SPOILERS: Fantastic Four #26

[jackolover]

My own impression of this issue is, where does this fit in? Is it before or after King in Black? This seems to be a very complicated story now that Griever has appeared, so I don’t see her getting beat in one issue. They needed the whole assembly of Avengers last time to beat her. Is it going to be that simple again?

But non-mutant Franklin? I don’t really have an opinion on it. Mutant, not a mutant, makes no difference to me. It’s not an issue.

The rushed return of the Power Pack and Future Foundation, just to scatter than around without a debriefing, was grating.

Just like Lyja as a confrontation to Sky and the two alien children, was rushed and obscure. What does Lyja have to do with Johnny or the children?

There’s no mention of Doom and the Black hole? Some of this seems to be just like sticato writing - jumbled together with no reflection on continuity. Maybe it’s just me.

[Journey]

I just really don't get why a plot point that's had practically no relevance until this year to produce a **** mini series, is all of a sudden so important to people, all this does is take Franklin off a list nothing is truly lost from this retcon I approve of it honestly.

[Thundershot]

The rushed return of the Power Pack and Future Foundation, just to scatter than around without a debriefing, was grating.

Just like Lyja as a confrontation to Sky and the two alien children, was rushed and obscure. What does Lyja have to do with Johnny or the children?

The Future Foundation breaking up is quick and sad. They spend 5+ years together and are broken up in twelve seconds. At least we get Dragon Man, Bentley, and Lyja out of it. Hopefully they don’t get their characterization trashed.


As for Lyja... N’Kalla has made mention many times that she knew Alicia. The Skrulls had Alicia imprisoned for a few years (or months in Marvel time) while Lyja was impersonating her and marrying Johnny, so it’s probably an untold tale we’re going to get.

[cmore]

I don’t see Johnny Storm taking the same attitude to Lyja raping him as you are. Johnny doesn’t see Lyja as an abuser, and just gets on with the relationship. Maybe Johnny is an idiot, or just a dill, because he sure doesn't have the same definition of rapist as you have. The rest of the FF should be ostracising Lyja, more for Secret Invasion FF, for sending the kids to the Negative Zone.

If you want to categorise Lyja, I’d say she has a mental health issue, because she doesn’t have the moral compass of a human. She manipulates a lover, (using Skrull morality by the way, by shape changing - think about that), and, Lyja attacks who she should consider allies in the FF. She shouldn’t be trusted from that standpoint.

Don't forget, there was another victim in this plot besides Johnny. Lyja was also complicit in the kidnapping and imprisonment of Alicia. In some ways, what she did to Alicia was worse than what happened to Johnny. The poor woman was left in suspended animation for months while everyone else was just going on with their lives. Lyja apparently had no qualms about Alicia spending the rest of her life hooked up to a machine while she spent hers living happily ever after as Johnny's wife.

Judging by their reactions, it certainly doesn't look like the Grimm family trusts her. The kids were so upset that Alicia had to take them home, and Ben looked like he was hoping for a good excuse to clobber her.

[Triniking1234]

Slott was also aware of the reaction to his unpopular (for us anyway) handling of Dr Doom. I don't take this as a "oops, guess I was wrong" conclusion, just that "I heard your complaints". The historic context of Slott's plans for Franklin seem to invalidate the relative importance of FF/X-Men. It's very possible that the talks about Franklin might very well have been true (God, am i being cynical here) as having a huge tie between the FF and the X-universe could be awkward to whatever Hickman's plans for the mutant island are.

As has been said, Xavier could be pulling some crap of his own. I'm not sure where this is going, but there is no way Franklin's not getting repowered at some point. His mutant status was only really important to the X-franchise. As far as the FF are concerned, mutated human/mutant really doesn't matter. Having connected with the X-franchise since Secret wars (2015) makes this development kind of weak sauce, but for personal growth/development for Franklin, it can work. The weakest part of this development is the turning off of Franklin's X-gene when his powers gave out. That would make it a constant masking as opposed to a permanent change. After all, the universes Franklin created all still exist and certainly creating a universe is far harder than changing your own genetic patter. But there is probaly some comic-book science explanation for this.

People were giving Slott grief for his Doctor Doom. They do realize that's mostly Marvel's fault since they had the guy running around as Iron Man's BFF under Bendis and then when Bendis jumped ship, they wanted his villain status quo back so whoever was taking over FF had to do the deed.

So it's just more Slott having to clean up previous writers' nonsense.

I can understand Slott taking away the mutant card since people were saying stupidness like "Just kill him and resurrect him" so he eliminated that so he can get his story. We'll see what happens when it concludes.

I'm not sure why someone called Franklin obnoxious. I only remember him from his Power Pack days when he was a cute little boy. Also, he is a teenager so maybe give him a break, huh?

Because all the complainers only started reading FF with Slott's run.

[CaptCleghorn]

People were giving Slott grief for his Doctor Doom. They do realize that's mostly Marvel's fault since they had the guy running around as Iron Man's BFF under Bendis and then when Bendis jumped ship, they wanted his villain status quo back so whoever was taking over FF had to do the deed.

So it's just more Slott having to clean up previous writers' nonsense.

I can understand Slott taking away the mutant card since people were saying stupidness like "Just kill him and resurrect him" so he eliminated that so he can get his story. We'll see what happens when it concludes.

Even accepting Marvel pushed for Doom to swing over to the villain side, the handling of Doom made him seem like a pure mustache twirling black hat wearing villain and not the nuanced Doom we've seen in so many other places. The complaints (many were mine) were about Doom forgetting any lessons or developments he learned after Secret Wars and Infamous Iron Man. I think most of the complainant would be OK with Doom being sa bad guy, but one who didn't cackle like Dick Dasterdly. The jobbing of Galactus was also a point that was mentioned.

