Amazing Spider-Man 53 Discussion

[Vortex85]

...
No, I'm talking about the life tablet, that was a story point which started in the FCBD special and wasn't resolved until 40 issues later, where it was barely mentioned. What about the Ned Leeds Clone and his warning about Betty Brant? That plot point just seems to be forgotten about.
The underuse of the supporting cast too, I would like to see more with these characters. One of my favourite arcs was the two parter where Peter hung out with Boomerang. That was a lot of fun, I'd like to see more of that.

I do like the run, I like it a lot, but I feel like with most things, People feel way too strongly about it. What I'm getting from this is just a fun run which tackles the darker aspects of Spider-man storytelling and addresses a story from 15 years ago.

I don't know how much longer Spencer has on the book, from the ways things have been going, I'd say he doesn't plan to stay on it for too long. Right now all the plot points seem to be coming to a close. I'm hoping the next thing to be addressed will be the Betty Brant thing, I don't know when we'll see it however....

So in interviews Spencer indicated his run in continuing through 2021 and beyond. Also of note is that he explicitly stated all those "forgotton" plot points will be expanded on and continued post-Last Remains.

Further, Spencer's first interview from 2018 indicates he had planed his entire run on the book in meticulous detail from start to finish. So I don't this his run is near done nor are any plot points forgotten.

[NC_Yankee]

Totally agree. Spencer is probably well aware how unpopular that OMD/BND transition was (Slott was as well... the difference is Spencer actually cares and is taking steps to address it). I don't think it's "trolling." I think all this OMD/BND stuff is coming to a head soon. Whether that means it's undone, I don't know. Maybe it'll be technically undone, but so much time has passed Peter and MJ won't get remarried.

I really hope I am wrong, but I do not see the marriage coming back until at least after ASM 1000 if ever. My biggest problem with the entire storyline of Kindred, is the missed opportunities. Not just getting rid of OMD ( especially after Mephisto died and the entire reasoning behind it also is dead ( thank you Miles)), but I also do not think he has enough time to clean up some of the unresolved questions such as Mysterio and the movie, MJ not telling Peter about it, Neds warning about Betty and Carlies place in all of this. I would also note the fact that Spencer has been at this for over two years so opening up more plot holes is unnecessary ( especially when he could have used ASM 52-53 to start answering unresolved questions )

[Revolutionary_Jack]

The way you described it makes Marvel sound so dumb and simplistic while DC knows what they're doing lol.

Just different priorities. Marvel characters tend to be more melodramatic as a rule than DC characters. No matter what happens to Batman, he's never gonna be in a situation where he loses his fortune, his company, or gets chased out of Gotham. So the stories have to center around him, rather than through him if that makes any sense. So the stories are arranged as a display to show Batman and his skills and that lends to mystery stories and other stuff. Whereas Marvel characters are centered on personal drama and stakes for the most part -- Daredevil, Spider-Man, X-Men.

So that's why Marvel on the whole follows Rorschach approach "f--k around and stumble into stuff and then get out of a mess I could have avoided or lessened".

As for the issue itself, everyone is down on it, but I thought the twisted reinterpretation of the BND birthday scene was pretty cool. And c'mon, why would that be included unless OMD was being undone soon. Otherwise that's such a random scene.

I mean even a weak issue can have cool moments. The flashback was well done (and a case where the flashback scene is better than the original). As is the "Gotcha!" bit.

Totally agree. Spencer is probably well aware how unpopular that OMD/BND transition was (Slott was as well... the difference is Spencer actually cares and is taking steps to address it). I don't think it's "trolling." I think all this OMD/BND stuff is coming to a head soon. Whether that means it's undone, I don't know. Maybe it'll be technically undone, but so much time has passed Peter and MJ won't get remarried.

Let's see where it goes.

[WebSlingWonder]

So, I re-read the issue with the context in mind and perhaps I jumped the gun a bit in my criticism. I do like the horror vibe and the creepiness of the same party being made to be a hellish environment. It certainly fits. So this was a dope way to have Peter find out the reveal. It's just with #50 in mind, it falls flat for us, the reader.

