Unpopular opinion: Hickman's X-Men is going downhill

[yogaflame]

Not when the "real nuanced storytelling" Rememder was boasting about was the Call Me Alex speech

I've never been impressed with Remender's work, but even a stopped watch is right twice a day...

[nandes]

If being right means sinking low as calling the supporters of the work of your colleague "brain dead", yes

[Omega Alpha]

If being right means sinking low as calling the supporters of the work of your colleague "brain dead", yes

Everything in UA, both the writing and his reactions to criticism, just shows Remender to be very immature. Moreover, it looks even more ridiculous in hindsight since Hickman answered all the questions he offered, and in anyway always clearly wasn't making it up as it went along (even at the time, Bendis joked he's the guy that arrives saying "here's my 60 issues").

[gurkle]

I should probably state more clearly that Remender nor anyone else has ever said those panels were about Hickman; that might just be fan speculation and fan speculation is often wrong.

Anyway, yeah, I think Hickman clearly has a plan for everything he does, which is kind of my problem with him; I feel like to really get on board with him, I'd have to accept being bored or confused now and enjoy it when I see how it all fits together. Personally I don't really care how it all fits together. But how I react to Hickman probably has a lot to do with how I see the overarching story - to me it's mostly a vehicle to hold a run together and the main interest of a run is in stories and scenes.

While for Hickman the fun is in the buildup and the way the overall shape of the run starts to emerge over time. So if a reader likes Hickman, as many readers do, the buildup isn't boring at all, the buildup is part of the fun and scenes are compelling because we don't completely know what they mean yet. Which is fine, I just prefer writers who are more willing to make things up as they go along.

[Wolverine12]

I like what Hickman's doing conceptually, my problem is just what it was with his Avengers run: he always seems to be pointing forward to something that is about to happen but I don't think he cares that much about telling a compelling story in the here-and-now.

I really got a sense of where Hickman is coming from in an interview where he went off about how he hates episodic television where each episode tells its own self-contained story ("The Mandalorian" is an example of a show like that, where there is a broader story but mostly adventures of the week). This absolutely shows in his work. He thinks in terms of broad sweeping plans and he wants us to come along for the ride, but for me it always feels like the stories are just placeholders until the actual story gets started. I just wish he'd reveal all the mysteries behind Krakoa right now and then get to telling some stories.

Rick Remender wrote a thing in Uncanny Avengers that is widely suspected of being a Hickman diss, and of course if it is, then it's just petulant jealousy that Hickman's Avengers book was more popular and acclaimed than his, but it does kind of sum up how I feel when I read a Hickman run.

I hope that is just fan speculation and not an actual dig because Remender and Hickman are two of my favorite writers just in general but they have both been outstanding on their X-books having done modern classics imho. I’d still say Uncanny X-Force was better than HoX but only by a slight margin and I wouldn’t fault anyone for saying HoX was better. I will say the way Remender handles criticism can be unprofessional at times and that is unfortunate. At the same time the way Hickman has talked about X-Men fans isn’t really any better. Lucky for me I enjoy both of their writing styles so either way I’m happy.

On a related tangent Remender did use some of Hickman’s plots in UXF and UA if I’m remembering correctly. I could be mistaken but didn’t he use the same life seed that Ex Nihlo used to terra form Mars in that town in Montana during the Dark Angel saga?

[Steroid]

I hope that is just fan speculation and not an actual dig because Remender and Hickman are two of my favorite writers just in general but they have both been outstanding on their X-books having done modern classics imho. I’d still say Uncanny X-Force was better than HoX but only by a slight margin and I wouldn’t fault anyone for saying HoX was better. I will say the way Remender handles criticism can be unprofessional at times and that is unfortunate. At the same time the way Hickman has talked about X-Men fans isn’t really any better. Lucky for me I enjoy both of their writing styles so either way I’m happy.

On a related tangent Remender did use some of Hickman’s plots in UXF and UA if I’m remembering correctly. I could be mistaken but didn’t he use the same life seed that Ex Nihlo used to terra form Mars in that town in Montana during the Dark Angel saga?

UXF came before Hickman's Avengers run. I like both writers stuff but in this case Remender did it first.

[Viteh]

I should probably state more clearly that Remender nor anyone else has ever said those panels were about Hickman; that might just be fan speculation and fan speculation is often wrong.

If I had to bet money I would say that it really was a dig at Hickman. I stopped following him years ago, so I don't know if he has changed, but it sounds exactly like the kind of thing he would do back in the mid 2010s.

I kinda get his jealousy though, Uncanny Avengers was marketed as the flagship of Marvel NOW!, but Marvel didn't really back him up with that after a while. The X-Men fans criticized UA a lot, and with good reason. I imagine he expected the good faith he had earned from UXF help him there, but it kinda wore off. The Avengers fans kinda stopped caring after a while. His book also had a lot of art related delays. Then came HoboPissGate. AXIS was heavily criticized. Meanwhile Hickman was getting a lot of praise, while Remender never really got good reviews from critics for his UA.

