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  1. #16
    Mighty Member Ra-El's Avatar
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    So Geoff Johns tried to add technology as a weakness to Superman? What, he thought that kryptonite, red sun and magic wasn't enough?

    Actually is already past the time of drop two of those, keep only kryptonite because is already too late to get rid of it.

  2. #17

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    Geoff Johns' attempt to shoehorn in an unknown and missing twin sibling of Lightning Lord's, from his brief run of stories about the LSH in Adventure Comics. Paul Levitz walked that aborted would-be plot back to the established status quo so not subtly, and so quickly. that you could practically hear him say out loud, "No, Geoff, that's a stupid idea."

    The mid-90's Zatanna: Come Together mini-series and its long-term affects on Zatanna's character, costume, and powers. I actually liked it and understood the explanations and reasoning for the choices made in that mini that were given in the individual issues' text pieces, and was glad to see John Ostrander have that version of Zatanna make some appearances in his Spectre, so that story wasn't dropped quite as quickly as the OP was suggesting. But clearly, somebody (or several somebodies) behind the scenes at DC hated it, because some months after Zee's last guest-appearance in Spectre, she next appeared in the Superman titles, back in her half-tuxedo-half-fishnets costume, back to backwards-speaking spells, and back to being a stage magician, with the explanation being given in the letter's column afterwards when fans asked that Come Together had been completely retconned out of continuity. They didn't even try to come up with an in-universe explanation for reversing Zatanna's status quo.
    Last edited by Timber Wolf-By-Night; 10-27-2020 at 10:54 PM.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timber Wolf-By-Night View Post
    Geoff Johns' attempt to shoehorn in an unknown and missing twin sibling of Lightning Lord's, from his brief run of stories about the LSH in Adventure Comics. Paul Levitz walked that aborted would-be plot back to the established status quo so not subtly, and so quickly. that you could practically hear him say out loud, "No, Geoff, that's a stupid idea."

    The mid-90's Zatanna: Come Together mini-series and its long-term affects on Zatanna's character, costume, and powers. I actually liked it and understood the explanations and reasoning for the choices made in that mini that were given in the individual issues' text pieces, and was glad to see John Ostrander have that version of Zatanna make some appearances in his Spectre, so that story wasn't dropped quite as quickly as the OP was suggesting. But clearly, somebody (or several somebodies) behind the scenes at DC hated it, because some months after Zee's last guest-appearance in Spectre, she next appeared in the Superman titles, back in her half-tuxedo-half-fishnets costume, back to backwards-speaking spells, and back to being a stage magician, with the explanation being given in the letter's column afterwards when fans asked that Come Together had been completely retconned out of continuity. They didn't even try to come up with an in-universe explanation for reversing Zatanna's status quo.
    What was Come Together about?

  4. #19
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ra-El View Post
    So Geoff Johns tried to add technology as a weakness to Superman?
    As an anti-automation figure, Superman and tech don't get along . But the problem is, superman is supposed to be technology's weakness, not the reverse.In practice though , superman has been weak to tech ever-since tech based heroes like batman, ironman.. Etc became more popular.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 10-28-2020 at 12:32 AM.

  5. #20
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bored at 3:00AM View Post
    Another fascinating failure was Priest's attempt to retcon in Triumph, a deliberately unlikeable and abrasive new superhero, into the history of the JLA as its unknown founder. This character was so despised and the hate heaped upon him was so immediate, I can't think of another character at DC that was so decisively rejected. Preist's recent revelation that Triumph was also gay only adds to this failed character's mystique in my mind.
    Are you sure that you're not confusing Triumph with someone else? Triumph was by Waid, not Priest, wasn't he? The same trick was repeated by him with Voyager in Avengers No Surrender, only, because it was clear from the start there'd be a twist, she was more well liked.
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    As an anti-automation figure, Superman and tech don't get along . But the problem is, superman is supposed to be technology's weakness, not the reverse.In practice though , superman has been weak to tech ever-since tech based heroes like batman, ironman.. Etc became more popular.
    There is nothing anti-automation about Superman.

  7. #22
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    Are you sure that you're not confusing Triumph with someone else? Triumph was by Waid, not Priest, wasn't he? The same trick was repeated by him with Voyager in Avengers No Surrender, only, because it was clear from the start there'd be a twist, she was more well liked.
    Waid was definitely involved in the character's creation, but Priest was the character's primary writer during his brief lifespan within the DCU.

    Priest lays out the details here: http://https://web.archive.org/web/2...cs/triumph.htm
    Last edited by Bored at 3:00AM; 10-28-2020 at 01:12 AM.

  8. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    What was Come Together about?
    For a synopsis of the mini on an individual issue-by-issue basis, I'd go here: https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Zatanna_Vol_1.

    And to get a look at how this mini came to be, and what the team were trying to do with it (and how that flew in the face of early 90's DC output that wasn't under the editorial umbrella of Karen "Vertigo Comics" Berger), go here: https://comic-watch.com/news/kim-yal...-come-together

  9. #24
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Those New Guardians that emerged from the "Millennium" event. Just ... no.

    The idea that Lightning Lad was secretly Proty since the early silver age.

  10. #25
    Reader of Stuff Hilden B. Lade's Avatar
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    I don't think we'll be seeing the New 52 Justice League Dark's Nick Necro ever again in regards to Zatanna or John Constantine's backstories...

    And I don't think anyone is in a rush to reference the Batman Bladder Spasm...

    Come to think of it, Animal Man's appearances in the DCU seem to ignore what happened to the character after Morrison's run, especially once his title joined the Vertigo brand and divorced itself from the mainline DCU - i.e. Buddy Baker makes an appearance in the final arc of Morrison's JLA that brings him back to traditional superheroics after some of the out-there directions his then-recent Vertigo runs took him.
    Last edited by Hilden B. Lade; 10-28-2020 at 08:33 AM.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    There is nothing anti-automation about Superman.






    Also, JOHN HENRY Irons.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post






    Also, JOHN HENRY Irons.
    Fighting evil robots does not make Superman anti-automation. Superman himself has employed robots as helpers in the Fortress of Solitude.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Fighting evil robots does not make Superman anti-automation. Superman himself has employed robots as helpers in the Fortress of Solitude.
    In many stories, he represents the working class and the fight against corporations and their machines. There are many interpretations out there, and that's one of them.

  14. #29
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    In many stories, he represents the working class and the fight against corporations and their machines. There are many interpretations out there, and that's one of them.
    Yeah, but he still uses a lot of Kryptonian tech and doesn't hate all robots.

    His father was a scientist.

  15. #30
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    There is nothing anti-automation about Superman.
    Really? There is a clear subtext in the old comics and even media. He is smashing machines, robots, cars... Etc. From my readings of the creators either meant it or it was subconscious. Steel is based on john henry the folk hero if i am not mistaken who beat the steam drill . Superman himself is about natural physicality and human intellect trumping machines and tech based assistance. Just analyse before you go around declaring stuff.There is a reason landis had superman causing machines to glitch out in his presence. Superman smashes giant robots.And that's that. He has a leaning and is clearly saying something.That might not fit the later adaptations. But, saying superman's didn't have any opinions in the matter is false.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 10-28-2020 at 09:28 AM.

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