Still, my questions aren't answered and probably won't be answered for a while. So I would give this a 7/10, saved only by the horror tone and the artwork.

[NC_Yankee]

Just different priorities. Marvel characters tend to be more melodramatic as a rule than DC characters. No matter what happens to Batman, he's never gonna be in a situation where he loses his fortune, his company, or gets chased out of Gotham. So the stories have to center around him, rather than through him if that makes any sense. So the stories are arranged as a display to show Batman and his skills and that lends to mystery stories and other stuff. Whereas Marvel characters are centered on personal drama and stakes for the most part -- Daredevil, Spider-Man, X-Men.

So that's why Marvel on the whole follows Rorschach approach "f--k around and stumble into stuff and then get out of a mess I could have avoided or lessened".



I mean even a weak issue can have cool moments. The flashback was well done (and a case where the flashback scene is better than the original). As is the "Gotcha!" bit.



Let's see where it goes.

I was just looking at the solicits and Amazing 60 looks interesting and promising. Maybe I was a bit too harsh. We will see.

[Vortex85]

So, I re-read the issue with the context in mind and perhaps I jumped the gun a bit in my criticism. I do like the horror vibe and the creepiness of the same party being made to be a hellish environment. It certainly fits. So this was a dope way to have Peter find out the reveal. It's just with #50 in mind, it falls flat for us, the reader.

Still, my questions aren't answered and probably won't be answered for a while. So I would give this a 7/10, saved only by the horror tone and the artwork.

I prefer the reveal to be multi-issue and happen like peeling back the layers of an onion. After all these years dreaming about it and waiting, you don't really want it done through simple exposition in one issue.

Then it's done and over... and you can't go back and redo it.

So doing it in layers and showing scenes like this is much more interesting than just saying, "Hey Peter, I'm Harry, you know you made a deal with Mephisto and wiped out your marriage. I'm also pissed and here is why"

I like the idea that Harry wants to slowly give Peter hints until Peter confesses it and doesn't have to be told. That would be cool to see.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

So, I re-read the issue with the context in mind and perhaps I jumped the gun a bit in my criticism. I do like the horror vibe and the creepiness of the same party being made to be a hellish environment. It certainly fits. So this was a dope way to have Peter find out the reveal. It's just with #50 in mind, it falls flat for us, the reader.

Still, my questions aren't answered and probably won't be answered for a while. So I would give this a 7/10, saved only by the horror tone and the artwork.

It is genuinely a weaker issue compared to the stuff that came until now, so the disappointment I get.

But I am glad you found something interesting there nevertheless.

[Krakoa]

No matter what happens to Batman, he's never gonna be in a situation where he loses his fortune, his company.

Isn't this literally the current Batman status quo lol

[WebSlingWonder]

I prefer the reveal to be multi-issue and happen like peeling back the layers of an onion. After all these years dreaming about it and waiting, you don't really want it done through simple exposition in one issue.

Then it's done and over... and you can't go back and redo it.

So doing it in layers and showing scenes like this is much more interesting than just saying, "Hey Peter, I'm Harry, you know you made a deal with Mephisto and wiped out your marriage. I'm also pissed and here is why"

I like the idea that Harry wants to slowly give Peter hints until Peter confesses it and doesn't have to be told. That would be cool to see.

It is genuinely a weaker issue compared to the stuff that came until now, so the disappointment I get.

But I am glad you found something interesting there nevertheless.

Indeed, I agree with you both. But...I think this is seriously where I'm hanging up my hat. I'm just not as invested in superhero comics anymore, and, while I am sad to not see how this story ends, I think this is where I'm going to get off.

So, I'm leaving Spider-Man and I'm leaving the forum. Good luck, guys.

[NC_Yankee]

Indeed, I agree with you both. But...I think this is seriously where I'm hanging up my hat. I'm just not as invested in superhero comics anymore, and, while I am sad to not see how this story ends, I think this is where I'm going to get off.

