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  1. #16
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cool Thatguy View Post
    SpOck didn't shack up with Mary Jane, in fairness. He started a relationship with a woman who didn't know Peter at all.

    Still skeevy, mind, but at least they tried
    He was trying to shack up with MJ though. The only reason he didn't wasn't an issue of consent but because he felt she was endangered from him being Spider-Man (thanks in part to Ghost Peter).

  2. #17
    Astonishing Member Ptrvc's Avatar
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    Forced telepathy is basically rape in and of itself.

  3. #18
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    Pretty much any relationship founded on coercion, deception and manipulation is a violation of consent.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member mugiwara's Avatar
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    So, if the Thing pretended to be an aryan to have sex with the nazi Warrior Woman, would that count as rape?
    Bringing back the old, killing the young: that's the Marvel way

  5. #20
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    There has to be a line with deception.

    A married guy that picks up a side woman but tells her heís single. This is a cruddy thing to do.

    Itís deception but definitely not rape.

  6. #21
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mugiwara View Post
    So, if the Thing pretended to be an aryan to have sex with the nazi Warrior Woman, would that count as rape?
    ...What ?

  7. #22

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    Is there a difference lying about yourself and pretending to be someone else in order to have sex with someone? The latter seems worse to me than the first, but I don't have a supporting reason for this decision.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Is there a difference lying about yourself and pretending to be someone else in order to have sex with someone? The latter seems worse to me than the first, but I don't have a supporting reason for this decision.
    Eh, lying about your job or weight isn't the same as pretending to be someone else entirely. Because, ya know, you're impersonating a person.

  9. #24
    Incredible Member OopsIdiditagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Is there a difference lying about yourself and pretending to be someone else in order to have sex with someone? The latter seems worse to me than the first, but I don't have a supporting reason for this decision.
    Having sex with someone while they think you are a different person is considered rape irl.
    Last edited by OopsIdiditagain; 11-24-2020 at 04:27 PM.
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  10. #25
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    Consent in media his the same as in reality, just because they're fiction isn't a reason to think they ren't actual peerople. The whole point in stories is to emotionally connect with these characters because they're like people. Cultural change shifts, so behaviour that was overlooked in periods like the 80's aren't as acceptable now and there are creators who have values that don't square with the mainstream cultural trends because they're individuals who have their own value systems that will influence their work. It's why adults who were kids in the 80's accepted when someone in "Revenge of the Nerds" posed as a jock boyfriend and had sex with their girlfriend and are appalled now, and the fact that story had the girl being ok with it isn't something which happens in real life.

  11. #26
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    When it comes to shape-shifters, I think there are at least two definite scenarios that I would count as rape. First one is of course that they pretend to be a specific person with whom the victim has a some kind of previous relationship. I would include pretending to be a celebrity to that group. The second scenario is that shape-shifter uses their ability to have sex with someone they know without that person knowing.
    Last edited by Papa Moai; 11-25-2020 at 09:08 AM.

  12. #27
    C&D was my gateway From The Shadows's Avatar
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    Nightcrawler didn't know he was having sex with his foster sister for the first 5 years of his relationship (friends ok with it and everything). So... What does that mean? But yes, writers just like to be shocking and don't think. But seem to overthink at other times if you get my drift.

  13. #28
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    We the readers sometimes overthink as well, reading into things that just aren't there or were never intended in the first place. And to be clear...just because one person interprets something in a particular way, as valid to that person as that interpretation may be, does not make it fact.
    We are MUTANT...One people. One tribe. One family...Krakoa and Arakko, FOREVER!!!

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Pretty much any relationship founded on coercion, deception and manipulation is a violation of consent.
    That can't be that true. A lot of relationships are based on that. I mean Scott and Emma was born through her deception/manipulation. Sabretooth and Birdie? Moondragon and Thor? Shaw and the various women of the hellfire club.

    Then there was that time Hawkeye raped the Scarlet Witch since she didn't know who she was and it was his shot at banging all the avenger women realized. (Since she was with vision mostly he just had to take that chance). Which I guess the writers realized that was bad and retconned her into a robot and relocated her to having Doom raping the real Wanda. Because reasons. Still, since Marvel "robots" are sentient beings as well usually, I'm not so sure that Clint got off the hook on that debacle.

  15. #30
    Amazing Member Toonstrack's Avatar
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    Its hard to put strict parameters on this because even in the real world during courtship we tend to play up our strengths and downplay our flaws, dress up our best and act on our best behavior in order to win the prize. Thag isnt rape but its definitely a form of manipulation, its just widely known and accepted as everyone naturally will do that, even if the prize isn't necessarily sex. It happens at job interviews, contests and etc.

    So when you introduce societies that have mind readers and shape shifters and their culture is literally defined by those things, do you apply our own version of consent onto them?

    What about spies? They lie, steal murder and kill for the mission, so why wouldn't they commit sexual acts if it meant success? Why would Mystique do that? Or Widow in hrr early days?

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