I also remember when he did that Planet X storyline, a lot of people kept asking why would Beast make them go back to Earth. Since Beast was part of Hickman's New Avengers, rebuilding Earth would mean restarting the Incursions, so Beast would know that and wouldn't do it. People pointed that out. It probably annoyed Remender to have people criticize his story because it didn't fit with Hickman's plot.

On a related tangent Remender did use some of Hickman’s plots in UXF and UA if I’m remembering correctly. I could be mistaken but didn’t he use the same life seed that Ex Nihlo used to terra form Mars in that town in Montana during the Dark Angel saga?

The Dark Angel Saga predates Hickman's Avengers run by 2 years or so. I think the seed was related to Apocalypse and/or the Celestials.

[Omega Alpha]

If I had to bet money I would say that it really was a dig at Hickman. I stopped following him years ago, so I don't know if he has changed, but it sounds exactly like the kind of thing he would do back in the mid 2010s.

I kinda get his jealousy though, Uncanny Avengers was marketed as the flagship of Marvel NOW!, but Marvel didn't really back him up with that after a while. The X-Men fans criticized UA a lot, and with good reason. I imagine he expected the good faith he had earned from UXF help him there, but it kinda wore off. The Avengers fans kinda stopped caring after a while. His book also had a lot of art related delays. Then came HoboPissGate. AXIS was heavily criticized. Meanwhile Hickman was getting a lot of praise, while Remender never really got good reviews from critics for his UA.

I also remember when he did that Planet X storyline, a lot of people kept asking why would Beast make them go back to Earth. Since Beast was part of Hickman's New Avengers, rebuilding Earth would mean restarting the Incursions, so Beast would know that and wouldn't do it. People pointed that out. It probably annoyed Remender to have people criticize his story because it didn't fit with Hickman's plot.

The thing is that Marvel hoped it would be the flagship, but the writing in Hickman's books was better, and Remender was the wrong writer for the sort of book they were proposing.

[baxer]

The thing is that Marvel hoped it would be the flagship, but the writing in Hickman's books was better, and Remender was the wrong writer for the sort of book they were proposing.

Simply not true in anyway. Hickman Avengers was always the flagship because of the secret wars endgame masterplan.
Of course it was marketed a lot, but everyone on marvel knew the true story wasnt on PR

[Omega Alpha]

Simply not true in anyway. Hickman Avengers was always the flagship because of the secret wars endgame masterplan.
Of course it was marketed a lot, but everyone on marvel knew the true story wasnt on PR

SW was one event three years away- UA was the big book, Quesada even went on Colbert to promote it.

[gurkle]

I think they just decided to market Uncanny Avengers as the flagship of the Marvel Now! launch because they were able to tie it into the Avengers vs. X-Men event and Hickman's Avengers was going to have a rather slow start. Within a few months Hickman's book was getting more promotion and Remender turned over the entire Uncanny Avengers book to a long self-contained spinoff of the Dark Angel Saga. So it was sort of the flagship for its first arc and that's all Marvel needed.

Really both Remender and Hickman were essentially doing their own thing and writing big self-contained stories. What Hickman is doing with X-Men is a bit different because Marvel made him de facto co-editor of the entire line, so the line reflects his ideas of what the franchise should be in a way that the Avengers line (back when there was such a thing) did not.

[Wolverine12]

UXF came before Hickman's Avengers run. I like both writers stuff but in this case Remender did it first.

Okay so flip it around then I suppose. Either way worked, plant a life seed grow a weird jungle wherever you want

[Exodus]

I think the difference in quality between "House of X" and "Dawn of X" shows the problem of the comic book industry. If you would give authors and artists the time they need to come up with quality work, we as consumers would get quality work. If you rush and overburden them with a tight schedule, we will always get mediocre storylines and art. At least this is how I see.

Although I adore what Hickman has done with the x-men, MARVEL will quickly lose me again as a consumer in the next year because I find many comicbooks ridiculous expensive for reading through them in 10 minutes, being bored by mediocre storylines and find myself unimpressed with rushed art (I look particularly at you X-Force!!). There are so many fantastic comicbooks at the market (like SAGA) which keep their quality in writing and art 100 percent.

[Kitty&Piotr<3]

The problem is this really:

HoXPoX was cool and new with lots of weird stuff.

Lately though, none of the books are going balls to the wall. Even Ben Percy, who started off better than all the rest, is boring me with basic Omega Red appearances in every issue of X-Force and Wolverine.

X of Swords is decompressed nonsense, despite some neat character designs.

The line has gone weak, overall.

[Glio]

Hickman's Avengers were just better than Remender's, there's no great mystery there. The only thing UA will be remembered for is for cringe moments like "Call me Alex" or AXIS.

And Rick Remender is just like Jason Aaron, very immature in accepting criticism.