View Poll Results: Who is the definitive Superman writer?

Voters
61. You may not vote on this poll
  • Jerry Siegal

    5 8.20%
  • Otto Binder

    0 0%
  • Grant Morrison

    22 36.07%
  • Alan Moore

    4 6.56%
  • Mark Waid

    2 3.28%
  • Kurt Busiek

    3 4.92%
  • Eliott S! Maggin

    4 6.56%
  • John Byrne

    4 6.56%
  • Cary Bates

    2 3.28%
  • Mark Millar

    0 0%
  • Dan Jurgens

    7 11.48%
  • Jack Kirby

    1 1.64%
  • Geoff Johns

    2 3.28%
  • Other

    5 8.20%
  • See Results

    0 0%
Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 234567 LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 101
  1. #76
    Standing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    14,446

    Default

    Even though that ethos of the 1950s male is passť (or should be), I think there's something about George Reeves as Clark Kent that's indelible, in the way that 1980s and 1990s comic book characterizations are not. I've watched a fair amount of 1980s and 1990s T.V. lately, during the pandemic, and it's kind of embarrassing that we were ever like that. It's hard to read some Superman stories from that time and not feel creeped out.
    🇨🇦
    [Exit, pursued
    by a bear.

  2. #77
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    1,677

    Default

    There is a lot of discussion of the primacy Supes or Clark and a lot seem to like the idea of Clark as a shell to lead in to Supes adventures with Supes being the authentic persona. I notice that was a point in the pitch posted in the thread from the millennium Braintree led by Morrison and Waid.

    I wanted to ask how you see that working and if there are any current example of the look and feel of that. I worry that the emphasis of distant lonely alien will get us the Snyder MOS Supes and I wondered if OI misinterpreted.

  3. #78
    Mighty Member Johnny Thunders!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    WGBS
    Posts
    1,951

    Default

    For me the Byrne Superman was just so different than his X-Men and Fantastic Four. The FF seemed like a loving update of all the silver age pageantry and the X-Men was the most cosmic love story ever. I was expecting that for Superman and it ended up being something much more grounded.

    As to Superman being the identity and how does that not lead to the distant lonely alien? I think being Superman means he is much more empathetic than most people because he doesn't suffer from fear and vulnerability. Being invulnerable allows him to be more connected since being close doesn't mean being threatened.

  4. #79
    Mighty Member Johnny Thunders!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    WGBS
    Posts
    1,951

    Default

    Its the Grant Morrison idea!

  5. #80
    Standing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    14,446

    Default

    Some writers want to be arm-chair psychologists, but they probably never studied it in school. The idea that there's more than one personality struggling for dominance in Superman's make-up is the sort of cheap psycho-analysis that Lucy van Pelt would be ashamed to hand out.

    He's a person--sometimes he's dressed up in a suit and tie and works in an office, sometimes he puts on his P.J.s and goes to bed, sometimes he wears the red S and helps out others. There's no big mental conflict that he suffers for doing these different things in the day.

    People don't go mental because sometimes they take the bus to their job and sometimes they lay on a beach drinking ice tea. You don't have to give Superman a neurosis just because he compartmentalizes the various things he's called upon to do. He's a well-adjusted super-hero.
    🇨🇦
    [Exit, pursued
    by a bear.

  6. #81
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    7,222

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanlos View Post
    There is a lot of discussion of the primacy Supes or Clark and a lot seem to like the idea of Clark as a shell to lead in to Supes adventures with Supes being the authentic persona. I notice that was a point in the pitch posted in the thread from the millennium Braintree led by Morrison and Waid.

    I wanted to ask how you see that working and if there are any current example of the look and feel of that. I worry that the emphasis of distant lonely alien will get us the Snyder MOS Supes and I wondered if OI misinterpreted.
    The “problem” with Clark being the “real” identity is that if Clark is the “real” identity, that means he needs to be brave and tough and driven because that’s who Superman is at his core. But that also means that there’s virtually no difference between the two identities anymore, which as others have pointed out, was basically how George Reeves played it. That’s a perfectly valid take to be fair. As for why some of us might prefer otherwise, here’s a good summary from Dispenser’s tumblr: https://davidmann95.tumblr.com/post/...the-old-debate

    However the best take and the one I personally prescribe to for both Supes and Bats is that both are “real” in that both identities express different aspects of the core person Clark and Bruce are.