Because all the complainers only started reading FF with Slott's run.

Franklin became a teenager in Stott's run. Teenage boys can be pains in the ass. This is one of the strongest parts of Slott's writing IMHO. His Franklin is great. Often unlikable, but well-written.

[Triniking1234]

Even accepting Marvel pushed for Doom to swing over to the villain side, the handling of Doom made him seem like a pure mustache twirling black hat wearing villain and not the nuanced Doom we've seen in so many other places. The complaints (many were mine) were about Doom forgetting any lessons or developments he learned after Secret Wars and Infamous Iron Man. I think most of the complainant would be OK with Doom being sa bad guy, but one who didn't cackle like Dick Dasterdly. The jobbing of Galactus was also a point that was mentioned.



Franklin became a teenager in Stott's run. Teenage boys can be pains in the ass. This is one of the strongest parts of Slott's writing IMHO. His Franklin is great. Often unlikable, but well-written.

I can't disagree with that being one of the victims of that story although some stuff is added that he's just doing it for an ego boost since he was being depressed when Victorious (forgot her civilian name) found him.

Poor Galactus tho.

I didn't want to mention other users but people were saying Franklin was always "egotistical and obnoxious". Like what books did you read for that?

[Hypestyle]

My own impression of this issue is, where does this fit in? Is it before or after King in Black? This seems to be a very complicated story now that Griever has appeared, so I don’t see her getting beat in one issue. They needed the whole assembly of Avengers last time to beat her. Is it going to be that simple again?

But non-mutant Franklin? I don’t really have an opinion on it. Mutant, not a mutant, makes no difference to me. It’s not an issue.

The rushed return of the Power Pack and Future Foundation, just to scatter than around without a debriefing, was grating.

Just like Lyja as a confrontation to Sky and the two alien children, was rushed and obscure. What does Lyja have to do with Johnny or the children?

There’s no mention of Doom and the Black hole? Some of this seems to be just like sticato writing - jumbled together with no reflection on continuity. Maybe it’s just me.

when did Franklin become a non-mutant? and why, really?

[BAS]

Slott's FF run seems like a literal slap in the face to Hickman and his very impactful FF-Avengers-Secret Wars run.

In short order he -

• Killed off the Molecule Man
  Sidelined the Future Foundation
  Reverted Doom back to his 'Richards must pay' mode
  De-powered and de-mutant-ed Franklin

The most blatant of which is the Franklin retcon. Hickman's Krakoan Mutants saga had an ongoing subplot of various council members vying for control of Franklin's Omega level power, plus the additional conflict between Reed and Xavier built up since HoX/PoX. All that has been rendered meaningless with one page of dialogue in this issue.

Way to go Dan!

[danielsan52]

Slott's FF run seems like a literal slap in the face to Hickman and his very impactful FF-Avengers-Secret Wars run.

In short order he -

• Killed off the Molecule Man
  Sidelined the Future Foundation
  Reverted Doom back to his 'Richards must pay' mode
  De-powered and de-mutant-ed Franklin

The most blatant of which is the Franklin retcon. Hickman's Krakoan Mutants saga had an ongoing subplot of various council members vying for control of Franklin's Omega level power, plus the additional conflict between Reed and Xavier built up since HoX/PoX. All that has been rendered meaningless with one page of dialogue in this issue.

Way to go Dan!

Works for me!! I hated Hickman's FF!

[Noek]

Slott's FF run seems like a literal slap in the face to Hickman and his very impactful FF-Avengers-Secret Wars run.

In short order he -

• Killed off the Molecule Man
  Sidelined the Future Foundation
  Reverted Doom back to his 'Richards must pay' mode
  De-powered and de-mutant-ed Franklin

The most blatant of which is the Franklin retcon. Hickman's Krakoan Mutants saga had an ongoing subplot of various council members vying for control of Franklin's Omega level power, plus the additional conflict between Reed and Xavier built up since HoX/PoX. All that has been rendered meaningless with one page of dialogue in this issue.

Way to go Dan!

So the person who is writing the Fantastic Four has to get approval from the X corner to do what they want with their characters cause they may have an arc/storyline in mind.

[Snoop Dogg]

now that franklin isn't a mutant we can focus on the thing that makes him truly special, being a young caucasian male in an american comic book

[Triniking1234]

The most blatant of which is the Franklin retcon. Hickman's Krakoan Mutants saga had an ongoing subplot of various council members vying for control of Franklin's Omega level power, plus the additional conflict between Reed and Xavier built up since HoX/PoX. All that has been rendered meaningless with one page of dialogue in this issue.

Way to go Dan!

So Hickman teased that the X-Men were gonna burn their bridges with the FF and Slott accelerated that **** by nuking the bridges.

Good.

now that franklin isn't a mutant we can focus on the thing that makes him truly special, being a young caucasian male in an american comic book

He's actually a manga character but he used his powers to become a Marvel character.

[CaptCleghorn]

He's actually a manga character but he used his powers to become a Marvel character.

Everyone knows that. It was done to prevent the Goku vs. Franklin crap that was going to break the interwebs.

[Billy Maximoff]

Slott's FF run seems like a literal slap in the face to Hickman and his very impactful FF-Avengers-Secret Wars run.

In short order he -

• Killed off the Molecule Man
  Sidelined the Future Foundation
  Reverted Doom back to his 'Richards must pay' mode
  De-powered and de-mutant-ed Franklin

The most blatant of which is the Franklin retcon. Hickman's Krakoan Mutants saga had an ongoing subplot of various council members vying for control of Franklin's Omega level power, plus the additional conflict between Reed and Xavier built up since HoX/PoX. All that has been rendered meaningless with one page of dialogue in this issue.

Way to go Dan!

Basically my thoughts on this whole dillema.