Batfamily Explosion!

[babybats]

For me, what makes a story compelling is relationships between people. So while I get why Loner Batman as a concept is Really Cool, the thing that really interests me is the Batfamily, so I'd keep all of them. But it is ridiculously overcrowded as it is, so I'd prefer if they stop adding new characters to spice it up and just work on telling good stories with the ones they already have.

[Vakanai]

Reading some of the older posts in this thread, seems some people take some issue that Bruce needed years of training while everyone else got pretty good in much less time. The answer to that is Batman had to train in several different fields under several different masters, whereas everyone else had the benefit of just needing to train under one master, Batman. Not a perfect answer, but hey it's comic books.

[millernumber1]

Reading some of the older posts in this thread, seems some people take some issue that Bruce needed years of training while everyone else got pretty good in much less time. The answer to that is Batman had to train in several different fields under several different masters, whereas everyone else had the benefit of just needing to train under one master, Batman. Not a perfect answer, but hey it's comic books.

Good point!

[MajorHoy]

In the just under ten hours since I bumped up this thread, the results are now:

* +1-99 Bat Family members = 25 votes (+ 4)
* +1-9 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Black Bat?) = 12 votes (+ 4)
* +1-3 (Nightwing, Batgirl & Robin) = 10 votes (no change)
* +1-2 (Robin & Batgirl) = 10 votes (+ 2)
* +1-5 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress & Batgirl?) = 9 votes (+ 2)
* +1-19 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Incorporated) = 7 votes (no change)

All other choices still have less than five votes each.

[MajorHoy]

NOTE: This thread was first started in August 2014.
---------------------------------------------------------
With 91 people having voted,

* +1-99 Bat Family members = 27 votes
* +1-9 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Black Bat?) = 14 votes
* +1-3 (Nightwing, Batgirl & Robin) = 11 votes
* +1-5 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress & Batgirl?) = 11 votes
* +1-2 (Robin & Batgirl) = 10 votes
* +1-19 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Incorporated) = 8 votes

All other choices still have less than five votes for each.

[MajorHoy]

How many people feel Ghost-Maker now qualifies as an extended member of the "Batman Family"?



Or is it still too early to say yet?
(Do we maybe have to wait until after Tynion finishes his run on Batman to see if he's still around?)

[sifighter]

I wouldn’t put Ghost-maker in the family, right now he’s more an old friend who hangs out with Bruce. Like I would put him in the same space as Superman, friend who helps when needed.

Also if I would say my opinion, I like the really big Bat-family. It works considering that Bruce is just one man and he would need help. Plus, to me they can also stand on their own as characters that I like and have stories I’ve really enjoyed with them. So I say bring on Dick, Barbara, Jason, Tim, Damian, Duke, Cassandra, Stephanie, Kate, Helena, and Luke. Heck even bring Harold back.

[MajorHoy]

. . . Also if I would say my opinion, I like the really big Bat-family. It works considering that Bruce is just one man and he would need help. Plus, to me they can also stand on their own as characters that I like and have stories I’ve really enjoyed with them. So I say bring on Dick, Barbara, Jason, Tim, Damian, Duke, Cassandra, Stephanie, Kate, Helena, and Luke. Heck even bring Harold back.

Well, you listed twelve right there.
What about other past acquaintances like Azrael (Jean-Paul Valley and/or Michael Lane), Talon (Calvin Rose), The Hood (George Cross), Nightrunner (Bilal Asselah), Knight and Squire (various), El Gaucho (Don Santiago Vargas), etc., etc. . . .

[godisawesome]

At a certain point, the Batfamily as a whole becomes similar to the Arthurian Mythos - there’s a central character, but his associates sometimes overshadow him and number anywhere from a small elite clique to a veritable army, with hundreds fo quests and a tendency towards false bile continuity.

Not that there’s anything wrong with that; in fact, I’d like it if someone decided to have this “Order of the Bat” made an explicit point in a comparison to Ra’s Al Ghul’s organization or the Cult of the Kobra. Batman Inc. was a vaguely corporatized idea of it; embracing the actual “master and apprentice chain” idea and dealing with “inadequate heirs” and such would be a neat way to take it.

[sifighter]

Well, you listed twelve right there.
What about other past acquaintances like Azrael (Jean-Paul Valley and/or Michael Lane), Talon (Calvin Rose), The Hood (George Cross), Nightrunner (Bilal Asselah), Knight and Squire (various), El Gaucho (Don Santiago Vargas), etc., etc. . . .

Sure, but the ones I named are the more immediate ones, but yeah I’d like to see some of Batman Inc. again. Although I think Azrael is still in space?

[prepmaster]

Love this Joker.

I wish we had more of this Joker that makes fun out of the Batfam.

[mib86]

Everyone but not necessarily at the same time, it all depends on which characters and which story the author wants to write.
I think a changing "formation" of 9-10 members between old and new, should work most of the time unless you need a Bat-Army for some reason.

[Lady Nightwing]

None of the poll options suit my preferences. I'd happily jettison some of the newer characters like Harper Row and Gotham Girl.

I could live without Tim Drake but I know there would be uproar from his fan base, he needs a massive overhaul (Tynion and Lobdell should not be involved in that in anyway), leave him in a book with Stephanie as Spoiler. For the sake of streamlining the timelines, I would retcon her time as Robin and Batgirl. Sorry, Steph fans.

Babs is Oracle, Cassandra is Batgirl. They operate largely independent of Bruce.

Jason is an independent anti hero, he's family technically but not Bat sanctioned. You will never convince me Bruce is OK with the whole 8 heads in a duffle bag.

Dick is Nightwing in Bludhaven, Damian as Robin works with him. (Damian as Robin doesn't compliment Bruce, both two strongheaded). Huntress makes no sense as a Batfamily member with her new Spyral oriented origin. Make her a regular in the Nightwing book.

That leaves Bruce as Batman, with Duke as his Robin stand in. Duke is a more malleable character than Damian and can have the more standard Batman and "Robin" relationship. So 85% of the time the only capes in the main Batman book are Duke and Bruce. The others can pop in for cameos now and then

So the family would be Alfred, Bruce, Dick, Jason (estranged), Tim,Damian and Duke as a ward until Bruce can cure his parents.
The others are trusted allies but Bruce isn't directly responsible for them.

More importantly is character development. DC have got to stop writing these characters as one dimensional tropes. Tim boy genius, Jason as the angry failure, Dick as tumblr hug machine etc. Given the lifestyle they lead and who trained them there is going to be an overlap of personalities quirks and skill sets and that's perfectly fine. Just because Tim is smart doesn't mean the other members of the family share a single brain cell.

[MajorHoy]

With 109 people having voted,

* +1-99 Bat Family members = 32 votes
* +1-3 (Nightwing, Batgirl & Robin) = 16 votes
* +1-9 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Black Bat?) = 15 votes
* +1-5 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress & Batgirl?) = 14 votes
* +1-2 (Robin & Batgirl) = 10 votes
* +1-19 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood, Batwoman, Red Robin & Incorporated) = 9 votes
* +1-7 (Nightwing, Oracle, Robin, Huntress, Batgirl, Red Hood & Batwoman?) = 5 votes

All other choices still have less than five votes for each.

[MajorHoy]

Not sure why the poll went from "+1-9" to "+1-19".

Maybe going with "+1-12" or "+1-15" might have been a better jump after "+1-9".