  7. #82
    Extraordinary Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    5,380

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The “problem” with Clark being the “real” identity is that if Clark is the “real” identity, that means he needs to be brave and tough and driven because that’s who Superman is at his core. But that also means that there’s virtually no difference between the two identities anymore, which as others have pointed out, was basically how George Reeves played it. That’s a perfectly valid take to be fair. As for why some of us might prefer otherwise, here’s a good summary from Dispenser’s tumblr: https://davidmann95.tumblr.com/post/...the-old-debate

    However the best take and the one I personally prescribe to for both Supes and Bats is that both are “real” in that both identities express different aspects of the core person Clark and Bruce are.
    The way I like it is to have it be a triple identity

    There is Clark Kent, the human persona.
    There is Kal-El, the alien Persona
    And there is Superman, the synthesis of the above

  8. #83
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    60,441

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The “problem” with Clark being the “real” identity is that if Clark is the “real” identity, that means he needs to be brave and tough and driven because that’s who Superman is at his core. But that also means that there’s virtually no difference between the two identities anymore, which as others have pointed out, was basically how George Reeves played it. That’s a perfectly valid take to be fair. As for why some of us might prefer otherwise, here’s a good summary from Dispenser’s tumblr: https://davidmann95.tumblr.com/post/...the-old-debate

    However the best take and the one I personally prescribe to for both Supes and Bats is that both are “real” in that both identities express different aspects of the core person Clark and Bruce are.
    I think there's Clark Kent the affectation, Clark Kent as who he is deep down, Kal-El that is his alien side, and Superman that kind of merges all of that together under a confident, steadfast, persona.

  9. #84
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    6,126

    Default

    This idea that Superman is just a mixture of his other sides is false. Superman is the real clark kent. He is the protagonist. The guy with glasses is just a comic act. Kal el is just his kryptonIan name. Some versions have perfect recall.In tHat case,superman is the real kal el and clark kent is his human name. Having said that, each identity has a domain. The emphasis on each gives different stories. Not clark kent and "how human he is". Not kal el and "how alien he is". Its about the "champion of the oppressed".

  10. #85
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    1,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    This idea that Superman is just a mixture of his other sides is false. Superman is the real clark kent. He is the protagonist. The guy with glasses is just a comic act. Kal el is just his kryptonIan name. Some versions have perfect recall.In tHat case,superman is the real kal el and clark kent is his human name. Having said that, each identity has a domain. The emphasis on each gives different stories. Not clark kent and "how human he is". Not kal el and "how alien he is". Its about the "champion of the oppressed".
    Hmmmm. How do you find Bendis move to eliminate the Clark identity? Do you feel it free him to be the champion of the oppressed full time a la Rucka WW with the ambassador thing?

  11. #86
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    6,126

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanlos View Post
    Hmmmm. How do you find Bendis move to eliminate the Clark identity? Do you feel it free him to be the champion of the oppressed full time a la Rucka WW with the ambassador thing?
    The fake one with glasses?I mean, the humour has been lost for ages. You don't see clark winking at camera under the glasses. Do you? You don't get the slapstick or physical humour that fake identity provided. They are seriously explaining it, as if its explainable. It's an absurd joke. Moreover, superman is superman full time. He just hides his superness behind the veil of mundanity and fakery that is clark kent glasses persona. Clark or kal is super, in every way. I mean, he is superman when he is writing his articles and exposing the corrupt. He is superman when he is creating his secret citadel and collecting artifacts. Yet, these two actions can be compartmentalised into the domains of clark kent identity and kal el identity. Superman is the all encompassing identity. It was a title given to clark kent or kal el by the people (depending on the verison).So, unless they can make it work. I don't mind it being gone for now. Glasses persona is for humour primarily.