So, I'm leaving Spider-Man and I'm leaving the forum. Good luck, guys.

I was going to leave after 56, but I like the cover of 60. If however I do not like the results I am finished as well

[Vortex85]

Indeed, I agree with you both. But...I think this is seriously where I'm hanging up my hat. I'm just not as invested in superhero comics anymore, and, while I am sad to not see how this story ends, I think this is where I'm going to get off.

So, I'm leaving Spider-Man and I'm leaving the forum. Good luck, guys.

LOL, ok. Whatever floats your boat.

[Webhead]

I think the unmasking is just a metaphor or a dramatic way for Harry to reveal himself. Guy can get into people's dreams, control vermin, get in and out of Hell and survive being punched through the chest, he might as well decide changing his face into a mask and then taking it off was the way to go.

Still, even assuming Harry deserved Hell in the first place, he has to have someone powering him up. So who is it?

[RD155]

I think the unmasking is just a metaphor or a dramatic way for Harry to reveal himself. Guy can get into people's dreams, control vermin, get in and out of Hell and survive being punched through the chest, he might as well decide changing his face into a mask and then taking it off was the way to go.

Still, even assuming Harry deserved Hell in the first place, he has to have someone powering him up. So who is it?

I was under the impression that we were just all going with Mephisto being behind his powers. At least I’m hoping that’s the case. I’ve heard some suspicions of Mysterio being behind it....However, I think it’s a safe bet to assume that Kindreds powers are being “funded” by Mephisto.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I prefer the reveal to be multi-issue and happen like peeling back the layers of an onion. After all these years dreaming about it and waiting, you don't really want it done through simple exposition in one issue.

Then it's done and over... and you can't go back and redo it.

So doing it in layers and showing scenes like this is much more interesting than just saying, "Hey Peter, I'm Harry, you know you made a deal with Mephisto and wiped out your marriage. I'm also pissed and here is why"

I like the idea that Harry wants to slowly give Peter hints until Peter confesses it and doesn't have to be told. That would be cool to see.

And again there are great runs for comics that set up a big reveal that lands like a lead balloon and it doesn't diminish it.

Grant Morrison's New X-Men is a landmark run all built to a conclusion (Planet X, Here Comes Tomorrow) that were controversial and huge letdowns when it happened. People still value that run for the early issues.

[RD155]

I prefer the reveal to be multi-issue and happen like peeling back the layers of an onion. After all these years dreaming about it and waiting, you don't really want it done through simple exposition in one issue.

Then it's done and over... and you can't go back and redo it.

So doing it in layers and showing scenes like this is much more interesting than just saying, "Hey Peter, I'm Harry, you know you made a deal with Mephisto and wiped out your marriage. I'm also pissed and here is why"

I like the idea that Harry wants to slowly give Peter hints until Peter confesses it and doesn't have to be told. That would be cool to see.

Agree and disagree to an extent.

First off, after letting the emotions sit a bit and going back to read the last issue, it was much better the second time around. The problems I’m having with the pacing and so on, are still there but...Spencer still has me waiting in anticipation to see what comes next.

I think the issue at hand is that the story has just gone on too long without much progression. Decompression is fine in some cases but comics aren’t the main focus for a lot of people nowadays especially considering all the chaos running wild through out the nation. For me personally, I need story progression and I feel that much of that hasn’t happened in the past issues. It has less to do with the length of time the mystery is taking to unravel and more to do with not much happening in the issues.

I do think the “confession” angle is the way to go. For whatever reason, I do feel that Peter confessing and remembering what’s happened would be more satisfying to the readers then for Kindred to just reveal everything.

Personally for me, I’m just waiting for the first acknowledgment of the “marriage” from Peter and MJ. What I am worried about is Spencer “co-signing” with the powers that be at Marvel and having the “deal” portrayed as a heroic decision when in actuality it was one of the more out of character cowardly selfish moves Spider-Man has ever made.