource their defense against ETs. Dr. Doom winds up owning Eastern Europe and a goodly chunk of NW Asia. Mandarin and Yellow Claw pretty much immolate East Asia in their turf war. South America and Oceania are all in play.

SHIELD and Wakanda are uneasy allies, mainly because they both dread Doom. Then, suddenly, Attuma comes bursting out of the Pacific making a play for Oceania and East Asia.

It's a mess.

What do you think New York looks like?

[Snoop Dogg]

Powerless_tpb.jpg

You mean like this?

what in the goddang heck is this

[DrNewGod]

What do you think New York looks like?

NYC is like Zurich at the height of the Cold War: seething with international intrigue, blended with its own internal problems. SHIELD has to spend an inordinate amount of effort to counter Doom's, and even Wakanda's moves to manipulate the global stage there.

It's not, however, unique. Similar scenarios are playing out in Vancouver, Stockholm, Athens, Haifa, S'ana and Melbourne.

[jackolover]

NYC is like Zurich at the height of the Cold War: seething with international intrigue, blended with its own internal problems. SHIELD has to spend an inordinate amount of effort to counter Doom's, and even Wakanda's moves to manipulate the global stage there.

It's not, however, unique. Similar scenarios are playing out in Vancouver, Stockholm, Athens, Haifa, S'ana and Melbourne.

Would you have Richards, Stark, Banner, Parker, Pym, Brashear, etc, as members of SHIELD as part of the program deflecting the Zurich-type intrigues of the super villains swarming around NYC? I’m just imagining these characters, with the smarts to come up with technological solutions to these villains. Like catching the Beetle in a net? Flying, roaming, Cape killers as in CW. Lots of nanotech to depower villains or Aliens?

[DrNewGod]

Would you have Richards, Stark, Banner, Parker, Pym, Brashear, etc, as members of SHIELD as part of the program deflecting the Zurich-type intrigues of the super villains swarming around NYC? I’m just imagining these characters, with the smarts to come up with technological solutions to these villains. Like catching the Beetle in a net? Flying, roaming, Cape killers as in CW. Lots of nanotech to depower villains or Aliens?

They're not monolithic in their responses. Richards, Stark and (sans Hulk) Banner are all very institutional guys, and so part of a SHIELD braintrust. Pym, Brashere, Williams, Xavier and McCoy are all a bit more likely to join in an Illuminati type outfit, fighting their own way. Parker is just some bright snotnose from Queens living in Uncle Ben's basement, who never experienced the moment that triggered realization of his full potential.