    Having said all that, the "aw! Shucks!" farmboy thing is fake clark kent's personality. Not superman's. Look at the above pic. "aw! Shucks!" mild-mannered behaviour is done by fake clark kent persona.Superman is "disguised as a mild mannered reporter clark kent".Superman is confident, cool, debonair.. Etc
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 11-25-2020 at 10:07 PM.

  12. #87
    Fantastic Member Menacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    335

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    Grant Morrison hands down.

    All Star Superman is like the one book you can shoot off into space and when an alien civilization finds it they will know who and what Superman stood for.
    I really need someone to explain to me what is the appeal of this book.

    Let me preface that question with.

    I'm a massive Morrison fan.
    I love his new52 ac run.
    Morrison has other incredible work like Multiversity and Final Crisis...

    Then there's All Star Superman, one of the most pointed to go to stories by this community and seems commonly reveared.

    Let me also say I read primarly Superman in the 90s as a teenager ... then stopped. Since about 2016 I've been reading steady.

    I avoided buying All Star cause I hated the art, specifically that superman appears to be wearing a diaper and sweat pants in that rendition...

    Eventually I bought it at a used book store.

    Totally shocked at how basic and lame the story was. Visit to luthor, some demonstrations of strength, weird episode on bizarro world... not much going on...

    The Animated movie helped me enjoy the story more, but they refined a dud...

    Honestly it wasnt that bad, other then the art..



    Its just so so so hyped and I cant imagine why.

    I'd never point to such a basic story, as the best story of all time...

    Not trying to be rude but what do fan boys see in this particular story?

    So many great books, with great art... and this is everyones crown jewel???

    I voted Jurgens... but at least 5 or so of those names deserve big props.

    Morrison is definitely one of them

  13. #88
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    6,126

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Menacer View Post
    I'm a massive Morrison fan.
    I love his new52 ac run.
    I am more new52 ac run fan than all star myself.I believe, all star is known for the portrayal of sheer compassion/vulnerability, laid backness, thoughtfulness.. Etc that clark shows to people. Atleast quietly had put some meat into Clark's design. As if strongmen are supposed to be chiseled like greek gods. I disagree, jurgens writes a good postcrisis superman. He just doesn't get other versions. He can't write an overpowered sun god nor the working class champion.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 11-26-2020 at 08:12 PM.

  14. #89
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    3,080

    Default

    I put down Other, for Joe Kelly.

    He’s the only writer who’s TPB’s I’ve gone out of my way to track down, I love the way he and Ferry handled B13 Metropolis, both businessman and President Luthor, and he wrote “What So Funny About...”.

    Plus, his Superboy run was my favorite after Kessel.

    The guy wrote a Superman I cared about, a Lois I loved to read, and could flit between hilarious and inspiring with much greater frequency, I respect Morrison’s work, but I’m always turned cold by his particular style, and Johns and several others just run afoul of how bored I got reading the Pre-Crisis collection at my library. I’m an unabashed Post-Crisis fan, what can I say.
    Franchise Wars Podcast and YouTube Host.
    TITANS pilot Recap, Reaction, and Review video! https://youtu.be/l1tKBTUtiyM
    The Force Awakens vs The Last Jedi https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/...=2&i=408109126
    Teen Titans (03) vs Teen Titans Go! https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/...=2&i=400482734

  15. #90
    Astonishing Member Robanker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    4,597

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    I disagree, jurgens writes a good postcrisis superman. He just doesn't get other versions. He can't write an overpowered sun god nor the working class champion.
    That's pretty fair. I think his greatest strengths come from a Superman who is more grounded in Kansas than the Cosmos.

    To be entirely honest, there are very few writers who could feasibly write those three iterations well. Most specialize. That's not a dig, either, because each require completely different skillsets and sensibilities. To wit, Morrison is on the short list of being able to write any, though I'd argue his Post Crisis Superman is probably the weakest of the three under his pen, which likely betrays which is his least favorite take.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •